Proposal: Leafs-Ducks

[Zegs2sendhelp]

When there were trade rumours around Andersen and/or Vatanen going to Toronto in the summer, Duvks fans were quick to note that Stoner or Bieksa needed to go back as a cap dump.

So forgive us if we haven't found out that apparently he turned into a reliable 3rd pairing D that you're not willing to give up.

He was always a reliable 3rd pairing guy slightly over paid, but we were in cap hell... we have our players signed were not going to tag theodore with stoner. At the time he had to go back as a cap dump... but now he doesnt, unless we are picking up salary. Granted your forward prospexts outside of the big 3 dont get you theodore.

 

[Vipers31]

When there were trade rumours around Andersen and/or Vatanen going to Toronto in the summer, Duvks fans were quick to note that Stoner or Bieksa needed to go back as a cap dump.

So forgive us if we haven't found out that apparently he turned into a reliable 3rd pairing D that you're not willing to give up.

That's a very selective memory, at best. There really wasn't any noteworthy number of Ducks fans around that would even bring up Bieksa as a cap dump, because basically everyone knew he wouldn't waive his NMC and Murray wouldn't trade him before it kicked in. Also, there really never were trade rumors on Vatanen this summer, to begin with.

In reality, all summer Ducks fans had the fortune of dealing with other fanbases looking to squeeze top assets out of us for taking on Stoner's contract, while Ducks fans by far and large always refused the comparisions to the likes of Bickell or Bolland and pictured him as a capable bottom pairing defenseman that is overpaid by $1-1.5M. That still makes him a cap dump, as everyone was and is aware, but it never made him less of a reliable 3rd pairing defender, and it always made the notion of the Ducks trading guys like Theodore or Montour in order to get rid of him a pretty unrealistic scenario. Nothing about this has really changed over or since the summer.

 

[Sypher04]

Yeah, I can't see Anaheim being open to moving a very good, young, expansion draft exempt defenseman.

It will be interesting to see how Anaheim deals with their D going into expansion. With Bieksa being required protection, Anaheim will need to decide how to handle Lindholm, Fowler and Vatanen. If they protect all 3, they will really limit their forward protection slots. If they don't intend to protect all 3, which do they move? Fowler or Vatanen?

Unless they can convince Bieksa and trade partner to make a deal work prior to the end of the season. This would be the best the scenario for Anaheim... I just don't think I can see why another team does it.

 

[Vipers31]

Yeah, I can't see Anaheim being open to moving a very good, young, expansion draft exempt defenseman.

It will be interesting to see how Anaheim deals with their D going into expansion. With Bieksa being required protection, Anaheim will need to decide how to handle Lindholm, Fowler and Vatanen. If they protect all 3, they will really limit their forward protection slots. If they don't intend to protect all 3, which do they move? Fowler or Vatanen?

Unless they can convince Bieksa and trade partner to make a deal work prior to the end of the season. This would be the best the scenario for Anaheim... I just don't think I can see why another team does it.

Buyout and Bieksa waiving his NMC are still the two more likely scenarios. Bieksa would be bought out before being protected, and I don't really know a reason to believe that the buyout window won't be opened before. And Bieksa's outspoken unwillingness to move his family in combination with the virtually non-existent chance of him being taken by Vegas may well open him up to just waiving the NMC. Given his drop off, even the financial loss compared to being bought out may not be a substantial amount, given some of the contracts handed to veterans that were doing better than he is now.

I don't see him being traded, but I also think the chance of him actually winding up being protected by the Ducks is rather minimal.

 

[WhatTheDuck]

Would much rather keep Theodore over the two other prospects mentioned, and Stoner's salary does nothing to change that. Pass

 

[Omac13]

TO ANA: B. Leipsic (or Kapanen if ANA adds) + F. Corrado <--waived by ANA

TO TOR: C. Stoner + S. Theodore

Why for ANA: Stoner is 100% a cap dump by Anaheim. In this scenario, they do not retain any salary to free up his cap hit of $3.25M for the remainder of this season and next year. Price to dump Stoner is Theodore however the Ducks get a good wing prospect back who is ready to play. Leipsic is playing very well in the AHL and plays a Darcy Tucker-like greasy game. Corrado's cap hit can be eliminated by waiving him.

