Value of: Keller

[BrawlFan]

So what is the value of Keller if you HAD to trade him. If it’s Ottawa for example would a combo of

1st 24 (detroit/boston)
1st 24 (Ottawa)
2nd 25
Brannstrom

Get it done?

Joseph would have to go back due to salary so you’d take him as well.

What do you think Arizona fans?

Click to read more...

 

[rt]

So what is the value of Keller if you HAD to trade him. If it’s Ottawa for example would a combo of

1st 24 (detroit/boston)
1st 24 (Ottawa)
2nd 25
Brannstrom

Get it done?

Joseph would have to go back due to salary so you’d take him as well.

What do you think Arizona fans?

No thanks.

 

[BrawlFan]

No thanks.

Can you, Bill Armstrong, not be the GM of the coyotes for a second and think like a fan on HF and make a counter with those two firsts in mind?

 

[NyQuil]

I was hoping to give Arizona a break after 9 months of different Ottawa offers involving Chychrun.

 

[BrawlFan]

I was hoping to give Arizona a break after 9 months of different Ottawa offers involving Chychrun.

THERE ARE NO BREAKS IN HELL

 

[NyQuil]

As an Ottawa fan, I think we have to start keeping our picks for bit.

 

[BrawlFan]

As an Ottawa fan, I think we have to start keeping our picks for bit.

Even with 5 years of Keller coming back? You’re essentially done then. Your forward and defensive corps is set.

 

[NyQuil]

Even with 5 years of Keller coming back? You’re essentially done then. Your forward and defensive corps is set.

Picks give you a lot of latitude for chemistry issues and injuries as well as injecting new talent into your line-up with extremely valuable ELC contracts under the cap.

To stay competitive over a longer period of time I think you have to keep that talent flowing.

It may look "set" on paper but you're not giving yourself a lot of flexibility if it isn't working on the ice IMO.

 

[Schemp]

Can you, Bill Armstrong, not be the GM of the coyotes for a second and think like a fan on HF and make a counter with those two firsts in mind?

OH, in that case Brady & Pinto...
That's thinking like a HF fan without even bothering the 2 1sts!

 

[NyQuil]

OH, in that case Brady & Pinto...
That's thinking like a HF fan without even bothering the 2 1sts!

You forgot to show what the resulting line-up would look like but only for your team.

That's the HF special.

 

[stempniaksen]

I don't really see any scenario where the Coyotes give him up for anything less than four 1sts worth of value (if at all), so I think at minimum you're looking at 24 1st (OTT) + 24 1st (DET/BOS) + Greig + Ostapchuk + cap dump (Joseph) for Keller and maybe another mid asset.

I understand the logic (for the Sens) though, you nuke the future in hopes of sliding Keller into DeBrincat's spot in the lineup. He's likely a better natural fit next to Norris than DBC ever would have been and obviously is locked up through the Senators expected window of contention. It's high risk/reward because it doesn't leave a lot of flexibility (both cap and asset wise) if things start to go off the rails.

At some point the Coyotes need to start building though and Keller seems like part of the solution.

 

[Schemp]

You forgot to show what the resulting line-up would look like but only for your team.

That's the HF special.

2 1sts, perpetual drafting until they let the Coyotes win a lottery...

 

[Heldig]

Can you, Bill Armstrong, not be the GM of the coyotes for a second and think like a fan on HF and make a counter with those two firsts in mind?

As a fellow Coyotes fan I would ask WHY would the Coyotes trade him?

If Ottawa came asking I want Tkachuk in return.

 

[BrawlFan]

Jeeze. I wonder who costs more. Keller or Mcdavid

 

[KrisLetAngry]

I think any trade with Keller involves a legit roster player.

I think Arizona is trying to play and win games now. You can't stay at the bottom forever and think that's good for business.

 

[NyQuil]

Jeeze. I wonder who costs more. Keller or Mcdavid

You're upset because the fans of the team you want to trade with doesn't want to trade their young star player without a proven commodity in return?

Brady Tkachuk is the same age and scored roughly the same amount of points as Keller.

How many 1sts from a middling team would it take for you to trade him?

