Proposal: Landeskog to Isles

[Bender]

Nobody doubting Landys skill but a player like Pulock who is about to explode after a solid half season and Strome with the addition of a 1st round pick is great value for Colorado. Isles make this move so they don't lose Pulock/Strome to Vegas. I didn't realize Colorado was lacking at wing according to its fans. FYI Strome can play wing too.

I have literally NEVER heard that before from another fanbase.

Certainly not about Brandon Gormley
Certainly not about Jake Gardiner
Certainly not about Stuart Percy
Certainly not about Jarred Tinordi
Certainly not about Mark Pysyk
Certainly not about Jared Cowen

This is the first time. I would like to be swindelled please and if at all possible, make sure we'd be losing one of the assets we'd acquire in the expansion draft because we're a bunch of hicks from Coleradah....we don't know much up in here about expensian or who we'd need to protect but will just hope everythin' works out. Yeeehhawwww!!!

Give us Brock Nelson...Duncan Siemens is about to EXPLODE!!!!!

 

[Yashin for President]

We could always include a goalie to send them. Isles have three. To all the Avs fans telling me how great your team is, THIS team you have now obviously isn't working. Changes definitely needed, whether its Landy or Duchene something has to change there. McKinnon would be my only untouchable. Outside of Barrie nobody impresses me on D. Eric Johnson is solid but thats about it. Surprised Roy is still the coach there to be honest. Id be upset if I was an Avs fan.

 

[tucker3434]

We could always include a goalie to send them. Isles have three. To all the Avs fans telling me how great your team is, THIS team you have now obviously isn't working. Changes definitely needed, whether its Landy or Duchene something has to change there. McKinnon would be my only untouchable. Outside of Barrie nobody impresses me on D. Eric Johnson is solid but thats about it. Surprised Roy is still the coach there to be honest. Id be upset if I was an Avs fan.

The islanders were hot garbage until they suddenly weren't two years ago. I guess it's a good hing you guys panicked and sold low on De Haan, Hamonic, and Strome.

 

[CodeE]

I have literally NEVER heard that before from another fanbase.

Certainly not about Brandon Gormley
Certainly not about Jake Gardiner
Certainly not about Stuart Percy
Certainly not about Jarred Tinordi
Certainly not about Mark Pysyk
Certainly not about Jared Cowen

This is the first time. I would like to be swindelled please and if at all possible, make sure we'd be losing one of the assets we'd acquire in the expansion draft because we're a bunch of hicks from Coleradah....we don't know much up in here about expensian or who we'd need to protect but will just hope everythin' works out. Yeeehhawwww!!!

Give us Brock Nelson...Duncan Siemens is about to EXPLODE!!!!!

This same logic applies to Mikko Rantanen and Tyson Jost as well, right?

 

[Bender]

This same logic applies to Mikko Rantanen and Tyson Jost as well, right?

It depends, am I trying to sell you one of them as a sure thing along with an underwhelming young player that would require expansion draft protection + a 1st round pick for one of your teams' best players?

No I'm not.

The point isn't Pulock sucks...the point is Pulock is unproven much like those guys I listed were at some point yet their fanbase went on and on about how valuable they were. It's possible Pulock becomes a stud...it's also very possible he doesn't.

The entire point of this thread is that the Avs are in no position to make this kind of trade REGARDLESS if it helps out the Islanders with the expansion draft or not.

 

[IWantSakicAsMyGM]

How does the Metro having more SO wins and OTLs make it a worse division, exactly?

In today's NHL, teams are expected to try and force overtime if necessary and win in the shootout if necessary. Why do only regulation wins should determine which division is better?

Why shouldn't points from regulation and OT wins matter more than OT losses and skills competitions, when determining what is essentially power rankings?

In any event, we're way off topic. The Avs are giving up Landeskog for a package of maybes in order to help a team clear house before expansion.

 

[CodeE]

It depends, am I trying to sell you one of them as a sure thing along with an underwhelming young player that would require expansion draft protection + a 1st round pick for one of your teams' best players?

No I'm not.

The point isn't Pulock sucks...the point is Pulock is unproven much like those guys I listed were at some point yet their fanbase went on and on about how valuable they were. It's possible Pulock becomes a stud...it's also very possible he doesn't.

The entire point of this thread is that the Avs are in no position to make this kind of trade REGARDLESS if it helps out the Islanders with the expansion draft or not.

