Leafs cap question

[zeke]

Re opening night

I think it counts as opening night for everyone but the two teams going over can carry additionals at no penalty due to the situation

I seem to remember reading this somewhere

Oct 11?

 

[andora]

Oct 11?

Oops sorry.. oct 7th i thought

Oct 11?

Nevermind oct 11.. the considerations for sanjose nashville is they are exenpt for the prague games

I had it backwards

Business Notes: Salary Cap, 2022-23 Schedule, LTIR

 

[zeke]

Oops sorry.. oct 7th i thought


Nevermind oct 11.. the considerations for sanjose nashville is they are exenpt for the prague games

I had it backwards

Business Notes: Salary Cap, 2022-23 Schedule, LTIR

Cool. So any opening day LTIR I believe can only come in game 12 on Nov 5.

 

[The Iceman]

Oof what?

The Oooof was the Leafs have 3 of the best D contracts in the league and thank goodness they do or we would be in seious cap trouble.

 

[zeke]

The Oooof was the Leafs have 3 of the best D contracts in the league and thank goodness they do or we would be in seious cap trouble.

The Leafs would be in cap trouble if they had worse contracts?

True, I guess.

 

[The Iceman]

The Leafs would be in cap trouble if they had worse contracts?

True, I guess.

YUP, OooooF

 

[Ianturnedbull]

Holl trade is the easiest .

View attachment 589740

Wait. Don't you have Holl as a starter for TOR in that other thread?

 

[zeke]

Wait. Don't you have Holl as a starter for TOR in that other thread?

Holl is most likely on the opening night roster, yes.

 

[Golden_Jet]

No. Mess is entirely wrong.

LTIR only gives you space for the time a player is on LTIR. There is no accrual. When the roster is healthy you still need to get rid of the extra salary somehow, no matter how long anyone is on ltir.

This is correct, there is no cap accrual in LTIR.

 

[notbias]

That is why experts define Leafs situation as being in constant "Cap Hell ".

Paying 3 players $11 or more each comes a steep price to the rest of the roster.

However Leafs are finally doing this part right by using those bottom spots for drafted/developed players on cheaper offsetting contracts, as well as grizzled old vets on league minimum deals as the salary cap was intended,

What experts? Cap hell is having a bunch of bad contracts.

I've never heard someone like Brandon Pridham call it "Cap Hell", it is usually just on these forums, and I am not sure if I would call anyone an expert here.

 

[zeke]

What experts? Cap hell is having a bunch of bad contracts.

I've never heard someone like Brandon Pridham call it "Cap Hell", it is usually just on these forums, and I am not sure if I would call anyone an expert here.

Leafs literally have one of the best cap situations in the league. They don't have to worry about losing anyone of significance for cap reasons for a long while.

 

[crump]

Cap issues are not resolved yet, with all the injuries on D, Holl is less likely to be traded.
My gut feeling is they are prepping Muzzin to be on LTIR. This maintenance issue is ongoing and obviously not going away. I could guess it is unresolved disc issues from when he was younger. I don't know but it doesn't seem like he's really game ready here no matter what they say. Just waiting for the right moment and put him on the LTIR list. My wild speculation.

 

[Butch 19]

Not (even a little) a Leaf fan but I have a question for those of you who are.
Cap friendly has TML about 2.85 mill over the cap with a 23 man roster.
Kick Gaudette’s 750k out and it’s 2.1m
With JT and Lilly missing some time but not even close to using LTIR it leaves them with 20 healthy bodies and still 2.1m over.
How does that get resolved?

so nvm

nvm m?

 

[Racer88]

Leafs literally have one of the best cap situations in the league. They don't have to worry about losing anyone of significance for cap reasons for a long while.

Could that maybe be that outside of the big 5 they don’t have anyone of significance due to the high percentage of cap said big 5 take. Is that not a form of cap hell

 

[zeke]

Could that maybe be that outside of the big 5 they don’t have anyone of significance due to the high percentage of cap said big 5 take. Is that not a form of cap hell

If they are a perennial top 5 team with only 5 good players, that's a damn good argument that those guys are worth a huge chunk of the cap.

 

[Mess]

Could that maybe be that outside of the big 5 they don’t have anyone of significance due to the high percentage of cap said big 5 take. Is that not a form of cap hell

That is exactly what NHL experts refer to it.

THE SALARY CAP HELL BUCKET

Toronto Maple Leafs: So long as the Big Four (Auston Matthews, John Tavares, Mitch Marner and William Nylander) account for nearly half ($40.4 million) of the Salary Cap, filling in the gaps will be challenging.

Toss in Morgan Rielly and who you have left with is a who's who of insignificant spare parts.

Leafs have 1 forward Kerfoot at $3.5 mil listed between Nylander at $7 mil and Engvall at $2.25 mil, with everybody else making less. Its a world of have and have-nots.

 

[Nineteen67]

If they are a perennial top 5 team with only 5 good players, that's a damn good argument that those guys are worth a huge chunk of the cap.

If they were, but they‘ve been somewhere between 9th-16th for 5 of the 6 seasons, and 1 season of 17th-24th.

 

[zeke]

If they were, but they‘ve been somewhere between 9th-16th for 5 of the 6 seasons, and 1 season of 17th-24th.

sure they were.