Why for TOR: Much like deals the Leafs completed in the past, they take on some salary for a young asset. (Gardiner attached to then boat anchor Lupul, Franson attached to a concussed and overpaid Lombardi) Theodore has top 4 potential and would be guided by one of the best coaches in Babcock. Stoner, while overpaid and often injured, could add some snarl to the bottom pairing and push the likes of Hunwick and Marincin out the door. Leafs would jump quicker for a RHD like Montour but I don't think the ducks will part with him as he is their likely replacement for Vatanen. (Who I believe will be dealt pre-expansion draft in an effort to protect other Ducks' defenders.)

Leafs roll the following as I have seen Theodore play on the right side:

Reilly-Zaitsev
Gardiner-Theodore
Stoner-Carrick
(Marincin-Polak)

The Ducks and Leafs on paper seem like logical trading partners. For many reasons. One team needs to cut some cap money , other team has cap space. One team has good young D men, the other team needs some. One team wants young Forwards and One team has that. Etc etc etc........

They just need to find what makes sense for both teams to make it work.

 

[BlueBaron]

Toronto overrates their prospects like crazy and underrated other teams prospects. Theodore has top pairing potential bruh

You make foolish generalizations.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Totally agree that Anaheim will never trade Shea Theodore just to dump Stoners contrat, That will never happen and this is a pretty bad offer for Anaheim.

 

[loyaltotheend]

Would much rather keep Theodore over the two other prospects mentioned, and Stoner's salary does nothing to change that. Pass

I don't know if no one saw it, or you guys think it's not worth responding to or something, but I asked if it made any difference to substitute Bieksa and his NMC for Stoner? Is that any more enticing?

 

[Ziggdiezan]

I don't know if no one saw it, or you guys think it's not worth responding to or something, but I asked if it made any difference to substitute Bieksa and his NMC for Stoner? Is that any more enticing?

If you include Beiksa the leafs will loose Carrick which is not ideal at all. Does Theodore play on the right side?

 

[WhatTheDuck]

I don't know if no one saw it, or you guys think it's not worth responding to or something, but I asked if it made any difference to substitute Bieksa and his NMC for Stoner? Is that any more enticing?

Nope, same answer - would rather keep Theodore. I don't see Bieksa waiving his NMC for a trade anyway.

 

[Spazkat]

I don't know if no one saw it, or you guys think it's not worth responding to or something, but I asked if it made any difference to substitute Bieksa and his NMC for Stoner? Is that any more enticing?

The likelihood of Bieksa waiving the NMC is pretty much non-existent so any trades predicated on that are pointless.

 

[Vipers31]

I don't know if no one saw it, or you guys think it's not worth responding to or something, but I asked if it made any difference to substitute Bieksa and his NMC for Stoner? Is that any more enticing?

A little more, but not enough to make a difference. Any additional enticement is countered by knowing Bieksa won't waive for a trade, anyway.

 

[dracom]

The OP seems to be offering good prospect for slightly better prospect, certainly nothing out to lunch. Certainly not your top d prospect either, bruh.

For the ducks fans who want a discussion and not just ******** on each other, would you be more inclined if it was Bieksa instead of Stoner? Saw some comments that Stoner is liked, just a little over paid. Would getting out from under a NT/NMC (whichever he has) pre-expansion draft be worth this move?

Uhh, Theo is our top D prospect, might be our best prospect overall actually.

No point in discussion Bieksa since he won't waive his NMC just to be sent to Toronto, he won't make his family move there.

As for this proposal, it's basically Theo for Leipsic or Kap which is a HUGE pass from us. I like that you added "value" just for a guy who you expect us to put on waivers and we would most likely end up losing. Such a terrible proposal. Toronto fans in general need to stop trying to get top prospects in exchange for taking "cap dumps" and sending mediocre prospects back.

