Louis Leblanc with the vets

[Monctonscout]

Time for LL to prove he can play with the big boys this season as replacement for injury, otherwise he burnt all the bridges for me already.

I don't see any particular talent other than slightly above average hockey IQ, and since he's soft I don't want him locked up on our bottom lines for multiple years (aren't you guys tired of guys like friggin Tom Pyatt, Jeff Halpern, Enqvist, baby soft players with good hockey heads, well Halpern's a bit stronger, but you got my point). He's too slow and dosen't have top 6 potential.

I'd hope for a good season to showcase him as 3rd liner PK specialist and then trade for picks. Or that he makes me eat crow, then I'll be the happiest Habs fan around.

Not sure where you get that LL is soft? I have seen him play at each level the last 4+ years and "soft" is never a word I would use to define him. In fact he's been a guy that's usually been strong in 1 on 1 battles and stuck his nose in there, even as a 20 year old in the NHL he did not look physically overmatched despite being lighter(180lbs or therebouts) than most players.

 

[11Goat11]

It makes no sense for him to be at the rookie camp, it's been like 5 years since he was drafted.

Bergevin is basically saying this is your chance kid, show your stuff and prove you are an NHL player. With the injuries going into the year he might get a 10 game stint. I liked his game 2 years ago when he was on the big team, smart player who was pretty good along the boards. Seems like a guy who could be useful in the playoffs.

LL does seem like he was born with a silver spoon in his mouth though and got by on talent alone. Hopefully last year was a wakeup call and forces him to re-evaluate his priorities.

 

[MXD]

Agendas.....that's the new "classy". Everybody has agendas. 1 main agenda though is to see this team finally be relevant and win. I guess everything else is minor. But definition of being a fan is not to be always able to be methodical and logical. You become a fan and it comes with emotions and strong opinions.

That's the thing...
If Leblanc can contribute something, then good.
But for that, he has to get a chance to contribute. That might or might not happen this season, for factors that aren't necessarily in Leblanc's control.
This year, he must bounce back in Hamilton and, if called up as an injury-replacement, show he can play good sound hockey, probably on the third line.
Some may be rebutted to have him play on the 3rd line (due to not having great size and not being extremely physical), but logically, our 3rd RW should be Brian Gionta at this point, who isn't big or extremely physical either.

 

[MXD]

LL does seem like he was born with a silver spoon in his mouth though and got by on talent alone. Hopefully last year was a wakeup call and forces him to re-evaluate his priorities.

This (keep in mind that, prior to his draft year, Leblanc was widely considered amongst the top-5 of his age group.... and possibly even Top-3), plus the fact that LL made good life choices, but not necessarily good hockey choices, and you have him in his current situation.

Without injury last season, LL might have made it in lieu and place of Gallagher. Not that it would have been a good thing for the team, mind you, but he might have been the one getting the nod to play with Pacioretty and Desharnais. And we'd have a totally different view of him.

AT this point, he'S kindof in the same situation than Pacioretty was the year he was sent down, basically at his request.

It only went upwards for him since that point.

 

[Whitesnake]

That's the thing...
If Leblanc can contribute something, then good.
But for that, he has to get a chance to contribute. That might or might not happen this season, for factors that aren't necessarily in Leblanc's control.
This year, he must bounce back in Hamilton and, if called up as an injury-replacement, show he can play good sound hockey, probably on the third line.
Some may be rebutted to have him play on the 3rd line (due to not having great size and not being extremely physical), but logically, our 3rd RW should be Brian Gionta at this point, who isn't big or extremely physical either.

At this point, Leblanc is a vet in Hamilton. If he doesn't have a chance to contribute, it's because they think he's bad and he'll be gone by the end of the year and they have no future for him. If he bounces back, well he could be an ideal replacement for a 3rd or 4th line. Unfortunately nothing more, I thought I had seen more from him, should've listened some that had already mentioned he'd be nothing more than a 3rd liner. I clearly overestimated him. Doesn't mean he can't achieve being a NHL'er though. Nothing is done in his case. But he needs a great season. Another season like last year and he's gone.

 

[MXD]

At this point, Leblanc is a vet in Hamilton. If he doesn't have a chance to contribute, it's because they think he's bad and he'll be gone by the end of the year and they have no future for him. If he bounces back, well he could be an ideal replacement for a 3rd or 4th line. Unfortunately nothing more, I thought I had seen more from him, should've listened some that had already mentioned he'd be nothing more than a 3rd liner. I clearly overestimated him. Doesn't mean he can't achieve being a NHL'er though. Nothing is done in his case. But he needs a great season. Another season like last year and he's gone.