That is exactly what NHL experts refer to it.

THE SALARY CAP HELL BUCKET

Toronto Maple Leafs: So long as the Big Four (Auston Matthews, John Tavares, Mitch Marner and William Nylander) account for nearly half ($40.4 million) of the Salary Cap, filling in the gaps will be challenging.

Toss in Morgan Rielly and who you have left with is a who's who of insignificant spare parts.

Leafs have 1 forward Kerfoot at $3.5 mil listed between Nylander at $7 mil and Engvall at $2.25 mil, with everybody else making less. Its a world of have and have-nots.

and yet, it's all the other top teams that have had to lose star players for nothing this offseason, and not the leafs.

what a weird cap hell they are in.

 

[Nineteen67]

sure they were.



and yet, it's all the other top teams that have had to lose star players for nothing this offseason, and not the leafs.

what a weird cap hell they are in.

And they won they Cup one year, so there’s that, too.

 

[Racer88]

If they are a perennial top 5 team with only 5 good players, that's a damn good argument that those guys are worth a huge chunk of the cap.

If being a good regular season team is a high priority then ya I agree but if having playoff success is important then they are a failure and it’s because of the cap hell

 

[Gallagbi]

If being a good regular season team is a high priority then ya I agree but if having playoff success is important then they are a failure and it’s because of the cap hell

Im sure we could trade Matthews/Marner/Nylander for a few picks to clear up space, but i dont think it makes us a better team

 

[Racer88]

Im sure we could trade Matthews/Marner/Nylander for a few picks to clear up space, but i dont think it makes us a better team

Me either, now if we could only get rid of Tavares sure that 11 million could be better spent

 

[Cap'n Flavour]

Being over the cap and having to rely on at least ~$2M worth of cap to be on LTIR all season long isn't great. It's not Minnesota's cap hell, but there isn't a lot of fat to trim. What is trading Holl supposed to fix, unless he somehow returns a better and cheaper replacement? You're left with Liljegren as the sole RHD and he's out for a few weeks too. Brodie can't play RD on all three pairs. Hell, the Marlies only have Hollowell and Villeneuve as right shots.

 

[The Hanging Jowl]

Let's break down the only two leafs current injuries that could possibly turn into LTIR stints at the moment.....


1. Opening Night Date?

One big question is what date counts as actual opening day towards the "24 days" minimum for LTIR purposes? I have no idea, but 3 possibilities:

Oct 7: opening night in prague
Oct 8: end of preseason
Oct 11: opening night in north america

Does anyone know?


2. LTIR minimums are 10gms and 24 days

Leafs play their 11th game on Nov 2, 27 days from Oct 7, 26 days from Oct 8, 23 days from Oct 11.

So basically, anyone on LTIR to start the season won't be able to play until at least game 11 on Nov 2 and possibly game 12 on Nov 5.


3. Tavares injury: "Minimum 3 weeks" as of Sep 27.

3 weeks only takes him to Oct 18th. If he's back in 3 weeks that's only 4 games missed, and a good 2-2.5 weeks short of the minimum 24 days.

Oblique injuries are notorious for lingering, so it's possible they could push it - but if he's on track to recovery on opening day i highly doubt that they put him on LTIR.


4. Liljegren Injury: "6 weeks" as of Sep 21.

Now i'm not sure whether Dubas meant 6 weeks as of Sep 21 or 6 weeks as of the date of surgery. But we don't know when surgery was and Dubas was probably talking from the date he was speaking on, so let's just say 6 weeks as of Sep 21.

6 weeks takes Lilly all the way to Nov 2, which is the date of Game 11, and somewhere between 23-27gms from the start of the season.

And, on top of that, core muscle injuries can linger as well. And even if Lilly is recovering well on opening night that's still only halfway through projected recovery so they won't want to rush him.

So I think the plan as of now is to LTIR Lilly for sure,

Lilly's LTIR is just enough to get us under the cap with a league minimum roster.

With enough room at least to let us freely pick which two bubble forwards make it.



5. Still doesn't solve the issue

That only buys us a few weeks. Once Lilly is back at the start of November they leafs will have to make a trade to fit him in.

Maybe by that time some other team will have had an injury that makes them more eager to offer up something better for Holl.

Or maybe we get another injury by then that can go on LTIR.

But at some point we likely have to make a trade.

Is it crazy to ask if they would sit Tavares out an extra few games for the cap savings? He does make $134k per game and it's not the worst idea in the world to make sure his oblique doesn't become a nagging injury. If they can get him to LTIR status (end of October depending on how the Prague thing fits in) whether he absolutely needs it or not, that's $1.34M in savings. Just an extra week off basically. Another 5 games is basically half of Lily's salary.

 

[zeke]

Is it crazy to ask if they would sit Tavares out an extra few games for the cap savings? He does make $134k per game and it's not the worst idea in the world to make sure his oblique doesn't become a nagging injury. If they can get him to LTIR status (end of October depending on how the Prague thing fits in) whether he absolutely needs it or not, that's $1.34M in savings. Just an extra week off basically. Another 5 games is basically half of Lily's salary.

it doesn't actually save us any money. it just delays having to get under the cap for another couple weeks.