Post-Game Talk: Leafs win in SO after giving up another two goal lead

[al secord]

Guys who have never laced em up seriously in junior or pro will never understand da game no matter what Dubie spreadsheet they use .. i listened to him for a few minutes and he made me LOL .. just zero comprehension of what it takes to play .. similar to Dubie LOL

Some will never understand spelling or grammar.

 

[keonsbitterness]

I think we can all agree that the OT/SO format is a complete joke and should be ignored

As long as it's part of the deal for the regular season, it can't be ignored.

 

[Doublerum1975]

People are complaining about how we are getting points lol as long as we make the playoffs does it matter?

 

[Taylor Halls Teeth]

People are complaining about how we are getting points lol as long as we make the playoffs does it matter?

I think its that more like people are leery about celebrating sloppy wins as though thats an endorsement of the sloppy coach or the shakey lineup. That makes a lot more sense in the last 30 games of the season than in the first 30 though.

They arent digging a hole right now and you want a club that peaks in the second half, not the first. I would rather they were performing at a higher level because this looks like a team that gets chewed up fast in the playoffs but this isnt the game 80 lineup and maybe not even the game 80 coach, It really is more bout the wins right now than th style points.

 

[Doublerum1975]

I think its that more like people are leery about celebrating sloppy wins as though thats an endorsement of the sloppy coach or the shakey lineup. That makes a lot more sense in the last 30 games of the season than in the first 30 though.

They arent digging a hole right now and you want a club that peaks in the second half, not the first. I would rather they were performing at a higher level because this looks like a team that gets chewed up fast in the playoffs but this isnt the game 80 lineup and maybe not even the game 80 coach, It really is more bout the wins right now than th style points.

Does it really matter with how or playoffs have gone just get in

 

[Lightsol]

Keefe has made some adjustments (albeit very slowly at times); he's having to work with some non-nhl defencemen and two less than proven goalies. I have no problem with bagging on Keefe for stupid stuff, but in this situation, he's gotten the most out of what he has to work with.

There are a lot of problems on the team that are coaching-related; you can argue that Keefe is trying his best with a depleted defense, but what you can't easily argue is that the Leafs have a terrible, terrible gameplay both ways; on offence they're obsessed with possession to the point they're doing stupid things to try and maintain it (you should NEVER, NEVER, NEVER be doing short passes in your own damned zone unless the other team is backed up or you're on the PP, and ESPECIALLY when you just spent the last minute trying to get the puck out; just f***ing get it past center) and try to generate perfect scoring chances every single time, and on defense they are constantly running around like they don't have a clue who should be doing what. That's almost entirely a coaching issue; their offensive gameplan can work when the stars are able to outskill their opponents, but it opens them up to dumb plays and players being asked to do things not in their skillset, and their defensive gameplan is nonexistent.

 

[Lightsol]

Meanwhile, the Leafs are 6-1-1 in their last 8 games, so my prediction about their record looks pretty solid.

They're all OT wins, so it's actually 0-1-1 and they suck.

 

[Hoglund4MvP]

People are complaining about how we are getting points lol as long as we make the playoffs does it matter?

We'll win the cup and this place will cry because we didn't win it the way they want

 

[al secord]

We'll win the cup and this place will cry because we didn't win it the way they want

If we win it in game 7 in OT I'm going to recommend and asterisk

 

[Mr_Fun]

There are a lot of problems on the team that are coaching-related; you can argue that Keefe is trying his best with a depleted defense, but what you can't easily argue is that the Leafs have a terrible, terrible gameplay both ways; on offence they're obsessed with possession to the point they're doing stupid things to try and maintain it (you should NEVER, NEVER, NEVER be doing short passes in your own damned zone unless the other team is backed up or you're on the PP, and ESPECIALLY when you just spent the last minute trying to get the puck out; just f***ing get it past center) and try to generate perfect scoring chances every single time, and on defense they are constantly running around like they don't have a clue who should be doing what. That's almost entirely a coaching issue; their offensive gameplan can work when the stars are able to outskill their opponents, but it opens them up to dumb plays and players being asked to do things not in their skillset, and their defensive gameplan is nonexistent.

Pretty much agreed for the most part. The obsession with puck control can be a real detriment at times. Sometimes, you just have to be able to play the game that's being played out there on the ice on that night. That's actually a Bob Gainey quote; not verbatim, but along those lines.

