Player Discussion Kirby Dach: Welcome to Montreal

[VirginiaMtlExpat]

This board has always been shit at player evaluation...everyone ragged on Matheson as well and it seems like he'll be the opposite of what people here said.

Nonsense. Not everyone. I don't react viscerally to trades in the way that you described. Moreover, I could see that this was favorable in terms of getting a player rehabilitated by the Pens as well as younger and more motivated than Petry.

I didn't have anything to say about it at all. Too early to tell then. Though I was also in Scotland at the time and busy with a conference.

 

[Apfel Struble]

What kind of production could we see from Dach this year? Definitely expecting a jump. 50ish points would be a nice leap.

If he plays consistently like he did in the preseason and gets PP1 or sizeable PP2 and good linemates, I would expect around 50-55 points. If he's 3rd fiddle behind Dvorak and gets little PP time, maybe 35-40 points

 

[MXD]

This board has always been shit at player evaluation...everyone ragged on Matheson as well and it seems like he'll be the opposite of what people here said.

The issue with Matheson was mostly the duration of his contract.

 

[SlafySZN]

He score his goals mostly near the net.

The goal against Toronto was a beauty though

 

[Habs]

He's been good, I am seeing reminders of his days in the W this preseason. We need ya kid

 

[Runner77]

The other thing is trading an asset before it's apparent that they won't reach their potential. I always felt like MB held on to his assets for too long and by the time he decided he didn't want the player anymore, no one else did either. That or he was only willing to move players once it was confirmed to him that the trade wouldn't bite him.

That’s also a function of resources and how a GM avails himself of them.

Bergevin refuted analytics early in his tenure and did not renew the only expert in that discipline that was on staff. He was also very lackadaisical about who he allowed within the coaching ranks so it produced the likes of Michou and Lefebvre as poor sources of information and no emphasis on development. Bergevin also made questionable choices in other appointments and waited too long to ditch Timmins.

The new guys are all the opposite with a multiplicity of resources, state of the art methods, several highly qualified appointments and in high numbers to allow for greater data mining and timely processing of critical information.

We might as well forget what happened with the prior administration, it has zero bearing on what is going on now.

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

He looks really good, gotta keep his head up a bit more tho

 

[Twisted Sinister]

He had 73 points in 62 games as a 17 year old in the WHL which is pretty damn good production. He was already in the NHL at 18, so he never got the chance to play his 18 and 19 year old seasons in the CHL which is where most talented junior players really rack up the points.

But yes, he needs to transfer some of that skill into NHL points now. He can definitely do it though as everything is there for him to succeed.

It's decent production, not mind-blowing. Compare that to Wright getting crapped on for his 94 points in 63 games. As to your other point, I agree wholeheartedly.

EDIT: I guess it is the WHL so it's not too bad.

It’s crazy seeing him play, he always has like 2-3 GOOD chances every game or makes very good plays.

Every game you’re like, oh man he could’ve finished this game with 3 points easy.

It comes down to linemates that can finish his play and him shooting more instead of passing like yesterday when he went through 2-3 players and then tried to pass to Dvorak.

Yeah, I shook my head at that lol. It seems like he might not have confidence in his shot, but I have to say his release looked fine to me on the shootout dinger he had.

 

[SlafySZN]

It's decent production, not mind-blowing. Compare that to Wright getting crapped on for his 94 points in 63 games. As to your other point, I agree wholeheartedly.

EDIT: I guess it is the WHL so it's not too bad.


Yeah, I shook my head at that lol. It seems like he might not have confidence in his shot, but I have to say his release looked fine to me on the shootout dinger he had.

I don’t think we can compare his junior production to Wright.

I also don’t think anyone said that Wright’s production wasn’t good it’s more because he was talked about like a generational player and on the ice and points wise it wasn’t showing that last season. If Bedard score 94 points in 63 games this year people will say it’s not enough for his standard but it’s still great.

Kirby was never seen like a generational guy like Wright was and he was a typical two-way C i don’t think anyone was waiting for him to score 100 points!

 

[417]

It's decent production, not mind-blowing. Compare that to Wright getting crapped on for his 94 points in 63 games. As to your other point, I agree wholeheartedly.

EDIT: I guess it is the WHL so it's not too bad.

Production is largely circumstantial...look at the guys Dach played with on the Saskatoon Blades that year.

Other than him, only 1 player who finished top 10 in scoring on that team was ever drafted by an NHL team (Eric Florchuk, 7th round in 2018) and that player is currently plying his trade in the CWUAA.

He probably produces more with more talent around him.

 

[WeThreeKings]

Comparing Wright to Dach is just nonsense.

They were in separate leagues for one. WHL was a lot harder to score in back then (still is but has gotten more score happy lately) compared to the OHL which is the highest production junior league out there.

Then you compare the fact that Dach grew from like 5'9" to 6'4" in a very short time period. You don't become super coordinated as a teenager in general, but people who undergo massive growth spurts like that have a longer development curve.

 

[themilosh]

Production is largely circumstantial...look at the guys Dach played with on the Saskatoon Blades that year.

Other than him, only 1 player who finished top 10 in scoring on that team was ever drafted by an NHL team (Eric Florchuk, 7th round in 2018) and that player is currently plying his trade in the CWUAA.

