Player Discussion Kaapo Kakko

[IDvsEGO]

I have and the thing is that players that have a skill that has an established high point can slump in that skill with confidence such as a shooter (zib) for instance. Confidence goes a long way. The issue is the established high end skill needs to be there first for confidence to have an effect on it. Fox can have a lot of confidence and it won't suddenly make him a good fighter. My point is that laffy put in work to improve his skating, it didn't just happen bc he's more confident in his game bc he's never skates as well as he has this year.

I mean Mackinnon didnt take off until year 5, and then was a consistent ppg guy, and Mackinnon was always a strong skater.
Sometimes guys need a few years, and coming in during covid didnt help his development, not getting that pp didnt help his development, not playing top 6 didnt help his development.

The thing I remember is the run we had 2 years ago, Laf was absolutely the guy who played the way every single ranger fan should want their 1 overall to play. He threw big hits, he scored big goals, and he was scrappy. I would not be surprised if he's our captain eventually.

 

[mrmovies779]

that entire line has become forechecking demons..leave them alone!they really fit well together

 

[bl02]

that entire line has become forechecking demons..leave them alone!they really fit well together

Agreed Agreed Agreed. Just keep getting that puck to the net.
Hope Lavi doesn't touch that line the rest of the way.

 

[bleedblue94]

I think we agree here. His skating improved every off season, according to Dube, especially the last, but it didn’t show until he had confidence. Which he didn’t have in preseason and started building in the regular season. If he had confidence last year he would have looked better last year too, almost certainly not as good as THIS season, but better than he looked last season, and I’m betting he looks even better NEXT season.

But you're making my point. Dube says he's "improved" his skating every year. That's from him putting in the work, not bc he feels better about himself. He's given himself a chance to play confidently by putting in the work for his body to be better prepared and to perform better.

 

[bleedblue94]

I mean Mackinnon didnt take off until year 5, and then was a consistent ppg guy, and Mackinnon was always a strong skater.
Sometimes guys need a few years, and coming in during covid didnt help his development, not getting that pp didnt help his development, not playing top 6 didnt help his development.

The thing I remember is the run we had 2 years ago, Laf was absolutely the guy who played the way every single ranger fan should want their 1 overall to play. He threw big hits, he scored big goals, and he was scrappy. I would not be surprised if he's our captain eventually.

Mac didn't take off till year 5 but you saw spurts of an elite player. We are actually in year 5 of kakko and he's still unable to generate anything on the rush either on his own or with teammates, let alone the other offensive deficiencies.

I'm not saying kakko is worthless, but this delusion about him showing he's going to be a consistent top 6 player is nuts. For every MacKinnon there are about a million christian dube. The offense for some players just does not translate in this league. Slafkovsly has been a whipping boy for two years but unequivocally you can look at him and see he is a top 6 player in the future. Kakko just doesn't have the individual offense to justify a threat to make space and options for other elite players.

EDIT: oh look, 20 year old slafkovsly just pumped a hat trick ha

 

[jay from jersey]

What’s odd to me is why the rangers don’t have their guys in Hartford at least, play both wings sometimes…..
Good wingers, should be able to adapt/adjust on RW as well as LW….
I see players on other teams do it all the time and have success at it.
Until this season, we have Laf. Don’t get me wrong, he’s been great there, but it was rocky at 1st.
Many were adamant he couldn’t make the switch, and it years prior, it didn’t look so good either…..
But to me, having a guy like Kakko or Cuylle or Berard or Othmann etc

The versatility it gives the coach and the ability to create many different types of line combos all throughout the top 9 is very valuable.
It can even maybe jumpstart some guys whose games get stale etc…..

I’d honestly like to see Cuylle-Zibby-Kreider at some point next season maybe….
I just don’t get why we don’t do it more, especially with our young and upcoming guys…..
Panarin/Kreider have been LWs for forever, so I get that don’t fix what’s not broken….
I just get pissed when I see other teams have success with this approach and we don’t even try it seems.

