Player Discussion Kirby Dach: Welcome to Montreal part 2

[Toene]

I think they should probably just pull him from a game or two just let him reset and look at the game from a different angle.

Then I'd just ride him hard in the 2C role for the rest of the year with Heineman and Laine on his wings.

That could work also. But you'd have to drop Newhook to the 3rd line. Who of Gally, Dvorak or Anderson is then dropping to the 4th?

I personally don't care I'd send both DVO and Andy to Trois-Rivières but St-Louis is in love with these guys and Dvorak is our only competent face-off guy.

 

[Deebs]

I think they should probably just pull him from a game or two just let him reset and look at the game from a different angle.

Then I'd just ride him hard in the 2C role for the rest of the year with Heineman and Laine on his wings.

It wouldn't hurt to let him sit a few games and I would like to see that trio to see how they work. Let Heine skate his balls off all over the ice forechecking (ala Lehky) while Kirby and Laine try to create offensively.

 

[WeThreeKings]

That could work also. But you'd have to drop Newhook to the 3rd line. Who of Gally, Dvorak or Anderson is then dropping to the 4th?

I personally don't care I'd send both DVO and Andy to Trois-Rivières but St-Louis is in love with these guys and Dvorak is our only competent face-off guy.

Gally can slide down.. his extinction burst is over and he's back to producing no offense but working hard.

 

[sampollock]

I give the kid slack, so many brains of the game say it takes a year to get over the surgery he had.
we see how it goes

 

[Kosseca]

Don’t compare reinhart and Bennett with Dach .
Those are actual nhl players that could compete. Bennett was even a menace in the playoffs. Reinhart was in his prime and was easily a 1st line player.
A rebuilding team giving up on a top prospect that’s only 2-3 years in and under 21 is a huge red flag.

There’s no way around that

Oh and Bennett/Reinhart where traded because they where top player on their respective teams?? No... They had red flags or under performing. Bennett was a 4th C/W in Cal.

Chi move away from Dach because they saw an imperfect player, same way Cal move from Bennett at the time. The risk Flo take is the same MTL took. You not liking the outcome to date is irrelevant to these facts.

 

[Saundies]

Dach's biggest problem right now is that he's playing like a 6'4 Max Domi. He could probably have a couple more goals if he actually shot the puck, but he defers way too much to a fault. He's a pass-first player, which is fine, but....

His passing has been garbage this season. Nothing demonstrates this more than his PP shifts. Every time he gets the puck, he either attempts to force something or handles it too long and it gets taken off him. And he's predictable because, like I said, he doesn't shoot. So teams know he's not a threat and pressure him even harder.

I don't know if it's because he's a step or two behind the game, but until this gets resolved I fear he'll keep looking the same.

 

[Kosseca]

I think jumping to conclusions would be constantly assuming the reason this guy is no good is because of an injury that happened more that a year ago.


Can’t make any comparisons, all we do is jump to conclusions .


Not like armia wasn’t a top pick. Traded to a team where he developed into a quality 3rd liner. No Dach is special and so good

Come on, you are saying that a 23yrold player will amount to nothing more then what you have seen from a 31yr old. You may think he's trending that way, but STATING like you did that he'll be nothing more the Armia is jumping to conclusion.

Oh... and I never, never said Dach is special and good. Read my post and you'll see that I'm very clear that he's not living to expectation and not playing as a 2C right now.

 

[Theodore450]

Come on, you are saying that a 23yrold player will amount to nothing more then what you have seen from a 31yr old. You may think he's trending that way, but STATING like you did that he'll be nothing more the Armia is jumping to conclusion.

Oh... and I never, never said Dach is special and good. Read my post and you'll see that I'm very clear that he's not living to expectation and not playing as a 2C right now.

I’ll restate this once more. How is projection a player jumping to conclusions?

I have watched armia career play out and it’s not hard to see Dach having a similar career. Theres nothing wrong with Armia’s career. Not every player gets to be Crosby or Suzuki

 

[Goalfield13]

I give the kid slack, so many brains of the game say it takes a year to get over the surgery he had.
we see how it goes

We can give him slack, but he should not be playing in the top 6. It isn't fair to him or the team. They should give him to game 41 and see how he does. If he still stinks, demote him and let him get his game back slowly in a less pressure-filled role in the bottom 6. Play Laine as 2C in the meantime.

 

[Kosseca]

I’ll restate this once more. How is projection a player jumping to conclusions?

I have watched armia career play out and it’s not hard to see Dach having a similar career. Theres nothing wrong with Armia’s career. Not every player gets to be Crosby or Suzuki

you said "Kirby Dach will have a worse career than Joel armia"
This is a statement that draw a clear conclusion on what Dach will do over is career. This leave no room for Dach to write his own story, you already did it for him and pre-suppose he can't turn things around, which you and I dont know.

Had you said, "if nothing change, he may never amount to anything more then Armia", then yeah, sure, one could think that based on current performance, but does not remove the possibility of other future for the guy.