 

[Maple Leaf]

Regular season and playoffs is pointless
Cup or no cup
Exactly

 

[Racer88]

View attachment 776282

This was so funny. Hayes and O-dog were really grinding him about being a Dubas lover

 

[Guided by Veseys]

This was so funny. Hayes and O-dog were really grinding him about being a Dubas lover

I watched a little clip of overdrive from this week and they had Mike Johnson on to talk about the bruins game. He raised his voice and was quite dismissive of Jonas. I was a bit surprised; MJ didn’t want to hear for a second that trying to fight Marchand was pointless (as Jonas was trying portray it).

 

[Gallagbi]

Im torn on the "get Marchand" discussion.

On one hand, I always want to go after him. Hes a piece of garbage who deserves to have his career ended for the things he's done over the years. The difference with him and a guy like Avery is hes smart enough to know not to brag about his plays.

On the other hand, we missed the opportunity to send a message when it mattered. So a fight now just feels performative especially when we had all of our "grit" dressed for the first game. Were no further ahead or behind if it happens

 

[Guided by Veseys]

Im torn on the "get Marchand" discussion.

On one hand, I always want to go after him. Hes a piece of garbage who deserves to have his career ended for the things he's done over the years. The difference with him and a guy like Avery is hes smart enough to know not to brag about his plays.

On the other hand, we missed the opportunity to send a message when it mattered. So a fight now just feels performative especially when we had all of our "grit" dressed for the first game. Were no further ahead or behind if it happens

That’s kind of what Jonas was getting at as well. Mike Johnson and Jeff O’Neal were disagreeing fully though. I’d lean on the side of the players. It might look stupid from the fan perspective but there are apparently psychological benefits in the dressing room for score settling. As for it being after the fact as well, we saw this year that probably the toughest guy in the league (Jeannot) jumped and pummeled little Michael Bunting even though he is on a different team now, all for the Cernek elbow last season (which was about as suspect as Marchands trip imo).

 

[Gallagbi]

That’s kind of what Jonas was getting at as well. Mike Johnson and Jeff O’Neal were disagreeing fully though. I’d lean on the side of the players. It might look stupid from the fan perspective but there are apparently psychological benefits in the dressing room for score settling. As for it being after the fact as well, we saw this year that probably the toughest guy in the league (Jeannot) jumped and pummeled little Michael Bunting even though he is on a different team now, all for the Cernek elbow last season (which was about as suspect as Marchands trip imo).

Its more about what this team wants to be than score settling for me. Reaves or even Domi giving Marchand an expected fight doesnt change or elevate this team in any way. Could be fun to watch, but it doesnt really prove anything.

This group is going to be faced with the question of what they are and how they want to play. If they want to be a phyaical group that stands up for eachother then it doesnt need to hinge on a Marchand retribution fight, but you need to play more games like the one where we took 2 instigators. When youre quick to respond and stand your ground.

In the Jeannot example you had TB instigating all series long all through the lineup. Nice that he fought Bunting after a summer to reflect, but there was a logical reason they couldnt do it in the moment that series or immediately after the incident. And when they had the chance to get some retribution, like after the Rielly "hit", in series, they took it

 

[notbias]

Guys who have never laced em up seriously in junior or pro will never understand da game no matter what Dubie spreadsheet they use .. i listened to him for a few minutes and he made me LOL .. just zero comprehension of what it takes to play .. similar to Dubie LOL

That's funny because guys who still try to relive the glory days of playing Jr. 30 years ago won't understand it today.

 

[therealkoho]

Do you think 21 games is a sufficient sample size to put reliance on this statistic? If so, do you believe that Detroit, Washington, the Islanders, Pittsburgh and Philadelphia are all better teams than the Leafs? Couldn't I just take the exact opposite statistic (regulation losses) and say that the Leafs are one of the best teams in the league because they are tied for third for fewest number of regulation losses? I assume you would disregard that stat, and you should, because 21 games is too small of a sample size to reach any conclusion. If it were, watch out for the Buffalo Sabres and their 9 regulation wins! Straight to the Cup final for that impressive group.

Is 21 games sufficient to project a 105 point season or with a win over the Bs a 108 point season? It's the same thing, only different, isn't it?

