Player Discussion Jeremy Swayman -VI President Cam Speaks: Monty, Donny, & Charlie too!

[Gee Wally]

Mod edit: @smithformeragent

As this situation continues to drag on:

Please keep the conversation pertinent to the topic and avoid making it personal.

Debate about the management of the salary cap and the performance of the general manager fits into the context of the conversation, but we’ll avoid dividing fans into camps like “pro-player” and “team apologist”.

Thanks!

Continue if you must. No flaming!

Click to read more...

 

[BruinsFan37]

This is getting silly. When Swayman signs, (I have little doubt that he will sign) all this nonsense will quickly fade away.

 

[The Un4casted Storm]

Without a doubt in my mind it’s Gross and Sweeney holding this up. One is butthurt with Krug and one has the ego to “beat” Gross after the Nylander stuff. If the both are long term is true it’s about AAV and I see Sweeney being the one holding the fort

Could be wrong but it’s just stupid he’s not here. Sound like a 7 vs 9 AAV issue and both of them being dicks about it. Sweeney could and should do the right thing here

What does this mean exactly? That Sweeney should just roll over and give in to Gross' demands? That seems like it would set a bad precedent for negotiations with other RFAs in the future... Poitras? Lohrei? Just threaten to sit out and the Bruins will give you whatever you want...

How did caving in to Gross' hardball tactics work out for the Leafs with Nylander in 2018? Dubas rolling over established the emptiness of his negotiating position and gave the green light for Matthews and Marner to take him to the cleaners shortly after. The Leafs have been a top-heavy team with not cap space for depth ever since.

Heck, how did the Krug contract, that's apparently the source of the bad blood between Sweeney and Gross, work out for the Blues? Last I checked they've marooned him on their version of Robidas island to get some cap relief. Good thing Sweeney didn't cave in to Gross during that negotiation, huh?

At the end of the day both sides stand to lose significantly if this isn't resolved soon. The Bruins are a much worse team without Swayman in the net, I don't think that's debatable. Swayman has a limited number of years to earn money as an NHL player and will never recoup whatever money he loses by sitting out. Both sides need to drop the petty, butthurt crap and meet in the middle to get this resolved. Just my opinion.

 

[KrejciMVP]

Don't think the Swayman camps strategy has worked at all. Pushing the Bruins FO into a corner over and up and coming goalie who hasn't proved he deserves a big contract yet based on resume alone has probably forced Boston into goalie evaluation mode elsewhere already and they will plan to mitigate the drop off with a defensive player to spend the cap space on

 

[Mr. Make-Believe]

Why would you dump Swayman ?

Makes no sense

Not to me it doesn’t.

Ask the anti-Swayman crowd. They’ve been slamming him, his arrogance, his greediness, his selfishness and his lack of experience/success for the last six weeks.

Personally, I think Swayman is every bit as important to the Bruins hopes as McAvoy, Pastrnak and Marchand.

Korpisalo may turn out to be a positive contributor. Remains to be seen. But he’s no Sway.

 

[Guelph Bruin]

If this board was negotiating this contract it still wouldn't be resolved... #2camps ....let's hope common ground is found way before Dec 1

 

[LiseL]

With Shesterkin also negotiating an extension with a self-induced cutoff date of season start, how tied to this deal do we think Swayman’s contract is?

As someone from the outside looking in, Shesterkin wants to set the goalie market, Swayman doesn't want to ruin the goalie market. Remarkable that this storyline is happening at roughly the same time.

If either Shesterkin or Swayman's next contract affects the goalie market going forward, will their respective teams still be able to build a roster capable of winning it all? IMO, the last time a goalie led a middle of the pack team on his back to win the SC was Patrick Roy in 1993 with the Canadiens. It's very difficult to do.

 

[Gee Wally]

As someone from the outside looking in, Shesterkin wants to set the goalie market, Swayman doesn't want to ruin the goalie market. Remarkable that this storyline is happening at roughly the same time.

If either Shesterkin or Swayman's next contract affects the goalie market going forward, will their respective teams still be able to build a roster capable of winning it all? IMO, the last time a goalie led a middle of the pack team on his back to win the SC was Patrick Roy in 1993 with the Canadiens. It's very difficult to do.

Welcome to Marty Walsh’s NHLPA.

For better or worse, theres a new sheriff in town.

 

[Dr Quincy]

What does this mean exactly? That Sweeney should just roll over and give in to Gross' demands? That seems like it would set a bad precedent for negotiations with other RFAs in the future... Poitras? Lohrei? Just threaten to sit out and the Bruins will give you whatever you want...

How did caving in to Gross' hardball tactics work out for the Leafs with Nylander in 2018? Dubas rolling over established the emptiness of his negotiating position and gave the green light for Matthews and Marner to take him to the cleaners shortly after. The Leafs have been a top-heavy team with not cap space for depth ever since.

Heck, how did the Krug contract, that's apparently the source of the bad blood between Sweeney and Gross, work out for the Blues? Last I checked they've marooned him on their version of Robidas island to get some cap relief. Good thing Sweeney didn't cave in to Gross during that negotiation, huh?