There is a big difference from wing and center… I’m not advocating throwing a guy at C who’s never played it before, but LW/RW isn’t a ton different….
The responsibilities are the same, you’re just on the opposite side of the ice…… anyone else feel this way?

 

[bhamill]

But you're making my point. Dube says he's "improved" his skating every year. That's from him putting in the work, not bc he feels better about himself. He's given himself a chance to play confidently by putting in the work for his body to be better prepared and to perform better.

I literally said “I think we agree here” because we were both saying similar things. You are also making my point as I said the difference between pre season and regular season was confidence… his body was just as prepared in pre season and yet he looked no different than last year according to the “his next contract should be a PTO” crowd.

 

[bleedblue94]

I literally said “I think we agree here” because we were both saying similar things. You are also making my point as I said the difference between pre season and regular season was confidence… his body was just as prepared in pre season and yet he looked no different than last year according to the “his next contract should be a PTO” crowd.

Jesus Christ, this whole thing started with someone else about a comment that they made that he was more confident so he could suddenly skate better. Now you're trying to talk about preseason play vs regular season play. You're arguing something that I'm not arguing and you're talking about something I was never talking about. I'm not talking about overall performance. I was talking specifically about skating and giving laffy credit for putting in the off-season work to be better. He was a mess during preseason but he had a better step. His game has absolutely evolved this year and I am literally giving him credit for physical work he has done to improve his body for the NHL game.

 

[bhamill]

Jesus Christ, this whole thing started with someone else about a comment that they made that he was more confident so he could suddenly skate better. Now you're trying to talk about preseason play vs regular season play. You're arguing something that I'm not arguing and you're talking about something I was never talking about. I'm not talking about overall performance. I was talking specifically about skating and giving laffy credit for putting in the off-season work to be better. He was a mess during preseason but he had a better step. His game has absolutely evolved this year and I am literally giving him credit for physical work he has done to improve his body for the NHL game.

I’ve included pre season vs regular season in the disacussion the entire time. Maybe your argument should be with the other person? It’s easy enough to get wires crossed with multiple parties commenting.

 

[HockeyBasedNYC]

He seems to be getting more shots on net, some are going in, some are getting stopped by stick shafts and becoming tricky pickups for the goaltender. He also seems to be attempting to cut into the slot more often. I've liked his game as of late. That 3rd line has a nice look to them.

 

[80shockeywasbuns]

Until this season, we have Laf. Don’t get me wrong, he’s been great there, but it was rocky at 1st.

I wouldn’t say it was rocky, they never even tried it. He got a few games w Panarin as a rookie, and then maybe a couple short stints with Zib/Kreider where he produced pretty well with solid underlyings. Then Gallant just said it was bad and they went away from it forever

 

[IDvsEGO]

What’s odd to me is why the rangers don’t have their guys in Hartford at least, play both wings sometimes…..
Good wingers, should be able to adapt/adjust on RW as well as LW….
I see players on other teams do it all the time and have success at it.
Until this season, we have Laf. Don’t get me wrong, he’s been great there, but it was rocky at 1st.
Many were adamant he couldn’t make the switch, and it years prior, it didn’t look so good either…..
But to me, having a guy like Kakko or Cuylle or Berard or Othmann etc

The versatility it gives the coach and the ability to create many different types of line combos all throughout the top 9 is very valuable.
It can even maybe jumpstart some guys whose games get stale etc…..

I’d honestly like to see Cuylle-Zibby-Kreider at some point next season maybe….
I just don’t get why we don’t do it more, especially with our young and upcoming guys…..
Panarin/Kreider have been LWs for forever, so I get that don’t fix what’s not broken….
I just get pissed when I see other teams have success with this approach and we don’t even try it seems.

There is a big difference from wing and center… I’m not advocating throwing a guy at C who’s never played it before, but LW/RW isn’t a ton different….
The responsibilities are the same, you’re just on the opposite side of the ice…… anyone else feel this way?