He probably produces more with more talent around him.

yeah, then you get the Scherbak's who produce quite nicely in WHL.. Point totals only matter (in Juniors) when comparing players on the same team, or at least league stats. but to compare Wright (OHL) to Dach (WHL) 4 years apart is an exercise in futility.

 

[Habs]

It's decent production, not mind-blowing. Compare that to Wright getting crapped on for his 94 points in 63 games. As to your other point, I agree wholeheartedly.

EDIT: I guess it is the WHL so it's not too bad.


Yeah, I shook my head at that lol. It seems like he might not have confidence in his shot, but I have to say his release looked fine to me on the shootout dinger he had.

I'm curious how the 2 covid seasons in the chl plays out with the inflated stats. No out of conference play, it was pretty watered down competition for a lot of these kids.

 

[BehindTheTimes]

No need to draft Wright or Cooley when you acquire a young C like Kirby Dach.

He is even bigger than both, he have already good two-way game, he have high hockey IQ, great passing ability and great hands.

Suzuki - Dach... that's a very good combo C to me for many years to come. We can easily add Owen Beck in that C core.

Could be a very good 1,2 combo, as it stands now it’s one of the weaker combos in the league.

 

[Kennerback]

Comparing Wright to Dach is just nonsense.

They were in separate leagues for one. WHL was a lot harder to score in back then (still is but has gotten more score happy lately) compared to the OHL which is the highest production junior league out there.

Then you compare the fact that Dach grew from like 5'9" to 6'4" in a very short time period. You don't become super coordinated as a teenager in general, but people who undergo massive growth spurts like that have a longer development curve.

Dach was more of a project. He will never have Wright’s borderline elite shot. If Wright gets his act together, he’ll always have more points than Dach.

 

[WeThreeKings]

Dach was more of a project. He will never have Wright’s borderline elite shot. If Wright gets his act together, he’ll always have more points than Dach.

I don't know if that's necessarily true.. there's things Dach does that if he continues to develop in that area, can produce points at a higher clip than Wright.

Obviously I suspect Wright's worst years goal scoring in his prime would be Dach's best years. But Dach's ability to transition the puck, gain the zone and pass the puck around effortlessly and into dangerous areas lends itself to being able to put up higher assist numbers than Wright's one touch perimeter passing game.

 

[Hannibal]

I love his game so much. Just give him good wingers. But that will hard to do this year. Hopefully he still has a good year with wingers like Drouin, Hoffman, etc.

We are lucky to have him!

 

[Kennerback]

I don't know if that's necessarily true.. there's things Dach does that if he continues to develop in that area, can produce points at a higher clip than Wright.

Obviously I suspect Wright's worst years goal scoring in his prime would be Dach's best years. But Dach's ability to transition the puck, gain the zone and pass the puck around effortlessly and into dangerous areas lends itself to being able to put up higher assist numbers than Wright's one touch perimeter passing game.

We always wanted a big 2-way Center that could produce. Dach could become that. Closest comparable in Seattle is Beniers... Wright is a skilled Center, Denis Savard would be a comparable. Not exactly what we wanted. We win Cups with big Centers not skilled centers.

Messier, Getzlaf, etc... Points in regular seasons don’t give the full picture.

 

[BehindTheTimes]

Dach was more of a project. He will never have Wright’s borderline elite shot. If Wright gets his act together, he’ll always have more points than Dach.

Get his act together haha.

 

[JoelWarlord]

The issue with Matheson was mostly the duration of his contract.

Yeah exactly, and that was a silly thing for people to get wound up about. He's signed for age 28-31 and the worst-case scenario is he's overpaid by 1.5M to be a #5D and PP2 quarterback for us.

 

[Kennerback]

Get his act together haha.

Wish you had a fraction as much confidence in Slaf as you have in Wright. Lol

 

[WeThreeKings]

Get his act together haha.

Yeah like attacking the middle of the ice, paying a physical price to make a play and giving a shit about his junior teammates during a play-off run.

 

[Kennerback]

Yeah like attacking the middle of the ice, paying a physical price to make a play and giving a shit about his junior teammates during a play-off run.

I could add that while his shot is a bullet, he has never shown he had much of a one-timer. Will this limit his scoring? It’s why he didn’t score more on the PP in Kingston... Apparently we would have drafted Wright and it’s all rainbows and skittles.

 

[WeThreeKings]

I could add that while his shot is a bullet, he has never shown he had much of a one-timer. Will this limit his scoring? It’s why he didn’t score more on the PP in Kingston... Apparently we would have drafted Wright and it’s all rainbows and skittles.

One thing which bodes well for Seattle is that Wright has already corrected some of his release mechanics on his wrister.

Even though I was told by the pro-Wright crowd his shot didn't need a mechanical change, he made it because he had to.. Like to see a prospect identify things and work on it, it's just always a big question mark for me on things like motor and inside game. Those things are rarely improved.

Even without it he's a good 2C, it's just unfortunate that he didn't keep the progression curve he was on before the pandemic and made things easy for us.. but also in the same vein, it allowed us to grab a really unique player.

 

[themilosh]

Could be a very good 1,2 combo, as it stands now it’s one of the weaker combos in the league.

exactly. If we can draft/trade for that 100pt C then the forward group will be complete.