Unless you have a time machine and you didn't share it with us???

 

[Theodore450]

you said "Kirby Dach will have a worse career than Joel armia"
This is a statement that draw a clear conclusion on what Dach will do over is career. This leave no room for Dach to write his own story, you already did it for him and pre-suppose he can't turn things around, which you and I dont know.

Had you said, "if nothing change, he may never amount to anything more then Armia", then yeah, sure, one could think that based on current performance, but does not remove the possibility of other future for the guy.

Unless you have a time machine and you didn't share it with us???

Dach will have a worse career than Gretzky .

What changes here in this statement?


Does it “ leave no room for Dach to write his own story”

Only your subjective opinion on the player.
Don’t be upset that I’m using benchmarks for his projection.



Armia is better at hockey than 95% of people in the world.
How much more hockey do you need to watch ?

 

[Kosseca]

Dach will have a worse career than Gretzky .

What changes here in this statement?


Does it “ leave no room for Dach to write his own story”

Only your subjective opinion on the player.
Don’t be upset that I’m using benchmarks for his projection.



Armia is better at hockey than 95% of people in the world.
How much more hockey do you need to watch ?

Oh, I see... someone went to the Donald Trump school of public debate.

I guess there is nothing more I can add.

 

[Theodore450]

Oh, I see... someone went to the Donald Trump school of public debate.

I guess there is nothing more I can add.

Yeah seems like it’s you, considering your using an ad hominem when I made a clear point.


If I can say he won’t have a good a career as an Gretzky
Then I can do the same with an average nhl player that has a similar come up.

You’re being disingenuous if you disagree.
You didn’t add much to begin with

 

[LaP]

Dach will have a worse career than Gretzky .

What changes here in this statement?


Does it “ leave no room for Dach to write his own story”

Only your subjective opinion on the player.
Don’t be upset that I’m using benchmarks for his projection.



Armia is better at hockey than 95% of people in the world.
How much more hockey do you need to watch ?

There's a massive difference between saying "Dach will have a worse career than Gretzky " and "Dach will have a worse career than Armia". Most hockey fans will agree that the first statement has a 99.99999% chance to end up being true. The 2nd one is significantly more questionable and like Kosseca said should probably be made in a less imperative manner.

 

[ReHabs]

Putting aside knee-related physical issues, there is likely a mental block between what he can do and what he wants to do. Hesitation is a killer. It’s a fast and violent sport.

What can you do? This is not far from what CHI fans said after he came back from his wrist injury — in his final season with CHI he had a terrible season. He looked better the following season with the Habs. Maybe he’s a very slow healer.

So day after day, until he gets out of it, we will chat about how miserable this is — but I have to say in my decades of following the Habs I’ve never seen something like this. Whoever doesn’t acknowledge how unusual (bizarre, even) this has become is likely in denial.

Surely it’s miserable for Kirby Dach and his family too. It’s a tough situation.

 

[WeThreeKings]

Can't believe Washington didn't see the massive red flags on two teams giving up on a 3rd OA

 

[Tyson]

Can't believe Washington didn't see the massive red flags on two teams giving up on a 3rd OA

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I agree on that one. Arizona gave up way too quickly and of course Chicago has become a Mickey Mouse organization.

 

[morhilane]

Can't believe Washington didn't see the massive red flags on two teams giving up on a 3rd OA

View attachment 946806

That would mean waiting two more years for Dach.

 

[WeThreeKings]

That would mean waiting two more years for Dach.

They can afford to do so, but can also look for external options.

 

[Goalfield13]

They can afford to do so, but can also look for external options.

Or they can put Laine at 2C.

 

[WeThreeKings]

Or they can put Laine at 2C.

No thanks.

 

[morhilane]

They can afford to do so, but can also look for external options.

They will need to find an external options if next season has two rookies at center beside Suzuki/Dach because Dvorak/Evans aren't back anyway.

 

[Goalfield13]

No thanks.

Why? By all accounts, he way good there in Columbus. If this is supposed to be a transition year, why not try the much superior player that is only 26 play the position?

 

[WeThreeKings]

They will need to find an external options if next season has two rookies at center beside Suzuki/Dach because Dvorak/Evans aren't back anyway.

I think they'll find a way to keep Evans around.

Why? By all accounts, he way good there in Columbus. If this is supposed to be a transition year, why not try the much superior player that is only 26 play the position?

I've got a buddy who is a big CBJ fan and his account of the Laine experiment at center was overtly not positive.. and when I've seen it, I didn't think it made sense either.

 

[Goalfield13]

I think they'll find a way to keep Evans around.



I've got a buddy who is a big CBJ fan and his account of the Laine experiment at center was overtly not positive.. and when I've seen it, I didn't think it made sense either.

That's fair. CBJ fans on this site said differently, though. Why not give it a shot if Dach continues to stink up the place after 10 games? Nothing to lose.