Injury Report: Jets health in the playoffs

[MelikeJets]

Chevy can keep him on the roster, but the HC makes up the lineup card.

Professionals have biases just like everyone else. You hope they have fewer of them or are able to get over them, but they are human. It is no secret that a lot of coaches, scouts and managers in hockey have a size bias. I don't think pride is quite the right word but people have committed to Stanley and they keep hoping he will live up to their commitment. Also very human. It's why my ex wife and I stayed together as long as we did. We both had made a commitment.

Instead of asking why they keep going back to Stanley it might make more sense for us to ask why they keep trying him with a partner who is a bad fit. With the D depth Jets have we should never have seen Stanley/Schenn.

Well put.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Re: bolded

That's exactly what the stats should show if they turned into shots against or xGA (given a proper sample size)

While Stan ranks at the bottom of the Jets defensemen in those numbers, they aren't way out of line. And at the end of the day, somebody needs to be the worst defenseman on the team

His stats say exactly what many of us are saying about him... he's ideally a 7D who can slot in on the bottom pairing provided he has the right partner and his matchups are managed properly

Not exactly a ringing endorsement.
Doesn't exactly align with the words and actions of the Jack Adams nominated, Presidents Trophy winning HC either.

I think you pretty much nail it with the bolded though. We have 2 camps here, pro-Stan thinks he is a good #6, anti-Stan thinks he is a #7 who needs to be sheltered when played. Barely the thickness of a piece of paper separating the 2 camps. Some people even seem to get confused which camp they are in.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

No they don't, they don't show shitty passes that DONT result in turnovers or bad plays in the future. So keep trying.
A puck gets thrown into someones skates, that other person has to change what they were doing, resulting in a chain of events that could go well or go bad. Stats don't show that. That happens 100s of times a game.

That's why we need large data sets. Those things you are describing can go either way but they will be negatives more often than positives. That shows up in the stats in a large enough sample.

 

[Buffdog]

Not exactly a ringing endorsement.
Doesn't exactly align with the words and actions of the Jack Adams nominated, Presidents Trophy winning HC either.

I think you pretty much nail it with the bolded though. We have 2 camps here, pro-Stan thinks he is a good #6, anti-Stan thinks he is a #7 who needs to be sheltered when played. Barely the thickness of a piece of paper separating the 2 camps. Some people even seem to get confused which camp they are in.

There are some people that think that he isn't an NHL defensemen and want the org to move on from him

And I'm not sure if anyone thinks that he's a "good" #6... my personal opinion is that he's adequate there with the right partner and if he's used properly

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

I think Stan's success relies fairly heavily on his partner and his match ups... but the same can be said for any 3rd pairing in the league. There's a reason those guys play on the 3rd pair of their team... if they were better, they would be 2nd pairing guys lol

Yes - but it is more critical for some players than for others. Stan's general, all around slowness makes it particularly important for him to have a partner with some speed. That's why Stanley/Schenn is such a bad idea. Instead of compensating for each other, they magnify each other's flaws.

There are some people that think that he isn't an NHL defensemen and want the org to move on from him

And I'm not sure if anyone thinks that he's a "good" #6... my personal opinion is that he's adequate there with the right partner and if he's used properly

OK, there are extreme fringes in each group. I have posted that I never wanted to see him play another game in a Jets uniform after one of his bad games. But he improved and I backed off a little.

I think a lot of the angst is just frustration when we see him played so often when we have alternatives that are at least potentially better.

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

again.
ARNEIL ..Jack Adams, President's Trophy finalist. 116 points, STARTED STANLEY 60+ times both playoffs and Reg season...

so WHO here has more experience, knowledgeand is closer to the situation than the coach?

if you think your analysis of GFX/F#min dim7th, ChevyCorsica G1M/WA410Y, +- PDODO+ or whatever is soooo amazingly valid? Then why do we win games with him in the lineup? Why does the coach put him in? Again and Again and Again...why does the COACH say he gives us the best chance to win?

Maybe...just maybe... you are using stats you don't really understand, to push a narrative you want, because one time you saw a thing and noticed it instead of ignoring it and moving on like you have with EVERY OTHER PLAYER WHO MAKES MISTAKES IN THE NHL.

Stanley is a 6-7 D-man on a league leading, playoff series winning team...... the coach keeps putting him in....

what are you even talking about?

You may, or may not have arrived in the right place - but this is such a complete appeal to authority it makes me wonder what kind of discussion you think is appropriate. Coach is infallible. He's not even human. A hockey machine. Fold the site.

 

[Buffdog]

You may, or may not have arrived in the right place - but this is such a complete appeal to authority it makes me wonder what kind of discussion you think is appropriate. Coach is infallible. He's not even human. A hockey machine. Fold the site.

