Leafs (Un)Special Teams

[ACC1224]

The teams PP currently sits 8th (24.6%) while the PK sits at 27th(76.4%).

They used to say that if you add up the two percentages and its > 100 you're doing well but for me, both of these areas could be doing much better.

Without better PK numbers in particular, this team is going no where come playoff time. Is this a personnel or systems issue? Better goaltending would certainly help.

PP to me looks predictable most times. It seems lately they are using more movement which is good. For me I would always run PP1 the full two minutes.

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[PromisedLand]

Leafs special teams is especially a huge disaster in the post season; they are never able to win special teams battle.

This season the PK has been complete trash with similar trash can PP as the most expensive PP in the league.

smart thing to do is break up the PP units and give equal amount of time to PP1 and PP2 and this also helps get Bert and Domi some confidence and get them going a bit too.

P.S. Put Robertson on one of the PP ffs

 

[Buds17]

The PK in particular definitely requires improvement as 27th overall just won't suffice.

 

[GoonieFace]

How can the PK so bad with an elite penalty killer on it?

 

[The Iceman]

No question in my mind on the PK when you throw Kampf over the boards to lose the draw and have Brodie and Gio on the back end with below avg goaltending it is a personnel issue.

Schen RHD PK1 and dare I say Holl RHD PK2 made a big difference

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

The Leafs tend to play a standard 1-3-1 formation with the drop back pass almost exclusively as their zone entry scheme.

The main puck carrier is usually Rielly, who drops it back to either Matthews or Marner.

If Matthews takes it, expect him to pass to the adjacent winger, usually Marner, somewhere in the neutral zone, who then gains the offensive zone. I assume this is because Matthews can't set himself up for the one timer. But it could also be because Matthews stops skating once he crosses the blue line and the other team forms a pocket around him and chokes him off.

If Marner takes the dbp, expect him to make his entry around either side of the last player nearest the strong side wall. Marner will bring it in as far as he can until he runs out of room, then he either makes a play or dumps it. Leafs are a good puck retrieval team so they will dump it in a lot more than a casual fan might expect for what is supposed to be a "puck possession" team.

If Rielly is the recipient of the drop back pass (which means Marner usually is the one who dropped the puck), expect him to make an end to end rush where he will gain the zone by coming across the opposition's blue line behind the wall of players that all form along there. Once he has gained the zone expect him to carry it all the way into the opposition's end where he will either take a shot or circle around the net where he can either take a shot or make a play before returning to his natural position at the blue line.

Those are the main zone entries the Leafs will run.

Once they gain the zone they set up in formation as quickly as possible, with Matthews and Nylander on the dot on their off wings ready for the one timers, Rielly quarterbacking the point, Marner is bumper, and Tavares is net front.

Once upon a time a 25% power play would have been tops in the league.

 

[wingman75]

The PP I don't understand. My theory is that it's ineptness is due to a lack of knowing when to simplify and general work ethic. Add in the fact we still do not have a shot threat from the point and it becomes defendable when the other guys are not clicking.

The PK was clearly going to be an issue coming into this season. Look at the players we lost over last season and off-season. A lot of them were PK members. The guys we brought in do not kill, and they guys we have on the roster who don't kill, don't for a reason.

It is a clear deficit in a specific skill. One of a few this team has, and one that no one has stepped up to fill.

 

[Fogelhund]

Last year our top PK guys were Holl, Brodie, Kampf, Marner, Giordano, Kerfoot... Acciari and McCabe played once traded for,

Say what you want about his 5v5 game, but Holl was very good on the PK. We miss his PK ability, if that's all we miss.

Brodie, Kampf, Giordano have all seen their games regress... and quite a bit at that. Kerfoot and Acciari are gone too.

Our focus for new bodies this year, was more offense, more grit... but with poorer defensive abilities... We just didn't have replacements for the PK. Plus we've had our goalie issues, and the goalie is the most important player on the PK.

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As far as the PP.... it should be better, given the "stars" on the PP, and their offensive ability..

That being said, from 2019/20 to 21/22.. so three seasons, we averaged 23.9%... we are at 24.6% right now... which also happens to be our five year average. Last year we performed at a very high level, but that hasn't been this groups norm.

