Yeah, at least we dodged one terrible contract.
Kotkaniemi 5 point game
- Thread starter WhiskeyYerTheDevils
- Start date
- Apr 27, 2005
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That's how math works, yes. That's still a 46 point pace, which is totally a reasonable level of production for a 4.8M player.
Stickpucker
Playmaka
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TropicOfNoReturn
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What other criteria for being a 2C could there be other than, you know, playing 2nd line centre on a top-tier contending team?
That's literally what the term 2C means.
BLNY
Registered User
No one misses KK. He's not, nor is he likely to be, the kind of player you lose sleep over. Would it have been nice for MSL to have been around while he was on the roster? Sure. The club has Dach and they're happy.Habs fans crying - no Tkachuk or Kotkaniemi
Love
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- Feb 29, 2012
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Yeah he’s one of those 2Cs who plays 14 mins a night. Very rare and impressive!
Also Drai is a 2C and RNH is a 3C. Maybe one day RNH can be a 2C on an elite team like Kotkaniemi. Brayden Point is another 2C, maybe one day he can be a 1C.
Being one of the best 64 centres in the NHL is what constitutes a 2C. Kotkaniemi is obviously nowhere close to that.
Is Barrett Hayton a 1C? I mean, he’s on his teams first line and he’s a centre!
KK is #60 in points among Centers. #23 in +/-. #52 in S%. #58 in GWG. #57 in PPG. #36 in Hits. #22 in CF%. #24 in CF%/60.
- Apr 27, 2005
- 35,338
- 33,975
Among the guys listed as center with 200+ faceoffs taken, he's 67th in scoring. And he brings a lot of other stuff to the table besides scoring. So maybe he's not that far off?
Plus consider a lot of those guys still really aren't full time centers. Reinhart, Mittlestadt, Necas, Granlund, Dach etc.
Love
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- Feb 29, 2012
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Sure I think this is a fair take. I said earlier he’s “a good two way 3C who could develop into more” so yes a good two way 3C isn’t that far off from a 2C. I’m not sure why so many people are acting like I hate the guy lol. I don’t think he’s a 2C right now because I would like to see more offensive from him more consistently especially considering his linemates but it wouldn’t surprise me if he grows into that very soon.
We also can’t ignore the fact that Canes fans were bitching about his lack of offensive mere months ago. He’s producing more now but he needs to keep it up for me to actually consider him a legit 2C.
DJB
Registered User
Our nut finally left we now have some hope lol
tarheelhockey
Offside Review Specialist
Sens fans 2022: We'd give our left nut for some hope
Sens fans 2023: Our nut finally left and now we have hope
Cardiac Jerks
Asinine & immoral
They literally used the sarcasm emoji and you still managed to not get it?
Outstanding.
Yeah but a lot of those points shouldn't count when he is just piling them up against bad teams like Tampa Bay
Okay. Excluding the outlier, he has 7 points in 10 games since the start of February, 15 in 26 since Christmas and 22 in 40 since American Thanksgiving.
No matter what sample you want to choose, his production has been solid enough recently. This thread is not bragging about that. It’s pushback against the hyperbole that came from a certain fanbase late last year (i.e. he has one of the worst contracts in the league).
It’s a shame he wasn’t acquired via trade. The assets used to get him and the money he gets is out of alignment with the attention he has received.
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Bruce Granville
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playasRus
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I think everyone knew the day the OS was made that Carolina was going for the long game here. Overpay first 1-2 years, reap the cap hit benefits of the last 5-6 years.
He's on cue for meeting expectations year 2 of the contract, after falling short by about 10 points year 1 on a new team (going 1m x 10 pts).
But having your #2C locked in at under 5M already for the next 5 years while allowing you to retain your home grown top line is a pretty big deal for teams that aren't money bags like NYR/MTL/TOR. Aho and TT won't be loss for cap constraints, and you'll be able to ice a competitive team for quite a while.
Othewise, you play it safe and end up with a Matthew Tkachuk situation where you bridge and they demand even more than they're worth.
Ottawa made that gamble on White, dind't work. Made that Gamble on Tkachuk/Chabot/Stutzle/Norris, and so far, it's paid off for all of them, except maybe Chabot being overpaid by about 0.5M. Unless they regress (Norris pending).
He's on cue for meeting expectations year 2 of the contract, after falling short by about 10 points year 1 on a new team (going 1m x 10 pts).
But having your #2C locked in at under 5M already for the next 5 years while allowing you to retain your home grown top line is a pretty big deal for teams that aren't money bags like NYR/MTL/TOR. Aho and TT won't be loss for cap constraints, and you'll be able to ice a competitive team for quite a while.
Othewise, you play it safe and end up with a Matthew Tkachuk situation where you bridge and they demand even more than they're worth.
Ottawa made that gamble on White, dind't work. Made that Gamble on Tkachuk/Chabot/Stutzle/Norris, and so far, it's paid off for all of them, except maybe Chabot being overpaid by about 0.5M. Unless they regress (Norris pending).
Cardiac Jerks
Asinine & immoral
A lot of people still don’t get it.
teugen
cats on a rampage
- Dec 30, 2015
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playasRus
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I think people on the internet get off on trying to get others down.
You can see examples of this tactic everywhere on every team.
Montreal signed Drouin to a 6 year 5.5 M extension. Sure he had proven more by having just scored 55 points that summer, but he was on a dynamic TBL team and had red flags all over him and they still paid him for potential. You can contrast that 2017 signing to the 2021 signing of KK at 4.8M and well, retrospectively, KK is making almost a million less, while producing similar amounts, and isn't considered a league wide defensive shit show.
So, in that case, Montreal bet wrong (and they were probably wearing red white and blue coloured glasses when they extended him because of his last name.
Toronto's an interesting team where I don't fully understand their rational for paying high cap hits on medium term. I wonder if the cap hits on MM, AM, Nylander would be lower if they'd maxed them to 8 years or been inflated.
Not the end of the world for them but if they'd signed at 1M AAV less each, they probably have been able to keep guys like Connor Brown, Kapanen, Johnsson, Hyman.
Tell me about it. It seems to be happening with Slafkovsky as we speak.
WarriorofTime
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- Jul 3, 2010
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Actually that's even more appropriate for the Canadiens.
And there is no reason for Habs fans to be happy with losing KK because even if he is a 40 pt player he is still better than the piece of crap our nut payed more for (Dvorak).