This said, you don't replace an injured Parros or White with Leblanc while expecting the same style of play....

Totally agree that another bad season and he's gone.

 

[Monctonscout]

It makes no sense for him to be at the rookie camp, it's been like 5 years since he was drafted.

Bergevin is basically saying this is your chance kid, show your stuff and prove you are an NHL player. With the injuries going into the year he might get a 10 game stint. I liked his game 2 years ago when he was on the big team, smart player who was pretty good along the boards. Seems like a guy who could be useful in the playoffs.

LL does seem like he was born with a silver spoon in his mouth though and got by on talent alone. Hopefully last year was a wakeup call and forces him to re-evaluate his priorities.

I think it's just a CBA thing were guys that are no longer rookies can't play at rookie camps/tournaments. LL lost his rookie status in 11-12.

 

[Monctonscout]

That's the thing...
If Leblanc can contribute something, then good.
But for that, he has to get a chance to contribute. That might or might not happen this season, for factors that aren't necessarily in Leblanc's control.
This year, he must bounce back in Hamilton and, if called up as an injury-replacement, show he can play good sound hockey, probably on the third line.
Some may be rebutted to have him play on the 3rd line (due to not having great size and not being extremely physical), but logically, our 3rd RW should be Brian Gionta at this point, who isn't big or extremely physical either.

If he has a strong AHL year, he will definitely get looks with the Habs and there will be a spot for him next year. Guys like Collberg McCarron Bozon Hudon Crisp are unlikely to be NHL ready next fall, so he is competing with guys like Thomas for a potential top 9 spot in 14-15 if he gets bcak on track.

He had 22 points in 31 AHL games in 11-12. Normal progression means a 65-70 point pace this year...and he is only 22.

 

[Tyson]

If he holds his own and has a great camp, Bergevin has to find him a spot. He is ready

 

[Monctonscout]

If he holds his own and has a great camp, Bergevin has to find him a spot. He is ready

How does coming off a down year scream "he is ready" to you?

Let the kid play at lesat half a year AHL and dominate down there, put up some points...THEN you consider bringing him up.

 

[montreal]

Mishandling? Leblanc has not shown any worthwhile progress.. that's no one's fault but maybe the scouting staff for thinking he was the guy in 2009.

Leblanc showed good things every year up until last season. He easily showed at least solid progress after turning pro.

Bottom like the '09 Draft sucked balls. And most here agreed with the pick.

http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/draft/nhl2009e.html

Still agree with the pick. Thought they would have went with Despres.

How was he used in Hamilton ?

Why didn't he get a call up last year ? He shown he could handle the big league a year prior.

He was mishandled.

He was used on the 1st, 2nd and 3rd lines last year in Hamilton. He didn't get a callup last year because in no way did he show anything to merit a callup. He was terrible, why would you call up someone that looks like a shell of himself? I understand that he showed good things the year prior and had he not been injured so early into the season who knows how things would have ended up, but after returning from injury he struggled mightly and never got on track.

Leblanc = Chipchura. With lil' better offense.

The thing is with Leblanc, as a bottom Nhler, he doesnt fit our needs. Maybe in a year or two, when Bergevin will be done improving size and physicality it wont be a problem anymore. But in a lineup full of softies, its hard to find him a role. Im sure hell be a Nhler, but im not sure it will be with us.

I don't like the comparison. Chipchura has more grit and is a better defensive player. Both are smart and hard working but Leblanc is more of a goal scorer whereas Chipchura's offensive game is based mostly on his passing game (although I haven't watched him much with the yotes)

 

[Paul Dipietro]

Leblanc was practically "there" 2 years ago. Sure he had an off year (probably due to injuries and lack of confidence) but come on, if he can get back to his 11-12 shape, we can do a lot worse than a 3rd line made up of Chucky-Eller-Leblanc (at least to start the season)

 

[Mario le Magnifique]

Not sure where you get that LL is soft? I have seen him play at each level the last 4+ years and "soft" is never a word I would use to define him. In fact he's been a guy that's usually been strong in 1 on 1 battles and stuck his nose in there, even as a 20 year old in the NHL he did not look physically overmatched despite being lighter(180lbs or therebouts) than most players.

LL is Tom Pyatt soft.