The PP I don't understand. My theory is that it's ineptness is due to a lack of knowing when to simplify and general work ethic. Add in the fact we still do not have a shot threat from the point and it becomes defendable when the other guys are not clicking.

The PP is right at it's 5 year average... It's #3 in the league over that period. It's not inept at all.. actually, it's quite good.

Point shots are a thing of the past... the scoring rate is 3%... that's not going to increase your PP effectiveness. Noting, the best point shot on the team is Timmins, who actually is pretty good at it.

 

[Darcy Tucker]

That passing display they put on in Calgary on the 4 on 3 is what we need to see more of. I'm not sure if JT in the bumper is making things too sloppy but with our skill level we have too many power plays where not much happened. JT has been holding us back imo.

 

[GoonieFace]

Laegersson seemed to be effective on the PK…but he doesn’t play anymore

 

[Fogelhund]

Laegersson seemed to be effective on the PK…but he doesn’t play anymore

Yes, he's quite good on the PK, but a number 8 otherwise.

 

[ACC1224]

I think the PP seems worse than it is because it never seems to score when a big goal is needed, trailing late in a game .
(I understand my impression may not reflect reality)

 

[wingman75]

Last year our top PK guys were Holl, Brodie, Kampf, Marner, Giordano, Kerfoot... Acciari and McCabe played once traded for,

Say what you want about his 5v5 game, but Holl was very good on the PK. We miss his PK ability, if that's all we miss.

Brodie, Kampf, Giordano have all seen their games regress... and quite a bit at that. Kerfoot and Acciari are gone too.

Our focus for new bodies this year, was more offense, more grit... but with poorer defensive abilities... We just didn't have replacements for the PK. Plus we've had our goalie issues, and the goalie is the most important player on the PK.

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The PP is right at it's 5 year average... It's #3 in the league over that period. It's not inept at all.. actually, it's quite good.

Point shots are a thing of the past... the scoring rate is 3%... that's not going to increase your PP effectiveness.

We miss Holl and Kerfoot on the PK severely. They were stabilizers in that role. Fully agree with the regressed play of some of the guys who are still on the roster. Most unfortunate.

The idea with the shot from the point on the PP is the threat of it, not the fact it will score. To make things doubly worse, imo, is the fact our D are seemingly the worst at simply getting pucks through that first defender.

The PP is inept to me, in such that when you NEED it to score, it rarely does. Jives with the lack of any killer instinct from this core though, so no one needs be surprised I guess.

I think the PP seems worse than it is because it never seems to score when a big goal is needed, trailing late in a game .
(I understand my impression may not reflect reality)

I see it as you do. The VAN game is a recent example.

 

[Fogelhund]

We miss Holl and Kerfoot on the PK severely. They were stabilizers in that role. Fully agree with the regressed play of some of the guys who are still on the roster. Most unfortunate.

The idea with the shot from the point on the PP is the threat of it, not the fact it will score. To make things doubly worse, imo, is the fact our D are seemingly the worst at simply getting pucks through that first defender.

The PP is inept to me, in such that when you NEED it to score, it rarely does. Jives with the lack of any killer instinct from this core though, so no one needs be surprised I guess.


I see it as you do. The VAN game is a recent example.

We are scoring at a 24.6% rate this year on the PP this year... that's certainly not inept....

 

[wingman75]

We are scoring at a 24.6% rate this year on the PP this year... that's certainly not inept....

Too broad. Tell me how many PP goals we core to tie a game or take a lead.

 

[Fogelhund]

Too broad. Tell me how many PP goals we core to tie a game or take a lead.

Really, that seems to be your claim, and if you want to back up your claim, it's up to you to prove it, not for others to disprove your statement.

 

[TheDoldrums]

The most important player on the PK is the goalie.

Our PK stats are about the same as our team goaltending stats, really no mystery there. All we can do is hope Samsonov has figured something out and Woll returns in good form.

 

[Arzak]

How can the PK so bad with an elite penalty killer on it?

You can have both. He scores and remains PK elite, still not defending all that well and mid asf PK on good days.

Bergeron with all the Selkes in the world while actually being a part of the best PK was never paid $11M AAV.


