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Confirmed with Link: Logan Stanley 2 years 1.25 million

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DeepFrickinValue said:
I haven’t heard people complain, about Stanley much lately. Has his game improved?
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I think it's been the same as it always has been... not as bad as people make it out to be, but not good enough to be a bottom pairing D man on a true cup contender

It's been a while since he's had a catastrophic gaffe, which is what most people notice and focus on rather than his mostly OK play

I'm sure that someone on my ignore list will come in with CF% or something to disagree with me though
 
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Most of us have just made it to “depression” or “acceptance”
 
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He hasn’t made the glaring mistake and turnover recently but it feels like it’s only a moment away. And not just a minor giveaway but a colossal blunder that results in a goal against at the most inopportune time.
 
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Bob E said:
He hasn’t made the glaring mistake and turnover recently but it feels like it’s only a moment away. And not just a minor giveaway but a colossal blunder that results in a goal against at the most inopportune time.
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He did have a couple of pretty shitty passes on attempted zone exits that led to us getting pinned in our zone for longer stretches. He's good for a handful of those every game. They havent led directly to goals against recently but its just a matter of time.
 
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jokesondee said:
He did have a couple of pretty shitty passes on attempted zone exits that led to us getting pinned in our zone for longer stretches. He's good for a handful of those every game. They havent led directly to goals against recently but its just a matter of time.
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Every D man has those. Scrutinize all 6 D the same and you'll likely notice
 
jokesondee said:
I do. I find his to be more glaring and numerous.
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Since the stats v eye test v are we picking on stan - ive been watching giveaways and momentum etc with our D...

The biggest difference with Stan is that when he gives away the puck - he has a really hard time recovering... our other guys rebound pretty quickly esp Samberg and Jomo obviously.
- Then you have his 'successful' zone exits... which do work but they are quite often the equivalent of suicide passes.. where the forward gains possession but guys are on him quickly because they read Stan.
- Then inevitably he will get 'lost' on 2-3 plays a game - seemingly not knowing who to cover and sometimes end up as a screen in front of Helle...

Biggest challenge is the momentum lost while Stan is out there - its not huge but we rarely are 'taking' it to the other team when the next pairing gets on the ice... not sure any stat measures that
 
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He's a 5LHD in the NHL.
It should take two injuries on the left side before you put him on the ice.
Would he be getting the same TOI if he were 6' 1" and not 6' 7"?
Provorov would be a nice addition for the playoffs.
Greenway from the Sabres could be a nice pickup if he came for a 4th or less.
Does anyone think Chevy would try to bring Tanev back as a rental?
What would Wallman from the Sharks cost?
 
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The debate around Stanley is always interesting as he looks worse on the ice than his actual production. This season he has a 5 on 5, 63.33 GF%, and an amazing 80.00 HDGF%, so he is involved in a lot more high danger scoring than he is scored against. He is also started a lot in his own end with only 38.74% of offensive zone starts. In a perfect world ideally you get a veteran LHD that pushes him down, but their isn't a coach in the league that wouldn't take that kind of production from a bottom pairing D.
 
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10Ducky10 said:
He's a 5LHD in the NHL.
It should take two injuries on the left side before you put him on the ice.
Would he be getting the same TOI if he were 6' 1" and not 6' 7"?
Provorov would be a nice addition for the playoffs.
Greenway from the Sabres could be a nice pickup if he came for a 4th or less.
Does anyone think Chevy would try to bring Tanev back as a rental?
What would Wallman from the Sharks cost?
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Wallman would be the only one of those I would be interested in and a 2nd would be all I offer .
 
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KingBogo said:
The debate around Stanley is always interesting as he looks worse on the ice than his actual production. This season he has a 5 on 5, 63.33 GF%, and an amazing 80.00 HDGF%, so he is involved in a lot more high danger scoring than he is scored against. He is also started a lot in his own end with only 38.74% of offensive zone starts. In a perfect world ideally you get a veteran LHD that pushes him down, but their isn't a coach in the league that wouldn't take that kind of production from a bottom pairing D.
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So GF% is all him? No credit to Helle?

The GA side of that equation is due to elite goaltending that id say is independent of Stanley's play.

19 GF on 22 xGF
Vs
11 GA on 24 xGA.

Indicates goaltending is a bigger factor in +/-. And it's not like he's some vaunted offensive D scoring those GF.

IIRC shot and chance stats have him near the bottom of similarly played D (think @Gm0ney posted on this previously) which is isolated from goaltending
 
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DRW204 said:
So GF% is all him? No credit to Helle?

The GA side of that equation is due to elite goaltending that id say is independent of Stanley's play.

19 GF on 22 xGF
Vs
11 GA on 24 xGA.

Indicates goaltending is a bigger factor in +/-. And it's not like he's some vaunted offensive D scoring those GF.

IIRC shot and chance stats have him near the bottom of similarly played D (think @Gm0ney posted on this previously) which is isolated from goaltending
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Don't all D men play with the same Helle behind them? If so, why do they have different GF%s?

I posted it elsewhere, but I think the major reason Stanley gives up so many shot attempts and so few HDSC is because he's been coached to keep players to the outside and force perimeter shots (same for the 4th line and all day who play bottom pairing)

Keep that in mind next time you watch him on the ice. Notice where the shot attempts come from and why
 
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Buffdog said:
Don't all D men play with the same Helle behind them? If so, why do they have different GF%s?

