LD Aron Kiviharju - TPS, FIN JRS (2024 Draft)

[Sweetpotato]

Starting this season, you cannot win 1st overall in back to back years.

Wow I'll be honest I didnt know that. Thanks. That sucks a bit.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

There’s a big difference in what team is picking 1st overall

Are you looking at a team like Arizona or a team like Montreal.

These kids can manage being on a bad team for a couple of years if the management is top tier

Kakko going to be in the playoffs his third season. Going to better teams isn’t always good for playing time and situations. Kakko would’ve been PP1 his first season on a terrible team. He may never be PP1 with the Rangers.

Lundell also is going to the playoffs on a great team his first season, but doesn’t play the PP. There are trade-offs of being on a better team.

 

[Torspo21]

Meet Aron Kiviharju, the 2024 NHL Draft Star

Aron Kiviharju has made waves playing against older competition as a 2006-born defenseman. He's ready to hit the big stage with Finland at the U-18 World Championship, and it won't be long until everyone is talking about him.

thehockeynews.com

 

[ijuka]

So now he has the u16 alltime scoring record for defensemen with 4 points.

He made a couple mistakes more than in past games, but to my eyes still the least mistake prone defenseman. He had a couple of other good plays in addition to the assist, ones that stood out to me were the one breakaway pass to Joakim Kemell, and then this play which hit the post:

 

[FinPanda]

I love this guys personality as well. Saw an interview video where he spoke and he has true leadership qualities. Will be a U18 captain st some point.

(in Finnish and I'm too lazy to translate atm)

 

[Steve Kournianos]

Great in SM-Sarja play but looking green in this tournament. Still, only 16 years old and he's looked more like a future No. 1 than Kulonummi or Laakso, and Salin doesn't look the same since his concussion earlier in the season. Clearly a smart player in a Heinola kind of way but needs to take a hit every now and then to complete a play. Wanted to see more rushes and entries like he does for TPS but that could be coming from the bench, as none of the Finnish dmen are consistently carrying the puck past center.

 

[ijuka]

Great in SM-Sarja play but looking green in this tournament. Still, only 16 years old and he's looked more like a future No. 1 than Kulonummi or Laakso, and Salin doesn't look the same since his concussion earlier in the season. Clearly a smart player in a Heinola kind of way but needs to take a hit every now and then to complete a play. Wanted to see more rushes and entries like he does for TPS but that could be coming from the bench, as none of the Finnish dmen are consistently carrying the puck past center.

Looking "green" in this tournament? How exactly? He's been Finland's most reliable defenseman with the puck. And in terms of scoring chance generation, very high along with Kulonummi. If he's looked green, then every other Finnish defenseman has looked significantly more green, with a possible exception of Kulonummi.

 

[BB88]

Kakko going to be in the playoffs his third season. Going to better teams isn’t always good for playing time and situations. Kakko would’ve been PP1 his first season on a terrible team. He may never be PP1 with the Rangers.

Lundell also is going to the playoffs on a great team his first season, but doesn’t play the PP. There are trade-offs of being on a better team.

I was talking about the importance of top tier management.
How good the team is on draft day isn’t anywhere close to as important as what kind of management the picking team has

 

[TheFinnishTrap]

It was interesting to see how Kiviharju handles the Swedish and Canadian forwards defensively, and I came out fairly impressed. Clearly he has great instincts for defense as well. I’d say for being 2 years underage he did good not getting outskated or outmuscled much, and his stick usage was really good. I think he is on track to becoming a great 2-way defender.

 

[Zub]

Super impressed by his composure and passing ability, IQ on this kid is sky high.

 

[Steve Kournianos]

Looking "green" in this tournament? How exactly? He's been Finland's most reliable defenseman with the puck. And in terms of scoring chance generation, very high along with Kulonummi. If he's looked green, then every other Finnish defenseman has looked significantly more green, with a possible exception of Kulonummi.

The entire Finnish defense corps compared to previous years is below average. He’s still unsure of himself against a physical forecheck and treated the puck like a hot potato that led to turnovers. Offensive zone was fine and you see his smarts, but he looked more poised, decisive, and confident (and physical) in league play.

Kulonummi did not have a good tournament, but it’s just a few games.

 

[ijuka]

The entire Finnish defense corps compared to previous years is below average. He’s still unsure of himself against a physical forecheck and treated the puck like a hot potato that led to turnovers. Offensive zone was fine and you see his smarts, but he looked more poised, decisive, and confident (and physical) in league play.

Kulonummi did not have a good tournament, but it’s just a few games.

Huh? He's exceptionally calm under forecheck pressure, by far the best Finnish defenseman at dealing with forecheck and in every single game has solved some troublesome situations with very quick wit. You're saying he treated the puck like a hot potato and I'd say that that's the complete opposite of what I've been seeing.

Most sources say that Kulonummi has had a good tournament. I'm of the opinion that Kiviharju makes him look better than he is, though. In any case, Kulonummi's been Finland's best non-Kiviharju defenseman by far. Lassi Alanen said that Kulonummi should have been named a top 3 player for Finland over Kemell.