Because hockey isn't a video game? The hardest challenge for alot of young players is defensive responsibilities. And the most effective way to teach that is muscle memory. Repeat the same thing over and over and over. Now add in doing it from the other side, and the player now has to add that half second where they're trying to remember exactly which side they're supposed to be on. Its not difficult from the offensive side, hockey is free flowing and players will just cycle, but when youre trying to teach the defensive side you want to keep it fairly consistent.

 

[bleedblue94]

I’ve included pre season vs regular season in the disacussion the entire time. Maybe your argument should be with the other person? It’s easy enough to get wires crossed with multiple parties commenting.

Agreed, and that is why I said you replied to my comment which was to someone else. Then you have made an argument to me about that comment that I made to someone else about a different topic than what you have tried to argue with me about. My comment way about one specific thing that someone else said so it's hard/frustrating to have my words about that removed from that context to have a different discussion about. That's why I am a bit brash right now.

 

[GENESISPuck94]

I still believe in Kaapo. Next season hopefully he's healthy all season. I think we'll see much more improvement. The foundation is there once he gets the confidence he will take off.

 

[GENESISPuck94]

I think next season there has to be progression in usage as well. Like Laf deserving PP1 time, Kakko deserves PK time. I think he'd be very effective on the PK.

 

[jay from jersey]

Because hockey isn't a video game? The hardest challenge for alot of young players is defensive responsibilities. And the most effective way to teach that is muscle memory. Repeat the same thing over and over and over. Now add in doing it from the other side, and the player now has to add that half second where they're trying to remember exactly which side they're supposed to be on. Its not difficult from the offensive side, hockey is free flowing and players will just cycle, but when youre trying to teach the defensive side you want to keep it fairly consistent.

Video game??? If it was such a tough task there wouldn’t be so many around the league that do it……
I’m not saying every winger needs to, be it shouldn’t be too hard for a player talented enough to be drafted to make the switch.
LW/RW is not rocket science or like learning Latin.
Center has more responsibility, more ground to cover, etc

There are players that make the switch almost seamlessly around the league….
We have Laf who it’s worked for and is young.
Goodrow/vesey can also play both if need be….
I can’t think of a young player NY has even tried on the off wing before laf tbh…

 

[IDvsEGO]

Video game??? If it was such a tough task there wouldn’t be so many around the league that do it……
I’m not saying every winger needs to, be it shouldn’t be too hard for a player talented enough to be drafted to make the switch.
LW/RW is not rocket science or like learning Latin.
Center has more responsibility, more ground to cover, etc

There are players that make the switch almost seamlessly around the league….
We have Laf who it’s worked for and is young.
Goodrow/vesey can also play both if need be….
I can’t think of a young player NY has even tried on the off wing before laf tbh…

You’re comparing guys who’ve been plugs for a while now, to a young kid…
The point I made was that you want a kid to learn the defensive game to make the nhl, you don’t wanna confuse them by adding a wrinkle that stops them for a while.

 

[bhamill]

Agreed, and that is why I said you replied to my comment which was to someone else. Then you have made an argument to me about that comment that I made to someone else about a different topic than what you have tried to argue with me about. My comment way about one specific thing that someone else said so it's hard/frustrating to have my words about that removed from that context to have a different discussion about. That's why I am a bit brash right now.

Well it wouldn’t be the first time I lost track of whom I was talking to. Hahaha. Especially since this has run multiple days. And your attitude is fine. I don’t get offended by a little curtness. I’ve been on the internet for a bit. Hahaha. All good buddy.

 

[NickyFotiu]

But you're making my point. Dube says he's "improved" his skating every year. That's from him putting in the work, not bc he feels better about himself. He's given himself a chance to play confidently by putting in the work for his body to be better prepared and to perform better.

When you can't skate or its obvious you can't keep up at times that can kill confidence. I felt like he looked really bad vs NJ last season, He probably knew he had to improve his skating going forward after that series. Improving his skating and motor probably helped his confidence a lot. I mention motor. Fatigue and not having fatigue can play a big role as well. I remember Laf used to come off the ice fast at times which is not a bad thing but I now see him taking some longer shifts. That may be because he has more faith in his motor now.