Have you watched the PoMo - De Boer video in another thread?

The reason I ask is because if you're going to posit that a coach doesn't know something, then you should have an understanding of what they  do know

That video sheds a bit of light into the careers of a couple of guys that have been in the coaching game at the highest level for 20+ years. I don't even think that we can comprehend the amount of knowledge and understanding that men like that have of the game of hockey and how to deploy a roster

Sure, you're welcome to disagree with guys like that. But it's the equivalent of a hippy mother second guessing their pediatrician because of something they read online. As you said, everyone is entitled to their opinion

 

[Eyeseeing]

Have you watched the PoMo - De Boer video in another thread?

The reason I ask is because if you're going to posit that a coach doesn't know something, then you should have an understanding of what they  do know

That video sheds a bit of light into the careers of a couple of guys that have been in the coaching game at the highest level for 20+ years. I don't even think that we can comprehend the amount of knowledge and understanding that men like that have of the game of hockey and how to deploy a roster

Sure, you're welcome to disagree with guys like that. But it's the equivalent of a hippy mother second guessing their pediatrician because of something they read online. As you said, everyone is entitled to their opinion

Sadly lacking here at times

 

[Mortimer Snerd]

Have you watched the PoMo - De Boer video in another thread?

The reason I ask is because if you're going to posit that a coach doesn't know something, then you should have an understanding of what they  do know

That video sheds a bit of light into the careers of a couple of guys that have been in the coaching game at the highest level for 20+ years. I don't even think that we can comprehend the amount of knowledge and understanding that men like that have of the game of hockey and how to deploy a roster

Sure, you're welcome to disagree with guys like that. But it's the equivalent of a hippy mother second guessing their pediatrician because of something they read online. As you said, everyone is entitled to their opinion

Do you have a link to that video?

Yeah, we can talk a lot here. We can even have some well thought out opinions. But the hockey knowledge of these coaches is enormous compared to any of us here - and at least a few here are pretty knowledgeable themselves.

These coaches played hockey at high levels from very young ages. Many of them were team leaders while they played. At some point while still quite young, they made hockey their life's work. Even the worst of them has huge knowledge of the game.

In spite of that though, they sometimes are wrong. It may be some poor decision making process or a bias of some kind. None of them is perfect. None of them is routinely wrong or they would not be where they are. They have all reached the pinnacle of their profession by succeeding earlier.

And we are each entitled to our own dumbass opinions, no matter how wrong we are.
Discussing them here with other dumbasses is fun and educational. As long as we keep it respectful. It is a big part of fandom.

 

[Adam da bomb]

Yes - but it is more critical for some players than for others. Stan's general, all around slowness makes it particularly important for him to have a partner with some speed. That's why Stanley/Schenn is such a bad idea. Instead of compensating for each other, they magnify each other's flaws.


OK, there are extreme fringes in each group. I have posted that I never wanted to see him play another game in a Jets uniform after one of his bad games. But he improved and I backed off a little.

I think a lot of the angst is just frustration when we see him played so often when we have alternatives that are at least potentially better.

I dont know if the fringe pro Stan ppl are as extreme as no one has ever suggested he is a top 4 player. The most I have ever heard is I don’t mind him or that he is better than Heinola . I think everyone would be happy and is happy when someone else runs with it like Fleury is.
There is still space for Stan to add physicality and be used as a number 7 vs the ppl who just think he should be punted to the moon.

Definitely not as intense as the debates about ehlers usage.

 

[gojetsgo]

-jmo left knee doesn't require surgery but said he wouldn't have been back for the playoffs
-luke schenn cracked ribs after game 2 of the blues series

 

[jungles]

-jmo left knee doesn't require surgery but said he wouldn't have been back for the playoffs
-luke schenn cracked ribs after game 2 of the blues series

Good news on 44.

 

[gojetsgo]

 

[Crocket]

Schenn should not have played with broken ribs. His whole game is hitting guys and that takes away from that. A healthy Miller or Coghlan is a better player

 

[Buffdog]

Is this locker clean out day, or is the org doing some kind of presser?

 

[raideralex99]

Schenn should not have played with broken ribs. His whole game is hitting guys and that takes away from that. A healthy Miller or Coghlan is a better player

That was a big mistake playing Schenn and that explains why he was so bad in games 3-6 in the Blues series.

 

[kanadalainen]

GREAT news about Josh #44, no surgery is a big positive. Thanks for posting.

Cracked ribs for Schenn? No wonder he was getting diced after every hit on the boards. Wow, I take back any shade thrown his way, dude is a warrior. Cracked ribs suck.