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Player Discussion Kaapo Kakko: Part III

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Nickmo82 said:
I forget who said it but I have to agree with the idea that Quinn is, while trying to teach Kakko and Laf how to play NHL hockey, kind of suppressing their natural play style. Rookies with high expectations on other teams seem to get more leeway (and more minutes) to play their own game. They'll probably make lots of mistakes, but they'll produce more.

Here's hoping Quinn's method pays off in the long run, because it's pretty dispiriting to see neither of these guys produce.
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The minutes thing really is not true. Lafreniere is 5th in minutes among rookie forward. Two of the guys ahead of him are Kaprizov (23 year old / KHL all star) and Suter (24 years old). Another ahead is Dellandrea which is largely a function of DAL having a bunch of guys on the covid list to start and then Norris who is the 1C on possibly the worst team in the league. He's playing more than Stuztle, Hoglander, Cozens etc. Last year Kakko was 9th but they were really all in a big group after Olofsson who again was a 24 year old.
 
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Nickmo82 said:
I forget who said it but I have to agree with the idea that Quinn is, while trying to teach Kakko and Laf how to play NHL hockey, kind of suppressing their natural play style. Rookies with high expectations on other teams seem to get more leeway (and more minutes) to play their own game. They'll probably make lots of mistakes, but they'll produce more.

Here's hoping Quinn's method pays off in the long run, because it's pretty dispiriting to see neither of these guys produce.
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Stuzle has 3 goals. So do Dahlin & Cozens. Do you think that the fanbase is equally disheartened?

And how many kids from Kakko & Lafreniere's draft class are even playing in the NHL?

Lastly, NO coach out there is going to let a pair of 19 year olds play however they feel like and not adhere to the team structure. No kid comes into the league as a finished product with their own "style". There is a reason you hear the term "learning the game". They learn and their style adapts. This is not exactly rocket science. Perhaps the natural style that allows you to rule Liga or the Q is not really sustainable in the NHL? I don't care who the coach is, not one of them allows teenagers to play their own game while the rest of the team plays a different way.
 
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I would like more power play time for the 2 kids when the PP is not clicking. There may be a bit of hesitation with overexposure. The Devils tried to run the PP1 through Jack Hughes too fast too soon and he may not have been ready for it. Perhaps the coaching staff is afraid to take the kid's gloves off.
 
WojtekWolski86 said:
I would like more power play time for the 2 kids when the PP is not clicking. There may be a bit of hesitation with overexposure. The Devils tried to run the PP1 through Jack Hughes too fast too soon and he may not have been ready for it. Perhaps the coaching staff is afraid to take the kid's gloves off.
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The PP situation is weird because the top unit is absolutely dominating possession, which makes it hard to change between units or to justify swapping guys out, but is also blowing high danger chances it produces. Seems like bad shooting luck but it’s a weird circumstance.
 
haveandare said:
The PP situation is weird because the top unit is absolutely dominating possession, which makes it hard to change between units or to justify swapping guys out, but is also blowing high danger chances it produces. Seems like bad shooting luck but it’s a weird circumstance.
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In my view they are getting danger chances only after they tire out the PKers with possession. Otherwise there isnt enough rotation and having a RH shot on the right, whether it be Strome or Panarin is making it easy for the Pkers to cheat over to the left.

Besides the little give and go between Buch and Panarin the PP is really designed to flow to the left for shots. The slot is never open because there is no threat on the right.

Caps are a perfect example of a PP with threats on both sides. Kuzy on the RW boards cycle the puck low to Backstrom or high to Carlson. They stretch you out to open Oshie/Wilson in the slot or to open the seam to Ovi. Cheat to much to Ovi and they go back door.
 
haveandare said:
The PP situation is weird because the top unit is absolutely dominating possession, which makes it hard to change between units or to justify swapping guys out, but is also blowing high danger chances it produces. Seems like bad shooting luck but it’s a weird circumstance.
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they are passing it around the perimeter. Possession should not be the focal point of a PP.

The reason we have possession is because that's what we're set up for. Players are not aligned in proper shooting lanes. Zibs is the only guy that regularly gets set up either in high slot or for a bad angle goal line chance. When the play breaks down, we create opportunities but that's not because our structure/setup. It also feels like we never come in deep enough on the dots to create high% shooting lanes. Everybody and their mother has watched Washington and Tampa do this for the past decade.

Tried and true 1-3-1. Liike ALL of the high skill/good teams are running and finding enormous success with. We run some amalgamation of it but we do not have the personnel in the right areas.
 