Don't get me wrong, he can hold onto his life in the NHL, but I don't want that type of player in the Habs bottom six. Not enough grit. Aren't you tired of soft guys in a league where physicality has never been more important. Back in the days we had Carbonneau who had same size, but watching tapes, he was a friggin pest and had a lot of grit. LL's game is baby skin soft. If he's ever going to be in our bottom 6 he needs to add some sandpaper to his game.

Do you think CHI / Boston / LAK are winning Stanley cups with a soft bottom 6 ? LL might not be soft in the AHL, but he's certainly not physically wearing down opponents, he plays like he is afraid he might wake up the opponents, he's barely hitting anyone, sure he backchecks and the effort is there to win puck battles, but in the end this isn't enough to warrant a regular NHL spot in a bottom 6 on a CUP CONTENDING TEAM (mediocre teams like Habs have iced since 1993 don't apply, even when they had good regular seasons or fluky playoffs runs).

In the NHL you need big guys that can play hockey in the bottom 6 and defense, 2 PMDs (The Habs have them thankfully), and a skilled top 6 that can skate and are ideally big as well. Softies that can't skate will get you nowhere.

 

[WhiskeySeven*]

LL is Tom Pyatt soft.

Don't get me wrong, he can hold onto his life in the NHL, but I don't want that type of player in the Habs bottom six. Not enough grit. Aren't you tired of soft guys in a league where physicality has never been more important. Back in the days we had Carbonneau who had same size, but watching tapes, he was a friggin pest and had a lot of grit. LL's game is baby skin soft. If he's ever going to be in our bottom 6 he needs to add some sandpaper to his game.

Do you think CHI / Boston / LAK are winning Stanley cups with a soft bottom 6 ? LL might not be soft in the AHL, but he's certainly not physically wearing down opponents, he plays like he is afraid he might wake up the opponents, he's barely hitting anyone, sure he backchecks and the effort is there to win puck battles, but in the end this isn't enough to warrant a regular NHL spot in a bottom 6 on a CUP CONTENDING TEAM (mediocre teams like Habs have iced since 1993 don't apply, even when they had good regular seasons or fluky playoffs runs).

In the NHL you need big guys that can play hockey in the bottom 6 and defense, 2 PMDs (The Habs have them thankfully), and a skilled top 6 that can skate and are ideally big as well. Softies that can't skate will get you nowhere.

Your entire argument is built upon a flimsy premise.

D-, apply yourself.

 

[Estimated_Prophet]

Your entire argument is built upon a flimsy premise.

D-, apply yourself.

Going to have to agree with you here.

Leblanc's strength is his willingness to go to the dirty areas, his board work and his IQ. He may be a little soft between the ears when it comes to self confidence and interacting socially with others but that is just my opinion and my evidence to support it is extremely subjective.

 

[Mario le Magnifique]

Your entire argument is built upon a flimsy premise.

D-, apply yourself.

No wonder why the Habs have been going nowhere for decades with fans like you willfully accepting mediocrity.

I'm asking for a cup contending team, and LL on our bottom six wouldn't make us one. Like I said, hopefully I'll eat crow when spring comes and Habs are a contending team. More grit, more sandpaper, I don't see any that in his game. Tom Pyatt was also pretty good along the boards and winning a lot of puck battles, but teams with Tom Pyatts in them are basement dwellers.

 

[Estimated_Prophet]

No wonder why the Habs have been going nowhere for decades with fans like you willfully accepting mediocrity.

I'm asking for a cup contending team, and LL on our bottom six wouldn't make us one. Like I said, hopefully I'll eat crow when spring comes and Habs are a contending team. More grit, more sandpaper, I don't see any that in his game. Tom Pyatt was also pretty good along the boards and winning a lot of puck battles, but teams with Tom Pyatts in them are basement dwellers.

Pyatt was terrible on the boards and the only battles for the puck that he won were foot races.

 

[Monctonscout]

LL is Tom Pyatt soft.

Don't get me wrong, he can hold onto his life in the NHL, but I don't want that type of player in the Habs bottom six. Not enough grit. Aren't you tired of soft guys in a league where physicality has never been more important. Back in the days we had Carbonneau who had same size, but watching tapes, he was a friggin pest and had a lot of grit. LL's game is baby skin soft. If he's ever going to be in our bottom 6 he needs to add some sandpaper to his game.

Do you think CHI / Boston / LAK are winning Stanley cups with a soft bottom 6 ? LL might not be soft in the AHL, but he's certainly not physically wearing down opponents, he plays like he is afraid he might wake up the opponents, he's barely hitting anyone, sure he backchecks and the effort is there to win puck battles, but in the end this isn't enough to warrant a regular NHL spot in a bottom 6 on a CUP CONTENDING TEAM (mediocre teams like Habs have iced since 1993 don't apply, even when they had good regular seasons or fluky playoffs runs).