I posted it elsewhere, but I think the major reason Stanley gives up so many shot attempts and so few HDSC is because he's been coached to keep players to the outside and force perimeter shots (same for the 4th line and all day who play bottom pairing)

Keep that in mind next time you watch him on the ice. Notice where the shot attempts come from and why
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This is true for most Jets players. Keep players away from high danger zones. You then trust Helly to eat up everything. Stanley is the model child for doing this consistently as awkward as he may look at times.
 
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DRW204 said:
So GF% is all him? No credit to Helle?

The GA side of that equation is due to elite goaltending that id say is independent of Stanley's play.

19 GF on 22 xGF
Vs
11 GA on 24 xGA.

Indicates goaltending is a bigger factor in +/-. And it's not like he's some vaunted offensive D scoring those GF.

IIRC shot and chance stats have him near the bottom of similarly played D (think @Gm0ney posted on this previously) which is isolated from goaltending
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Stanley's been getting an absolutely wild on-ice SV%...like .985 or .990 at 5v5. It doesn't seem likely to continue forever. If he was getting the kind of SV% Pavelec used to regularly provide Winnipeggers would be flipping over streetcars like it was 1919.
 
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Gm0ney said:
Stanley's been getting an absolutely wild on-ice SV%...like .985 or .990 at 5v5. It doesn't seem likely to continue forever. If he was getting the kind of SV% Pavelec used to regularly provide Winnipeggers would be flipping over streetcars like it was 1919.
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Yup to quote his Gf% as to why he's good, and give 0 credit to Helle just shows how ridiculous some these stats are being applied. It's essentially traditional +/- all over again.

Edit
This was the post I was thinking of from a week ago that you had:

"Here are Stanley's current rankings among 227 defensemen with 200 TOI at 5v5 around the NHL:

CF% 191st
FF% 174th
SF% 177th
xGF% 142nd
SCF% 143rd
HDCF% 134th (the 41st percentile!)
GF% 10"

When Stanley's on the ice they're kinda mid to bad in net shots and chances generated. And ofc GF% looks good bc of goaltending as you mentioned. Not all on him of course, onus is on the the Fwds mostly on the offensive side imo.
 
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DRW204 said:
Yup to quote his Gf% as to why he's good, and give 0 credit to Helle just shows how ridiculous some these stats are being applied. It's essentially traditional +/- all over again.
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The low goals against/astronomical on-ice SV% stick out like a sore thumb. Everywhere else his shot metrics and analytics are meh to terrible but he's hardly ever out there for a goal against.

Arniel (or whoever is sending the defensive pairs over the boards) tries to keep him sheltered from elite competition...but he does get a lot of d zone starts, so it's not the easiest assignment possible.
 
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Gm0ney said:
The low goals against/astronomical on-ice SV% stick out like a sore thumb. Everywhere else his shot metrics and analytics are meh to terrible but he's hardly ever out there for a goal against.

Arniel (or whoever is sending the defensive pairs over the boards) tries to keep him sheltered from elite competition...but he does get a lot of d zone starts, so it's not the easiest assignment possible.
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Caught me before the edit.

I'm not going to pin all the shots/chances for on him. IMO that's a bit more onus on the fwds. But the GF%, 5V5 net goals... Whatever you want to call it is heavily influenced by goaltending (hence the high disparity bw gf vs xgf and GA vs xGA)
 
KingBogo said:
The debate around Stanley is always interesting as he looks worse on the ice than his actual production. This season he has a 5 on 5, 63.33 GF%, and an amazing 80.00 HDGF%, so he is involved in a lot more high danger scoring than he is scored against. He is also started a lot in his own end with only 38.74% of offensive zone starts. In a perfect world ideally you get a veteran LHD that pushes him down, but their isn't a coach in the league that wouldn't take that kind of production from a bottom pairing D.
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Interesting is not the word I would use but I get your point -
As a #6, you'd think we'd take those numbers and run - even it potentially unsustainable or even coincidental.
If we do pick up another D (on the left side), I can see him out of the lineup.

But I'm not sure it's the left side they would be looking to bolster.
Based on your post, it looks like Arniel trusts him with dzone starts - I don't get the impression they are concerned about Stan or looking to find a replacement.
If anything, I can see the Jets wanted to add size at the deadline -
 
KingBogo said:
The debate around Stanley is always interesting as he looks worse on the ice than his actual production. This season he has a 5 on 5, 63.33 GF%, and an amazing 80.00 HDGF%, so he is involved in a lot more high danger scoring than he is scored against. He is also started a lot in his own end with only 38.74% of offensive zone starts. In a perfect world ideally you get a veteran LHD that pushes him down, but their isn't a coach in the league that wouldn't take that kind of production from a bottom pairing D.
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So if coaches follow adv stats... ehlers should have been top line for the last 7 years...? No?
 
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DRW204 said:
Caught me before the edit.

I'm not going to pin all the shots/chances for on him. IMO that's a bit more onus on the fwds. But the GF%, 5V5 net goals... Whatever you want to call it is heavily influenced by goaltending (hence the high disparity bw gf vs xgf and GA vs xGA)
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So again, why is his GF% higher than other D men on the team if they all play in front of the same goalie? Helle is a constant

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The disparity isn't just between xGF and GF and GA and xGA. There's also a disparity between CF% and HDCF% - meaning that he bleeds shots, but not high danger ones. In fact, his HDSAA/60 is the exact same as Pionk, and ballpark to most of the rest of the D

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Who knows, maybe @DRW204 has me on his ignore list too lol... but this is just another example of someone trying to fit the data to their opinin instead of the other way around (which is the way it's supposed to be done)
 
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