I'll happily take Mikko + an "underwhelming" former 5th overall pick + a 1st from the Avs for one of my team's best players as long as it isn't JT.

Fans are quick to use the "he hasn't proven anything in the NHL, he might be a bust for all we know!" excuse on other team's blue chip prospects but rarely look at their own prospects through the same lens.

Truth is, every team has prospects that they think are going to develop into studs (except maybe the Rangers), and you can play the "maybe they'll be good, maybe they won't be" game with everyone from Connor McDavid to Andong Song. So while Pulock isn't a 100% guaranteed "sure thing", Isles management feels very strongly about him the same way Avs management feels about Mikko.

 

[EscapedGoat]

We could always include a goalie to send them. Isles have three. To all the Avs fans telling me how great your team is, THIS team you have now obviously isn't working. Changes definitely needed, whether its Landy or Duchene something has to change there. McKinnon would be my only untouchable. Outside of Barrie nobody impresses me on D. Eric Johnson is solid but thats about it. Surprised Roy is still the coach there to be honest. Id be upset if I was an Avs fan.

I don't believe a single Avs fans in here has told you how great their team is. They've been telling you how terrible your trade offer was.

You admitted that a reason for doing this trade was to not lose one of the two players to expansion. So why would Colorado want to lose one of the players to expansion? You're basically saying "we don't want to lose one of them, so give us your best winger and then you guys can lose one of them to expansion instead". Gee, thanks.

Now that you were shown how you know nothing about the Avs or their team needs you are resorting to insulting the team. Pretty typical really.

You say the team isn't set up properly and then claim you are surprised Roy is still the coach. You know the coach doesn't sign or trade players, right? You must know that. It's been said millions of times on here that Sakic runs the team. Roy has a say, but this is Sakic's team.

As far as your comment on how nobody impresses you on D. I'm not really surprised since you've shown a complete lack of awareness of the team in every post so far. Zadorov and Bigras are both really exciting prospects and both could be on the team next year.

I won't even comment on you saying you'll throw a goalie into the trade to make it more fair. Because that's what the Avs need, another goalie.

 

[tucker3434]

I'll happily take Mikko + an "underwhelming" former 5th overall pick + a 1st from the Avs for one of my team's best players as long as it isn't JT.

Fans are quick to use the "he hasn't proven anything in the NHL, he might be a bust for all we know!" excuse on other team's blue chip prospects but rarely look at their own prospects through the same lens.

Truth is, every team has prospects that they think are going to develop into studs (except maybe the Rangers), and you can play the "maybe they'll be good, maybe they won't be" game with everyone from Connor McDavid to Andong Song. So while Pulock isn't a 100% guaranteed "sure thing", Isles management feels very strongly about him the same way Avs management feels about Mikko.

I don't think you'll find many people that believe Rantanen and Pulock are the same caliber of prospect.

 

[Nucklehead Supreme]

We could always include a goalie to send them. Isles have three. To all the Avs fans telling me how great your team is, THIS team you have now obviously isn't working. Changes definitely needed, whether its Landy or Duchene something has to change there. McKinnon would be my only untouchable. Outside of Barrie nobody impresses me on D. Eric Johnson is solid but thats about it. Surprised Roy is still the coach there to be honest. Id be upset if I was an Avs fan.

Why does this always happen on this board... your offering up three maybes and asking for a proven commodity and then wondering why said team with proven commodity doesn't like the trade....

How would you feel if the Av's offered up Jost, Bleackley and a 1st for Tavares? Would that seem fair to you?

 

[CodeE]

I don't think you'll find many people that believe Rantanen and Pulock are the same caliber of prospect.

I have literally NEVER heard that before from another fanbase.

Certainly not about Valeri Nichushkin
Certainly not about Nail Yakupov
Certainly not about Sven Baertschi
Certainly not about Alexander Burmistrov
Certainly not about Magnus Paajarvi-Svensson
Certainly not about Nikita Filatov

 

[tucker3434]

I have literally NEVER heard that before from another fanbase.

Certainly not about Valeri Nichushkin
Certainly not about Nail Yakupov
Certainly not about Sven Baertschi
Certainly not about Alexander Burmistrov
Certainly not about Magnus Paajarvi-Svensson
Certainly not about Nikita Filatov

I don't care. As it stands right this exact moment, GM's would place more value on Rantanen because he is seen as the better prospect. So the fact that you would take a package with Rantanen in it has nothing to do with whether or not we should take one with Pulock in it.