In the NHL you need big guys that can play hockey in the bottom 6 and defense, 2 PMDs (The Habs have them thankfully), and a skilled top 6 that can skate and are ideally big as well. Softies that can't skate will get you nowhere.

You're confusing a player being soft with a player being physical. They are not one and the same.

A guy like Gionta is the opposite of soft, he plays balls out and continuously sacrifices his body and will always take a hit to make a play, anybody calling him soft should IMMEDIATELY log off and burn their computer. However, he isn't a guy that will run people over and be a punishing hitter. He is the definition of a gritty NHLer.

LL is neither soft nor non-physical. He isn't a physical force, but he is average sized(6' 190-195lbs) and he takes the body when the opportunity is there. He isn't Kyle Clutterbuck type hitting everything that moves, but he isn't Louis Ericksson/Scott Gomez soft either. I would put him closer to Clutterbuck than Gomez/Ericksson though.

 

[Monctonscout]

No wonder why the Habs have been going nowhere for decades with fans like you willfully accepting mediocrity.

I'm asking for a cup contending team, and LL on our bottom six wouldn't make us one. Like I said, hopefully I'll eat crow when spring comes and Habs are a contending team. More grit, more sandpaper, I don't see any that in his game. Tom Pyatt was also pretty good along the boards and winning a lot of puck battles, but teams with Tom Pyatts in them are basement dwellers.

Not sure where you get the comparison, LL was bigger/stronger on his skates at 19 than Pyatt is now, add 20lbs and you are not talking about the same type player. Skillwise Pyatt is not even in the same stratosphere. People just look at an off year and ignore all other data to come up with a ridiculous conclusion. Many on here did the same with Pacioretty 3 years ago.

 

[Mario le Magnifique]

You're confusing a player being soft with a player being physical. They are not one and the same.

A guy like Gionta is the opposite of soft, he plays balls out and continuously sacrifices his body and will always take a hit to make a play, anybody calling him soft should IMMEDIATELY log off and burn their computer. However, he isn't a guy that will run people over and be a punishing hitter. He is the definition of a gritty NHLer.

LL is neither soft nor non-physical. He isn't a physical force, but he is average sized(6' 190-195lbs) and he takes the body when the opportunity is there. He isn't Kyle Clutterbuck type hitting everything that moves, but he isn't Louis Ericksson/Scott Gomez soft either. I would put him closer to Clutterbuck than Gomez/Ericksson though.

Don't get me wrong I'm not on a kill LL crusade, like I said I hope he proves my opinion to be wrong about him. I'm just talking about the fanbase's expectations for what he's projected to be. Everyone pegs him as bottom 6, PK, some PP, 30 points, 15 goals, etc at the prime of his career. And that's probably exagerated expectations. More like, if he's a + player he'd ba allright for our 4rth line. NO WAY ! Mediocrity ! You want your 4rth liners to bring energy and grit, AND be + players.

Gionta has been a top 6 player since he broke out to be a 25-30 goals scoring winger that has WHEELS, work ethic and good smart positionning. If LL ever gets 25 goals in the NHL I'll eat my dirty socks. Since he was tried with Elias and Langenbrunner, he was perceived by NJ management to be a goal scoring speedy winger, something LL will never be. When he had his chance in NJ he was put on their scoring lines because he showed something LL will never be able to show. If LL had 2-3 goal scoring oportunity per game and missed most I wouldn't be worried, but I doubt he'll ever be able to ever have that many because he's just too slow for his stature.

It is all about our expectations of LL. I hate projecting a softy with bad wheels on our bottom 6. That's all.

 

[Habruti!]

No wonder why the Habs have been going nowhere for decades with fans like you willfully accepting mediocrity.

I'm asking for a cup contending team, and LL on our bottom six wouldn't make us one. Like I said, hopefully I'll eat crow when spring comes and Habs are a contending team. More grit, more sandpaper, I don't see any that in his game. Tom Pyatt was also pretty good along the boards and winning a lot of puck battles, but teams with Tom Pyatts in them are basement dwellers.

I would rather think that one of the reasons montreal stunk for years is that they did not do a good job at evaluating the talent they had in there hands and did not do a good job at further developing it. Giving up too early on a guy is actually worst then having a prospect that does not pan out ... (LeClair, Hainsey, Ribeiro, Grabovski, McDonagh) to name a few. Sure you could debate that these where bad trade but really what they are is miss-management of assets and failure to properly evaluate the talent they had in hand.