 

[cwede]

i've got no rooting interest here, but what seems missing here, is
what incentive are Leafs offering that Ducks would/should trade Theodore?, a guy they have no intention of trading
so the Toronto fan tries to make a balanced offer, to justify what he wants to get,
but doesn't seem to be trying to incent Ducks with what they need\want

Bob Murray can figure out Cap management without tossing in one their most-prized, highest-upside prospects, who plays a position where they are carrying too much Cap hit already

we all like making up trades, but if you just try to make it 'fair' for the other team to give you a valued asset, you are being unrealistic

and re Leipsic, the projections on him have always been mixed (yes many very optimistic), so you are being smart to try to sell high,
but an AHL scoring champ rarely brings back a highly-prize,d grade A, consensus solid top 4 D prospect

 

[Jetsfan87]

No Way ANA is giving up Theodore to get out of Stoners Contract...

 

[loyaltotheend]

A little more, but not enough to make a difference. Any additional enticement is countered by knowing Bieksa won't waive for a trade, anyway.

Fair enough. Just checking.

 

[loyaltotheend]

Uhh, Theo is our top D prospect, might be our best prospect overall actually.

No point in discussion Bieksa since he won't waive his NMC just to be sent to Toronto, he won't make his family move there.

As for this proposal, it's basically Theo for Leipsic or Kap which is a HUGE pass from us. I like that you added "value" just for a guy who you expect us to put on waivers and we would most likely end up losing. Such a terrible proposal. Toronto fans in general need to stop trying to get top prospects in exchange for taking "cap dumps" and sending mediocre prospects back.

My mistake, I thought it was Montour

 

[Zegs2sendhelp]

My mistake, I thought it was Montour

Our top 3 defense prospects are arguably our 3 top prospects (tho jones and steel are really pushing them)... I rate all 3 pretty close tbh, just 3 different types of dmen... if I had to say id go

1. Theodore
2. Larsson
3. Montour

Based off personal preference, but Montour may be the highest valued due too demand.

 

[Griffin76]

I wouldn't deal Kap for Theo straight up, Babcock likes the LH=LD / RH=RD rule, and our top 9 will be focused on these 5 in the future:

X-Matthews-Marner
X-Nylander-Kapanen
X-Kadri-X

I can definitely see this as well. I'd also pencil in JVR with Matthews, and Soshnikov and Brown with Kadri for the next few years until the young stars get paid.

 

[lindholmie]

My mistake, I thought it was Montour

lol nooo. montour is 3rd best behind theodore and larsson. Ducks are stacked with D prospects. Also lol

The OP seems to be offering good prospect for slightly better prospect, certainly nothing out to lunch. Certainly not your top d prospect either, bruh.

you think theodore is only slightly better than Lepsic? hahahah you do know theodore is one of the best d prospect in the game

 

[Ducks in a row]

The OP seems to be offering good prospect for slightly better prospect, certainly nothing out to lunch. Certainly not your top d prospect either, bruh.

Theodore is our top D prospect and he isn't just a slightly better prospect then Leipsic he is a good deal better and he plays a more important position.

When there were trade rumours around Andersen and/or Vatanen going to Toronto in the summer, Duvks fans were quick to note that Stoner or Bieksa needed to go back as a cap dump.

So forgive us if we haven't found out that apparently he turned into a reliable 3rd pairing D that you're not willing to give up.

Stoner is a solid 3rd pair defenseman (he always was for us just over payed) we wanted to trade him to help with our salary situation for re-signing Lindholm and Rakell. Lindholm and Rakell are both signed now. The need to trade Stoner isn't as high as it was. We weren't going to trade Theodore to get rid of Stoner before and we sure as hell ain't doing it now.

 

[Halla]

leafs should just wait to see what pans out in regards to the expansion draft.

2nd pairing dmen will be on sale before the exp draft, and vegas will probably have a few to move after the expansion draft

 

[HanSolo]

That's a heavy cost to move cap dollars.

 

[duxfan8]

Oh Lepsic is worth Theodore because he is first in AHL scoring? I guess Toronto should offer Zaitsev for Corey Tropp. I mean, Tropp is 4th in the league in scoring (only 14 games) and is tied for the highest Points/game out of all AHLers with at least 10 games played! Oh boy, that's still too good for Toronto!! Throw in a plus!