 

[UnSandvich]

2 things:
1. Kakko’s skating looked fine earlier this season. Nothing special but league average. It’s only been after missing significant time to a knee injury that he’s looked a lot slower
2. This has been a very forgettable season for Kakko, all things considered. However, one small bright note is that 13 of his 15 points this season are primary, and he definitely has been unlucky in the scoring side of things

 

[Kocur Dill]

What’s odd to me is why the rangers don’t have their guys in Hartford at least, play both wings sometimes…..
Good wingers, should be able to adapt/adjust on RW as well as LW….
I see players on other teams do it all the time and have success at it.
Until this season, we have Laf. Don’t get me wrong, he’s been great there, but it was rocky at 1st.
Many were adamant he couldn’t make the switch, and it years prior, it didn’t look so good either…..
But to me, having a guy like Kakko or Cuylle or Berard or Othmann etc

The versatility it gives the coach and the ability to create many different types of line combos all throughout the top 9 is very valuable.
It can even maybe jumpstart some guys whose games get stale etc…..

I’d honestly like to see Cuylle-Zibby-Kreider at some point next season maybe….
I just don’t get why we don’t do it more, especially with our young and upcoming guys…..
Panarin/Kreider have been LWs for forever, so I get that don’t fix what’s not broken….
I just get pissed when I see other teams have success with this approach and we don’t even try it seems.

There is a big difference from wing and center… I’m not advocating throwing a guy at C who’s never played it before, but LW/RW isn’t a ton different….
The responsibilities are the same, you’re just on the opposite side of the ice…… anyone else feel this way?

Agreed. The base is the same but the shooting options change and that could be beneficial to a kid that had the drop on his opponents in lesser leagues but isn't cutting it in the NHL.

 

[bleedblue94]

When you can't skate or its obvious you can't keep up at times that can kill confidence. I felt like he looked really bad vs NJ last season, He probably knew he had to improve his skating going forward after that series. Improving his skating and motor probably helped his confidence a lot. I mention motor. Fatigue and not having fatigue can play a big role as well. I remember Laf used to come off the ice fast at times which is not a bad thing but I now see him taking some longer shifts. That may be because he has more faith in his motor now.

Again, this isnt he is just skating better bc he has confidence now (that is the comment someone else made that I originally replied to). He put in the work to improve his skating and bc of that and other things he has gained more confidence and his overall game has flourished. I am giving him credit for putting the work in to better his skating

 

[NickyFotiu]

Again, this isnt he is just skating better bc he has confidence now (that is the comment someone else made that I originally replied to). He put in the work to improve his skating and bc of that and other things he has gained more confidence and his overall game has flourished. I am giving him credit for putting the work in to better his skating

That is the big difference. His skating and motor improved. He deserves credit for that. Having Bread at LW does not hurt but Laf gets most the blame when he disappoints so he deserves most the credit when he plays well imo.

 

[bleedblue94]

Well it wouldn’t be the first time I lost track of whom I was talking to. Hahaha. Especially since this has run multiple days. And your attitude is fine. I don’t get offended by a little curtness. I’ve been on the internet for a bit. Hahaha. All good buddy.

Thanks!

I actually do enjoy the conversations and constructive debates with you!

That is the big difference. His skating and motor improved. He deserves credit for that. Having Bread at LW does not hurt but Laf gets most the blame when he disappoints so he deserves most the credit when he plays well imo.

100%, and in past years quite honestly laffy couldn't keep up with bread. I dont care about spurt stats for skating, but even from a conditioning standpoint he looked exhausted midway through games and he couldn't stay at panarin's pace through out shifts. That is all due to laffy's work and improvement during the summer and he deserves the credit!

 

[bhamill]

Thanks!

I actually do enjoy the conversations and constructive debates with you!


100%, and in past years quite honestly laffy couldn't keep up with bread. I dont care about spurt stats for skating, but even from a conditioning standpoint he looked exhausted midway through games and he couldn't stay at panarin's pace through out shifts. That is all due to laffy's work and improvement during the summer and he deserves the credit!

Same buddy.