Leblanc may or may not end up a successfull NHL player but I would rather see him fail here then pan out outside the organization. Having said that I do think it is not to late to pan out here...

 

[Mario le Magnifique]

I would rather think that one of the reasons montreal stunk for years is that they did not do a good job at evaluating the talent they had in there hands and did not do a good job at further developing it. Giving up too early on a guy is actually worst then having a prospect that does not pan out ... (LeClair, Hainsey, Ribeiro, Grabovski, McDonagh) to name a few. Sure you could debate that these where bad trade but really what they are is miss-management of assets and failure to properly evaluate the talent they had in hand.

Leblanc may or may not end up a successfull NHL player but I would rather see him fail here then pan out outside the organization. Having said that I do think it is not to late to pan out here...

I agree with this, but any of those players had shown a lot of potential to the organization and were traded for other assets, and most turned to be bad ones.

LL has shown he can do what exactly ? Not good enough for top 6. Might have a role in a bottom 6. All of the players you mentionned had top 6 F or top 4 D potential in the Habs brass eyes except maybe Grabovski. It fell off in the Habs GM's hands when he decided to accept bad offers.

Just thinking about these moves makes me sick.

 

[Monctonscout]

Don't get me wrong I'm not on a kill LL crusade, like I said I hope he proves my opinion to be wrong about him. I'm just talking about the fanbase's expectations for what he's projected to be. Everyone pegs him as bottom 6, PK, some PP, 30 points, 15 goals, etc at the prime of his career. And that's probably exagerated expectations. More like, if he's a + player he'd ba allright for our 4rth line. NO WAY ! Mediocrity ! You want your 4rth liners to bring energy and grit, AND be + players.

Gionta has been a top 6 player since he broke out to be a 25-30 goals scoring winger that has WHEELS, work ethic and good smart positionning. If LL ever gets 25 goals in the NHL I'll eat my dirty socks. Since he was tried with Elias and Langenbrunner, he was perceived by NJ management to be a goal scoring speedy winger, something LL will never be. When he had his chance in NJ he was put on their scoring lines because he showed something LL will never be able to show. If LL had 2-3 goal scoring oportunity per game and missed most I wouldn't be worried, but I doubt he'll ever be able to ever have that many because he's just too slow for his stature.

It is all about our expectations of LL. I hate projecting a softy with bad wheels on our bottom 6. That's all.

I didn't compare LL with Gionta, just poiting out where some people miss the boat on physical vs soft.

I think LL's upside is similar to Plekanec, not as good a skater but bigger. Will he reach that potential? Who knows, obviously part of it is coming to camp this year in a good frame of mind and bouncing back. Worst case he should be a 40-45 point 3rd liner that can play PP and PK.

Again, not sure where you get that he is a "softie" as he isn't. Playing gritty and finishing checks is one of his strengths.

 

[Dagistitsyn]

I didn't compare LL with Gionta, just poiting out where some people miss the boat on physical vs soft.

I think LL's upside is similar to Plekanec, not as good a skater but bigger. Will he reach that potential? Who knows, obviously part of it is coming to camp this year in a good frame of mind and bouncing back. Worst case he should be a 40-45 point 3rd liner that can play PP and PK.

Again, not sure where you get that he is a "softie" as he isn't. Playing gritty and finishing checks is one of his strengths.

I didn't hear anything about him putting on much size. Pleks is pretty solid around 200 pounds. Leblanc looks like he has a much smaller / weaker frame to me, thought he was 1 inch taller 20+ pounds smaller. I guess he may end up being the same size some day, doubt he will be bigger though. Plenty of years have gone by since drafted to put on size and still looks way too skinny.

 

[Monctonscout]

I agree with this, but any of those players had shown a lot of potential to the organization and were traded for other assets, and most turned to be bad ones.

LL has shown he can do what exactly ? Not good enough for top 6. Might have a role in a bottom 6. All of the players you mentionned had top 6 F or top 4 D potential in the Habs brass eyes except maybe Grabovski. It fell off in the Habs GM's hands when he decided to accept bad offers.

Just thinking about these moves makes me sick.

Where your post is a fail is that you evaluate LL based on the 20 year old kid you saw playing in the NHL a year ago when he should have been AHL but injuries forced him up. You entirely miss the point of developping players and allowing them time to develop.

Some guys who have good NHL careers don't even crack the NHL for the first time until 24-25. People need to take a big step back and look at the big picture.