 

[CodeE]

I don't care. As it stands right this exact moment, GM's would place more value on Rantanen because he is seen as the better prospect. So the fact that you would take a package with Rantanen in it has nothing to do with whether or not we should take one with Pulock in it.

You're right, I would take a package with Rantanen in it, because I see him as a very good prospect and wouldn't immediately default to the "no he sucks, he's gonna bust, he hasn't proven anything so please don't insult us by pretending he has trade value" philosophy that ya'll seem to be applying to Pulock.

I'm simply pointing out that every single argument you guys can use to bring down Pulock's value can also be applied to Rantanen, and likewise to every prospect that hasn't proven themselves at the NHL level yet.

 

[tucker3434]

You're right, I would take a package with Rantanen in it, because I see him as a very good prospect and wouldn't immediately default to the "no he sucks, he's gonna bust, he hasn't proven anything so please don't insult us by pretending he has trade value" philosophy that ya'll seem to be applying to Pulock.

I'm simply pointing out that every single argument you guys can use to bring down Pulock's value can also be applied to Rantanen, and likewise to every prospect that hasn't proven themselves at the NHL level yet.

First off, picking up a Rantanen package for your 2nd best/most valuable player solves your roster problem as Rantanen is exempt from the draft. But ignoring that for a second.

I don't think anyone said Pulock was going to bust. We're just not sold that he's going to be great. He would need to be for that trade to be good for us. Trading a young first liner on a good contract for a couple players that end up as 2nd line/pairing and a late first isn't a move that many GM's would be happy making.

You can make whatever argument you want against Rantanen. We aren't shopping him. Part of the reason for that is we wouldn't like the value we'd get coming back in an established player. But Rantanen is exempt from the draft, and we can afford to wait. So we will.

And to circle back to the roster issue. This trade puts us in the exact same spot as you, too many players to protect.

Just doesn't make sense from any angle.

 

[Yashin for President]

I don't believe a single Avs fans in here has told you how great their team is. They've been telling you how terrible your trade offer was.

You admitted that a reason for doing this trade was to not lose one of the two players to expansion. So why would Colorado want to lose one of the players to expansion? You're basically saying "we don't want to lose one of them, so give us your best winger and then you guys can lose one of them to expansion instead". Gee, thanks.

Now that you were shown how you know nothing about the Avs or their team needs you are resorting to insulting the team. Pretty typical really.

You say the team isn't set up properly and then claim you are surprised Roy is still the coach. You know the coach doesn't sign or trade players, right? You must know that. It's been said millions of times on here that Sakic runs the team. Roy has a say, but this is Sakic's team.

As far as your comment on how nobody impresses you on D. I'm not really surprised since you've shown a complete lack of awareness of the team in every post so far. Zadorov and Bigras are both really exciting prospects and both could be on the team next year.

I won't even comment on you saying you'll throw a goalie into the trade to make it more fair. Because that's what the Avs need, another goalie.

I was being sarcastic about the goalie thing. Puluck would be an instant upgrade for the Avs, definitely better than Zadarov and Bigras. The trade I proposed would probably never happen but so would 90% of the trades on this site. Not insulting the Avs, just saying i wouldn't be happy if I was an Avs fan. You guys have so much star power at forward with your D being mediocre. It has to be frustrating.

 

[Makar Goes Fast]

I was being sarcastic about the goalie thing. Puluck would be an instant upgrade for the Avs, definitely better than Zadarov and Bigras. The trade I proposed would probably never happen but so would 90% of the trades on this site. Not insulting the Avs, just saying i wouldn't be happy if I was an Avs fan. You guys have so much star power at forward with your D being mediocre. It has to be frustrating.

no he absolutely would not definitely be better

you may think he would be better, but it absolutely is not definite.

 

[LetsGoIslanders]

The islanders were hot garbage until they suddenly weren't two years ago. I guess it's a good hing you guys panicked and sold low on De Haan, Hamonic, and Strome.

You are -40 in points over two years. In any other organization the coach would get fired. Tell me this a healthy organization. Roy had no business coaching an NHL franchise (see: his QMJHL coaching career) and Sakic had no business managing an NHL franchise.

 

[cgf]

Que? Roy had a strong resume in the Q; whether you rate his NHL work or not; so that's a weird point.

And Sakic has done a good job; though his qualifications at the time of his hiring are a legit critique...even if he has answered any questions swimmingly.

 

[Don Corleone]

Sakic has done a good job

Very debetable.