 

[therealkoho]

That's funny because guys who still try to relive the glory days of playing Jr. 30 years ago won't understand it today.

Only if those folks live exclusively in the past, which I for one do not.

Hockey is still a game that demands mental and physical toughness. The ice surface is still the same, although the redline is gone and the bluelines have squeezed the neutral zone the total area of the sheet is exactly the same.

The equipment is better and the new skates beat my old Supremes by a mile in both comfort and weight

But it's the same game, there is nothing new that happens on the ice that's any different to what went on in my day. It's the exact same and no matter how anyone wants to dress up systems, they're only successful when my guys are better than your guys, that we have better goaltending. And my guys want it more and are willing to cave in the opponent if necessary, that last part is more playoff releated.

 

[therealkoho]

View attachment 776282

That dude is such a friggin dweeb, doesn't understand the game on any level and has no idea what it takes to win.

 

[therealkoho]

People are complaining about how we are getting points lol as long as we make the playoffs does it matter?

No it doesn't matter at all. I will say that the idea of continually blowing leads is concerning. Our highest paid player guy is sleepwalking through games is also concerning, because it drags down his linemates.

I'm of the belief that even though we are down half of our top 6, we should still be crushing opponents. We're finally getting good consistent shifts from our bottom 6 the 2 line is basically carrying the team, even the guy we have to wheel in from Shady Acres Adult living centre is having another solid season and is leading as usual in those areas that are really important such as retrievals and battle wins(tops in the league) and putting up another ppg season.

The 1 line has got to start earning its money and playing up to its reputation.

 

[Guided by Veseys]

Its more about what this team wants to be than score settling for me. Reaves or even Domi giving Marchand an expected fight doesnt change or elevate this team in any way. Could be fun to watch, but it doesnt really prove anything.

This group is going to be faced with the question of what they are and how they want to play. If they want to be a phyaical group that stands up for eachother then it doesnt need to hinge on a Marchand retribution fight, but you need to play more games like the one where we took 2 instigators. When youre quick to respond and stand your ground.

In the Jeannot example you had TB instigating all series long all through the lineup. Nice that he fought Bunting after a summer to reflect, but there was a logical reason they couldnt do it in the moment that series or immediately after the incident. And when they had the chance to get some retribution, like after the Rielly "hit", in series, they took it

I suppose so but if you have affable Mike Johnson arguing somewhat passionately about retribution being required for Marchand, it does seem to lend to the considered necessity of settling scores down the road.

 

[GoonieFace]

There should be some retribution, and if not, than it’s obvious it’s a stance taken by the organization. Guess we will find out. Ask Rat Boy once and once only, and than pummel him regardless of his answer

 

[Sypher04]

No it doesn't matter at all. I will say that the idea of continually blowing leads is concerning. Our highest paid player guy is sleepwalking through games is also concerning, because it drags down his linemates.

I'm of the belief that even though we are down half of our top 6, we should still be crushing opponents. We're finally getting good consistent shifts from our bottom 6 the 2 line is basically carrying the team, even the guy we have to wheel in from Shady Acres Adult living centre is having another solid season and is leading as usual in those areas that are really important such as retrievals and battle wins(tops in the league) and putting up another ppg season.

The 1 line has got to start earning its money and playing up to its reputation.

Agreed. Honestly none of the core 4 forwards have been particularly good since we returned from Sweden. Nylander gets a bit of a pass because he was carrying this team through and the first 17 games offensively, Tavares as well to a lesser extent, but both Matthews and Marner, particularly 5 on 5 this year, have been just ok.

I think some of this issue is because we are spending way too much time defending

 

[Gallagbi]

I suppose so but if you have affable Mike Johnson arguing somewhat passionately about retribution being required for Marchand, it does seem to lend to the considered necessity of settling scores down the road.

Maybe I haven't come across the right clip, but I've heard MJ and Jonas laughing about a pointless fight with Forbert and Reaves. Then suggesting the core 4 fighting would be fun, but the window to really make an impact has passed.

It was pretty funny to hear them suggest Knies or Matthews fighting Marchand would be unfair to little Marchand though. Jonas's suggestion of a Domi fight made a lot more sense than JT or Matthews getting fed off the opening draw or a passive rookie who doesnt look comfortable fighting "giving it his best"