 

[Djp]

So what is the value of Keller if you HAD to trade him. If it’s Ottawa for example would a combo of

1st 24 (detroit/boston)
1st 24 (Ottawa)
2nd 25
Brannstrom

Get it done?

Joseph would have to go back due to salary so you’d take him as well.

What do you think Arizona fans?

Arizona said they aren’t trading their top players unless it’s a hockey trade.

try have a bunch of future picks. Thry don’t need more.

 

[XX]

Keller is likely to end up captain and continues to get better the further he gets from the lost developmental years under Rick Tocchet.

A basket of meh value is not going to get a cost controlled player of his caliber.

 

[rt]

Can you, Bill Armstrong, not be the GM of the coyotes for a second and think like a fan on HF and make a counter with those two firsts in mind?

No. Those two 1sts aren’t an interesting base for the deal, so I can’t.

 

[NyQuil]

No. Those two 1sts aren’t an interesting base for the deal, so I can’t.

They are worth a lot more to us than they are to you.

 

[rt]

Jeeze. I wonder who costs more. Keller or Mcdavid

I think it’s just that Keller should cost more, rather than less than Chychrun.

The Chychrun package was superior to the Keller package you’ve offered.

On the 2022 draft floor, the 11th overall pick cost the 27th, 34th, and 45th overall picks. Meanwhile, Chychrun returned the 12th overall and two 2nds, with no cash coming back at all.

Arizona used that budget space and draft capital to modify the roster in a way that provided Durzi, Zucker, Kerfoot, Bjugstad and supposedly (maybe) Matt Dumba.

That, to me, signals two things about your offer;

1) It’s probably not enough value
2) Arizona likely isn’t looking for straight picks

They are worth a lot more to us than they are to you.

Very true. Good point.

 

[rt]

I was hoping to give Arizona a break after 9 months of different Ottawa offers involving Chychrun.

12th overall and a couple of 2nds ended up being a nice return. I think fair for both sides, if Chychrun can stay healthy. I was very bummed to see him get hurt again. I hope he can stay healthy and produce.

Meanwhile, I’m watching archived Loko MHL games from last season every night before I go to bed. Hahaha.

 

[rt]

Arizona said they aren’t trading their top players unless it’s a hockey trade.

try have a bunch of future picks. Thry don’t need more.

I think we saw evidence for this when they traded a 2nd for Durzi. And they also chose to use all the budget space they acquired by taking back $0 at the deadline to sign decent players like Zucker, Kerfoot, Bjugstad (and maybe Dumba) instead of picking up more cap dumps for assets. They’ve begun using assets like draft picks and cap space in order to improve the roster.

I think they’re trying to start the path to being more like Ottawa in their rebuild journey. At least taking the first step (no more tanking, no more cap dumps).

 

[Realgud]

Keller is 24 years old, scored 86 points on a bad team and is on an amazing contract (5 more years at 7.15 aav). I imagine he is extremely valuable and the initial offer in the OP wouldn't even be close to getting it done. Just my opinion.

 

[YotesFan47]

The problem is that the type of player (in contract, production, and age) you're asking for is the type of player we need to add as well. Giving up Kells is counter productive to the goals and time line of the org.

I'm not saying we wouldn't trade him, but it's unlikely. It's like someone asking for Tkuchuck, he checks all your boxes and you don't have an excess of that player currently, it'd take a large sum to pry him away from Ottawa, and likely changes the time lines Ottawa has set.

Chychrun was a similar contract for us, except he asked out when management approached him regarding the subject. The return for Chychrun (who has a few warts, namely health) was solid, and I believe Keller would be worth equal, if not more than 12th OA + 2x 2nds.

Taking all of the factors into consideration, I'd ask for a pick in the 10-15 range, plus 2x picks in the 25-32 range minimum. No idea if someone would pay that, but it's irrelevant because I'd either keep a player I really like in Keller, or get value I deem acceptable. Both are wins.

Now add in Joseph and Brannstrom, players I assume we don't want, that will take up 2 roster spots as well as salary, and you need to compensate us for that. That's what, a 2nd? Maybe more? You might be better off finding homes for them seperate of this deal as you could maybe get value rather than lose value on them.

Just my thoughts, though probably wrong.