I swear when Marner pulled out "pay me for elite PK" on Dubas during negotiations, it confused him so much that's where his family issues started.

He was a rookie GM, in a very difficult position, "Should I tell him to f*ck off or is he telling the truth and you have to pay an extra $$$ for Selke hopeful ?"

We all know which way he went.

 

[ACC1224]

Too broad. Tell me how many PP goals we core to tie a game or take a lead.

That would certainly be interesting to know. Not sure where you would find that info.

 

[Sypher04]

You can have both. He scores and remains PK elite, still not defending all that well and mid asf PK on good days.

Bergeron with all the Selkes in the world while actually being a part of the best PK was never paid $11M AAV.


I swear when Marner pulled out "pay me for elite PK" on Dubas during negotiations, it confused him so much that's where his family issues started.

He was a rookie GM, in a very difficult position, "Should I tell him to f*ck off or is he telling the truth and you have to pay an extra $$$ for Selke hopeful ?"

We all know which way he went.

Marner didn’t really PK all that much or at a high level during his ELC so I’m highly skeptical any such conversation took place

 

[wingman75]

Really, that seems to be your claim, and if you want to back up your claim, it's up to you to prove it, not for others to disprove your statement.

I can't help if you can't read; that was my statement from the start. I don't care if anyone wants to prove it, but we all know it is true. What have you "proven" on this oh so serious forum? Regurgitating a stat you can get from anywhere on the internet. Get a life dude.

8th best in the league, same as past years and it gets you nowhere. That is my point.

And with a worse PK, we are even more fckd since as great as you say the PP is, it's not making up for the disaster that is the PK.

They are welcome to turn all that around in the final 40-or-so games.

 

[Fogelhund]

The PP I don't understand. My theory is that it's ineptness is due to a lack of knowing when to simplify and general work ethic. Add in the fact we still do not have a shot threat from the point and it becomes defendable when the other guys are not clicking.

The PK was clearly going to be an issue coming into this season. Look at the players we lost over last season and off-season. A lot of them were PK members. The guys we brought in do not kill, and they guys we have on the roster who don't kill, don't for a reason.

It is a clear deficit in a specific skill. One of a few this team has, and one that no one has stepped up to fill.

I can't help if you can't read; that was my statement from the start. I don't care if anyone wants to prove it, but we all know it is true. What have you "proven" on this oh so serious forum? Regurgitating a stat you can get from anywhere on the internet. Get a life dude.

8th best in the league, same as past years and it gets you nowhere. That is my point.

And with a worse PK, we are even more fckd since as great as you say the PP is, it's not making up for the disaster that is the PK.

They are welcome to turn all that around in the final 40-or-so games.

There is your original statement. Nowhere does it say it's inept compared to other teams, when needing a tie, or to take a lead. Anyway, you seem to be upset for being called out for making statements that you cannot backup. So, Go Leafs Go...

 

[wingman75]

There is your original statement. Nowhere does it say it's inept compared to other teams, when needing a tie, or to take a lead. Anyway, you seem to be upset for being called out for making statements that you cannot backup. So, Go Leafs Go...

One does not get upset on internet forums.

I still stay the PP is NOT clutch. Neither of us has proof that it is or it isn't. My eye test tells me it isn't. Being 8th over on the PP when it rarely scores when you need it is kinda like having a 70 goal scorer when his team can't win the cup. What is the point!?

Indeed, Go Leafs Go !!

 

[Commander Clueless]

I'm surprised the PP ranks so high. Maybe the failures just hit harder when you seem to get so few opportunities for whatever reason.

The PK needs to be better, particularly net front. This is an area that might be able to be addressed without moving top assets if Brad is reluctant to spend heavily on this year's team (and he would be right to be reluctant IMO)

 

[ACC1224]

I'm surprised the PP ranks so high. Maybe the failures just hit harder when you seem to get so few opportunities for whatever reason.

The PK needs to be better, particularly net front. This is an area that might be able to be addressed without moving top assets if Brad is reluctant to spend heavily on this year's team (and he would be right to be reluctant IMO)

I don’t think it would take much to bring in some PK help. Obviously they have to be able to play a regular shift as well.

Perhaps the players are fine and this is another of those things we can blame on Van Ryn?