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WojtekWolski86 said:
In my view they are getting danger chances only after they tire out the PKers with possession. Otherwise there isnt enough rotation and having a RH shot on the right, whether it be Strome or Panarin is making it easy for the Pkers to cheat over to the left.

Besides the little give and go between Buch and Panarin the PP is really designed to flow to the left for shots. The slot is never open because there is no threat on the right.

Caps are a perfect example of a PP with threats on both sides. Kuzy on the RW boards cycle the puck low to Backstrom or high to Carlson. They stretch you out to open Oshie/Wilson in the slot or to open the seam to Ovi. Cheat to much to Ovi and they go back door.
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Strome on the right was just dumb, agreed. Wirh Buch on the right, he and Panarin are both open for one timers. Things tend to run through Panarin on the left because he’s the most dangerous scorer on the ice imo. I think everyone else defers to him too much on the PP but I get it to some degree.

Caps have maybe the best PP scorer of all time, so it’s hard to copy their setup and expect similar results. People react to Ovi differently than they would probably anyone else in that position.

duhmetreE said:
they are passing it around the perimeter. Possession should not be the focal point of a PP.

The reason we have possession is because that's what we're set up for. Players are not aligned in proper shooting lanes. Zibs is the only guy that regularly gets set up either in high slot or for a bad angle goal line chance. When the play breaks down, we create opportunities but that's not because our structure/setup. It also feels like we never come in deep enough on the dots to create high% shooting lanes. Everybody and their mother has watched Washington and Tampa do this for the past decade.

Tried and true 1-3-1. Liike ALL of the high skill/good teams are running and finding enormous success with. We run some amalgamation of it but we do not have the personnel in the right areas.
Click to expand...

I’m not saying possession is the most important thing, I’m saying the long stretches of possession without converting recently make it hard to get the second unit out, which throws things off for guys like Kakko and Laf.

Imo they’re getting a good amount of chances - they’re 5th in the league in pp high danger chances for and 11th in pp ice time, so it seems to be producing decent chances. Guys are just flubbing them at a crazy rate so far. Mika alone has blown probably a dozen prime pp chances.

I do think it could be improved but I also think they’re having ridiculously bad luck on the pp chances they’ve been producing so far.
 
haveandare said:
Strome on the right was just dumb, agreed. Wirh Buch on the right, he and Panarin are both open for one timers. Things tend to run through Panarin on the left because he’s the most dangerous scorer on the ice imo. I think everyone else defers to him too much on the PP but I get it to some degree.

Caps have maybe the best PP scorer of all time, so it’s hard to copy their setup and expect similar results. People react to Ovi differently than they would probably anyone else in that position.



I’m not saying possession is the most important thing, I’m saying the long stretches of possession without converting recently make it hard to get the second unit out, which throws things off for guys like Kakko and Laf.

Imo they’re getting a good amount of chances - they’re 5th in the league in pp high danger chances for and 11th in pp ice time, so it seems to be producing decent chances. Guys are just flubbing them at a crazy rate so far. Mika alone has blown probably a dozen prime pp chances.

I do think it could be improved but I also think they’re having ridiculously bad luck on the pp chances they’ve been producing so far.
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Like you said, it will improve once Mika is Mika.

BUT with our talent I see a lot more potential than what's been brought to the tables. It doesn't mean our currently PP can't work. I just think it can be better in creating options.
 
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It's almost as if we shouldn't freak out about teenagers playing in the NHL having ups and downs, and occasionally looking outmatched. Because, you know, they're teenagers playing against grown ass men who make millions of dollars to do this one thing that they've spent their entire lives, to become exceptional at.

Almost.

In reality, Lafreniere is a bust and we should ditch Kakko for PLD before his value starts plummetting again.
 
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ColonialsHockey10 said:
Next game will be a real test for Quinn’s coaching ability.

Kakko was fantastic tonight. The moment the puck dropped he was flying. And he got a boatload of minutes. Clearly he has it in him - it’s up to the coach to ensure he has the ice time and line mates to build on that.
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He actually only got 14 minutes. Pretty much in line with his average so far this year.
 
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All over the ice tonight making plays.

Skating, drawing penalties (the embellishment call was total BS), forcing icings, forechecking, made several (8-10) good defensive plays on the puck, made two plays that directly resulted in goals and an assist.

He needs to stay with that line. It worked and he is improving every game.
 
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Edge said:
When it comes to guys like Kakko, Laf, Miller, even Shesterkin to start this season, I sincerely pray for patience from fans.

These kids have "it" in spades. We just have to give it some patience.
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I'm not sure we need to be patient with Miller. Kid has done everything we have expected so far and so much more. I'm still waiting for his first down game.
 
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