But yes, this level of play is quite a bit stronger than U20SM league play, so it's natural he'd struggle more, especially against the better teams. Additionally, it's a quick tournament, and Finland's coaching is mediocre at best. He played more confident and carried the puck more in CSM two seasons ago. However, in U20 SM-Sarja his play style to my eyes was very similar to how he plays at U18 WJC, and I even saw him play there live which I wonder if you did? In there the breakouts generally were a quick pass to a forward as here. He's not carrying the puck up the ice very often, but is sometimes - and that's a coaching system decision anyway.


Some really weird things you're saying, I wonder how many agree with any of it.

 

[Tube Skates]

The entire Finnish defense corps compared to previous years is below average. He’s still unsure of himself against a physical forecheck and treated the puck like a hot potato that led to turnovers. Offensive zone was fine and you see his smarts, but he looked more poised, decisive, and confident (and physical) in league play.

Kulonummi did not have a good tournament, but it’s just a few games.

Holy I must have been looking at the wrong jersey numbers

 

[Steve Kournianos]

Huh? He's exceptionally calm under forecheck pressure, by far the best Finnish defenseman at dealing with forecheck and in every single game has solved some troublesome situations with very quick wit. You're saying he treated the puck like a hot potato and I'd say that that's the complete opposite of what I've been seeing.

Most sources say that Kulonummi has had a good tournament. I'm of the opinion that Kiviharju makes him look better than he is, though. In any case, Kulonummi's been Finland's best non-Kiviharju defenseman by far. Lassi Alanen said that Kulonummi should have been named a top 3 player for Finland over Kemell.

But yes, this level of play is quite a bit stronger than U20SM league play, so it's natural he'd struggle more, especially against the better teams. Additionally, it's a quick tournament, and Finland's coaching is mediocre at best. He played more confident and carried the puck more in CSM two seasons ago. However, in U20 SM-Sarja his play style to my eyes was very similar to how he plays at U18 WJC, and I even saw him play there live which I wonder if you did? In there the breakouts generally were a quick pass to a forward as here. He's not carrying the puck up the ice very often, but is sometimes - and that's a coaching system decision anyway.


Some really weird things you're saying, I wonder how many agree with any of it.

You just said he struggled more in this tournament than in the SM-Sarja, which is ummmmm, what I said?

 

[covfefe]

You just said he struggled more in this tournament than in the SM-Sarja, which is ummmmm, what I said?

Friendly reminder that Steve is guessing too, just like the rest of us. "Nuff said!"

Vaakanainen ahead of Makar -- played against men, bigger, stronger, fantastic skater and an excellent shot. Makar played against a lot of CHL castoffs and wannabes. Nuff said.

Liljegren ahead of Heiskanen -- Better skater, better shooter, more explosive and exciting. Risky, but has Karlsson type upside. Heiskanen is a safer pick, better in his own end, smarter. Won't pay to see him play. Only reason why people are creaming over him is the recent U18s -- a tournament Vaakanainen was excellent in. Heiskanen dropped from 9-12. Only reason why he dropped was because I dug deeper into Glass and Vilardi and they impressed me enough to get a bump. Brannstrom also leapfrogged him because I think he is more exciting, creating and intense.

 

[Steve Kournianos]

Friendly reminder that Steve is guessing too, just like the rest of us. "Nuff said!"

I ranked Makar 4th in 2017. I dropped Vaakanainn below him.

Here’s my scouting report on him, dated May, 2017

“Dynamic two-way defenseman who torched Canadian Junior “A” by winning every major individual award, including top player in the AJHL and CJHL, plus MVP of the RBC Cup for a second straight year. Makar, who is committed to the University of Massachusetts-Amherst, is an explosive skater with a devastating first step. He commands all areas of the ice with or without the puck, and there is a noticeable fear in the way opponents attempt to defend him. Makar is blessed with an acute understanding of his job in any of the three zones, and he uses a variety of methods to beat back pressure. The way he defends is textbook, especially for a player listed under six feet. While he won’t win the proverbial arm-wrestling contest against bigger forwards, he’s highly competitive and relentless in the way he uses his stick. Quite frankly, his offensive skills are so sublime, you forget how painfully sound his defensive play is, even if it wasn’t against the best of North American major junior. He is the quintessential power play quarterback that can beat you with his accurate stretch passes, end-to-end rushes or setting himself up to unleash a monstrous cannon from the point. You can run out of superlatives trying to describe his game, and one can only hope his dominating performances at high-profile events like the RBC Cup and World Junior “A” Challenge quell concerns related to the level of his competition.”

RHD Cale Makar – The Draft Analyst

www.thedraftanalyst.com

Where are your rankings and scouting reports, mock drafts, podcasts, etc with all your draft takes from 2015-2022?