 

[tucker3434]

I was being sarcastic about the goalie thing. Puluck would be an instant upgrade for the Avs, definitely better than Zadarov and Bigras. The trade I proposed would probably never happen but so would 90% of the trades on this site. Not insulting the Avs, just saying i wouldn't be happy if I was an Avs fan. You guys have so much star power at forward with your D being mediocre. It has to be frustrating.

No, he wouldn't be. That's just you assuming your prospects are better than ours just because they're yours. There's absolutely nothing else to support that.

You are -40 in points over two years. In any other organization the coach would get fired. Tell me this a healthy organization. Roy had no business coaching an NHL franchise (see: his QMJHL coaching career) and Sakic had no business managing an NHL franchise.

I'm 100% cool with firing Roy. I actually really like the roster we have on paper, so I can't really complain about Sakic. And that's why I'm okay with firing Roy.

As has been said, we've got defensive help coming from the prospect pool, and we're cool with waiting til the season starts to see how that turns out. If Roy still can't ice even a below average defense this year, he's probably not going to make it to October 2017.

 

[Pure Slaughter Value]

I'm amazed at how many Isles fans trash other teams records over the last couple of years. We are two seasons removed from picking 5th overall.

I'd say between Zadarov, Pulock and Bigras it's a crapshoot if you're looking for one to be clearly the best out of the three.

 

[Jarey Curry]

We could always include a goalie to send them. Isles have three. To all the Avs fans telling me how great your team is, THIS team you have now obviously isn't working. Changes definitely needed, whether its Landy or Duchene something has to change there. McKinnon would be my only untouchable. Outside of Barrie nobody impresses me on D. Eric Johnson is solid but thats about it. Surprised Roy is still the coach there to be honest. Id be upset if I was an Avs fan.

You'd be a **** if you were an avs fan... Oops you're one now

 

[The Abusement Park]

Very debetable.

He had his growing pains in his first couple years. But he's done a good job dealing with the ****show that was ROR and he's been more than actively looking for defenseman. He's also been smart enough not to gut the team to trade for that defenseman. I think he's grown as a GM considering that this will be his 4th year in the league.

 

[chet1926]

This same logic applies to Mikko Rantanen and Tyson Jost as well, right?

No Avs fans in this thread are touting Rantanen or Jost to be elite level players.

Whereas I've seen multiple Isles fans in this thread, touting Pulock to be the next sure fire top end dman after playing a whole 15 regular season games and 6 playoff games. Which as an Avs fan is hard to take seriously because he's played a whopping 21 games as a NHLer how could one possibly know what his career trajectory is at this point in time.

The poster was just pointing out that many fanbases have touted a certain prospect(s) to be on the up and up and sure fire top end, just have them turn out to be average or even below average.

While I personally think Pulock is a very solid prospect, I'd put him in the same boat as Rantanen. Which is talented, but needs to show what he's got as a full time player before any further analysis can happen. Let's wait a full 82 game season and see where Pulock is at that point.

As for a deal with Landeskog around Pulock, the Avs would be dumb to make such a deal, and if they did take that deal management should be fired immediately. Trade an already established all-star caliber, young, team captain, for a higher end prospect, a question mark player in Strome and a 1st...that's not good business.

 

[SLAPSHOT723]

No Avs fans in this thread are touting Rantanen or Jost to be elite level players.

Whereas I've seen multiple Isles fans in this thread, touting Pulock to be the next sure fire top end dman after playing a whole 15 regular season games and 6 playoff games. Which as an Avs fan is hard to take seriously because he's played a whopping 21 games as a NHLer how could one possibly know what his career trajectory is at this point in time.

The poster was just pointing out that many fanbases have touted a certain prospect(s) to be on the up and up and sure fire top end, just have them turn out to be average or even below average.

While I personally think Pulock is a very solid prospect, I'd put him in the same boat as Rantanen. Which is talented, but needs to show what he's got as a full time player before any further analysis can happen. Let's wait a full 82 game season and see where Pulock is at that point.

As for a deal with Landeskog around Pulock, the Avs would be dumb to make such a deal, and if they did take that deal management should be fired immediately. Trade an already established all-star caliber, young, team captain, for a higher end prospect, a question mark player in Strome and a 1st...that's not good business.

I agree with all of this.

But Pulock showed a lot of promise in his short NHL play. I think he will be a future stud. He reminds me so much of Adrian Aucoin, but could be a lot better.