 

[JJTT]

The entire Finnish defense corps compared to previous years is below average. He’s still unsure of himself against a physical forecheck and treated the puck like a hot potato that led to turnovers. Offensive zone was fine and you see his smarts, but he looked more poised, decisive, and confident (and physical) in league play.

Kulonummi did not have a good tournament, but it’s just a few games.

Is this some sort of joke? Treated the puck like a hot potato? He's been complete opposite of that with great opening passes under pressure shift after shift. Are you sure you have watched the right player?

Great first period vs Czech's. Assist on Kemell's goal, so 6 points in 6 games.

 

[ijuka]

You just said he struggled more in this tournament than in the SM-Sarja, which is ummmmm, what I said?

But you're talking as if that's a criticism. It's completely normal to have bigger problems at a more difficult level than at an easier level - logical, even. Every Finnish defenseman has more issues here than in club play - Heck, some players like Salin or Laakso even played significant amounts of Liiga and nevertheless have struggled here.

The main issue I have with what you said is that he's treated the puck like a hot potato and similar, which definitely is completely false. He's actually played very calm and mature, so your assessment is completely incorrect. He's still by far Finland's most steady and reliable defenseman with the puck as a double underager.

Either the issue is that you're not watching, or that you don't understand what you're watching.

 

[Dirtyf1ghter]

The kind of fake expert who describes a style of play as much as possible to give credibility to his point.

He is right next to it. Kiviharju is very good during this tournament.

And overall, it's a flawless run in his career. It crosses all the barriers on the first try.

Next year we should see him in Liiga and World U20.

 

[BB88]

I don’t know how anyone could be anything but super impressed by his play

 

[FinPanda]

He is like the only player who has impressed me on this Team Finland lol

 

[Zub]

The entire Finnish defense corps compared to previous years is below average. He’s still unsure of himself against a physical forecheck and treated the puck like a hot potato that led to turnovers. Offensive zone was fine and you see his smarts, but he looked more poised, decisive, and confident (and physical) in league play.

Kulonummi did not have a good tournament, but it’s just a few games.

Kivi has had a very few moments where he got overwhelmed by the forecheck, sure, but that's ineviteable on a bad defensive team, overall he's been the most impressive player on a team and the kid JUST turned 16 for christ sake, did you close your eyes all the time's where he made great defensive play's?

Only thing where this kid needs to improve in is getting more power to his strides, as he lacks some speed, but overall very smooth skater and good edgework.

 

[Steve Kournianos]

But you're talking as if that's a criticism. It's completely normal to have bigger problems at a more difficult level than at an easier level - logical, even. Every Finnish defenseman has more issues here than in club play - Heck, some players like Salin or Laakso even played significant amounts of Liiga and nevertheless have struggled here.

The main issue I have with what you said is that he's treated the puck like a hot potato and similar, which definitely is completely false. He's actually played very calm and mature, so your assessment is completely incorrect. He's still by far Finland's most steady and reliable defenseman with the puck as a double underager.

Either the issue is that you're not watching, or that you don't understand what you're watching.

Disagree. Just re-watched the Sweden game. The first 30 minutes were sloppy for that pairing, with turnovers, unforced icings, cutting in front of net under pressure, etc. A little less in the Czech game but Kulonummi made a couple of lazy plays that led to chances (Kulich had one early in the 3rd).

Gronman-Minkkinen has been the most consistent Finnish defense pairing.

 

[Steve Kournianos]

Another observation is how neither Kulonummi nor Kiviharju hold the line. That is a no-go for a top pairing. They let forwards enter with ease and rely too much with stick checks. Go watch the tape. All these can get fixed with experience.

Post automatically merged: May 1, 2022

Kulonummi late to cover the slot because he was puck gazing and his man Sapovaliv nearly tucked it in. Kiviharju was late to pick it up and didn’t take him out.

Again, just another example of why I called him green.

 

[thomast]

Disagree. Just re-watched the Sweden game. The first 30 minutes were sloppy for that pairing, with turnovers, unforced icings, cutting in front of net under pressure, etc. A little less in the Czech game but Kulonummi made a couple of lazy plays that led to chances (Kulich had one early in the 3rd).

Gronman-Minkkinen has been the most consistent Finnish defense pairing.

According to data Kiviharju and Kulonummi have been most reliable and dominant players of team Finland at group stage. Calling Kiviharju green based on couple of plays, while he have been most reliable player of that team finland defence is bold statement especially when data proves otherwise and by my personal eye test, i’m not suprised about the results.

Finnish article:

Datahavainnot Pikkuleijonien alkusarjasta: Kulonummi ja Kiviharju dominoivat kaikkia tilastoja, Kemelliltä ja Salinilta odotetaan enemmän - EP Rinkside FI

EP Rinkside Suomen Lassi Alanen kokoaa merkittävimmät tilastohavainnot Pikkuleijonien alkusarjasta. Puolustajista ykköspari nousee selvästi muiden yli, hyökkääjien osalta tilanne on tasapainoisempi.

fi.eprinkside.com