At the end of the day both sides stand to lose significantly if this isn't resolved soon. The Bruins are a much worse team without Swayman in the net, I don't think that's debatable. Swayman has a limited number of years to earn money as an NHL player and will never recoup whatever money he loses by sitting out. Both sides need to drop the petty, butthurt crap and meet in the middle to get this resolved. Just my opinion.

I always laugh at this. The NHL isn't the Supreme Court. We don't have Stare Decisis here. A GM is free to pay one guy a certain amount and deny another guy later on.

 

[GordonHowe]

No need for you to apologize, my friend. I was venting at the poor choice of words, the phrase, used by whoever wrote that article.
It's been a bad couple of months for me and today I find myself officially unemployed. Maybe I'll find and open that bottle of Johnny Walker Black stashed in the cabinet under the kitchen counter to sooth my nerves. Won't happen, but it is a thought.

I would be remiss if I did not extend an invitation to join us in the OT: No Politics thread.

Many kind, supportive members there.

Not a few who have been through, or are going through, your particular circumstance.

Come by and say hello. Dip that toe.

We won't bite.

I promise,

M.

 

[LSCII]

Zadorov will not be a 3rd pair D. Did you watch him in the PO? He was more
impactful than any Boston LD man in the PO. Lohre will get 3rd pair reps and some PP time.

Playoffs? He played well for what, 20 games? Look at his career instead since that’s far more indicative of what he is. And he’s always been a 3rd pairing guy. Water always finds its level. Playing him on a top pair or second pairing doesn’t make him that kind of player, it just means you’re playing him out of his natural spot. Looked super solid like a top pairing on that goal a minute ago too, no? LOFL

 

[KrejciMVP]

I always laugh at this. The NHL isn't the Supreme Court. We don't have Stare Decisis here. A GM is free to pay one guy a certain amount and deny another guy later on.

It's really the owner. We know who owns the Bruins

 

[The Un4casted Storm]

They paid Pasta and McAvoy big dollars, so I don't think it's an issue of spending. It really does make you wonder what the hell *is* going on here, though.

I don't know that the issue is big dollars specifically. The Pastrnak and McAvoy contracts were both market value at the time based on comparables and past and projected performances. Pasta's contract, in particular, is already looking like it's going to age extremely well given some of the contracts that have been signed since then.

What makes this Swayman negotiation a bit different imo is that he doesn't have a long resume as an undisputed starter at the NHL level so it makes it difficult to project his future performance with certainty and to identify good comparables. Like if he had Vasilevskiy's track record, I don't think there would be much angst at locking him up long term at big dollars.

As it is, there's a degree of uncertainty and risk associated with the long-term contract that both sides seem to want which makes figuring how much he's worth per year difficult to agree on. Just look at the past few months of Swayman threads here; there's people advocating for $6+ million aav all the way up to a blank cheque and everything in between.

 

[KillerMillerTime]

Playoffs? He played well for what, 20 games? Look at his career instead since that’s far more indicative of what he is. And he’s always been a 3rd pairing guy. Water always finds its level. Playing him on a top pair or second pairing doesn’t make him that kind of player, it just means you’re playing him out of his natural spot. Looked super solid like a top pairing on that goal a minute ago too, no? LOFL

Lol, pre-season chirping.

 

[SwayHeyKid]

Of course not.

But you suggest there were such obvious players available. I would think they would know better than us.

Well considering both players were universally considered replacement players with awful contracts I would assume doing nothing in both cases would have been prudent.

 

[LSCII]

Lol, pre-season chirping.

Nah, just watch. By the end of the season the guy will have played minutes that equate to him being a third pairing. It’s who he is in his dna. Shows flashes but is wildly inconsistent

 

[SwayHeyKid]

What does this mean exactly? That Sweeney should just roll over and give in to Gross' demands? That seems like it would set a bad precedent for negotiations with other RFAs in the future... Poitras? Lohrei? Just threaten to sit out and the Bruins will give you whatever you want...

How did caving in to Gross' hardball tactics work out for the Leafs with Nylander in 2018? Dubas rolling over established the emptiness of his negotiating position and gave the green light for Matthews and Marner to take him to the cleaners shortly after. The Leafs have been a top-heavy team with not cap space for depth ever since.

Heck, how did the Krug contract, that's apparently the source of the bad blood between Sweeney and Gross, work out for the Blues? Last I checked they've marooned him on their version of Robidas island to get some cap relief. Good thing Sweeney didn't cave in to Gross during that negotiation, huh?

At the end of the day both sides stand to lose significantly if this isn't resolved soon. The Bruins are a much worse team without Swayman in the net, I don't think that's debatable. Swayman has a limited number of years to earn money as an NHL player and will never recoup whatever money he loses by sitting out. Both sides need to drop the petty, butthurt crap and meet in the middle to get this resolved. Just my opinion.

going off reports they are ok long term. Make the money work and stop being a penny wise and pond foolish.

Don't care about the Leafs or Nylander. Swayman is franchise goalie, not easy to find.

As far as Krug, I didn't want him anyways but if the old wives tales are correct they Bruins had offered a contract at some point, Krug came back to ink it and they pulled it.

Agree on the pettiness from both sides.

 

[MarchysNoseKnows]

going off reports they are ok long term. Make the money work and stop being a penny wise and pond foolish.

Don't care about the Leafs or Nylander. Swayman is franchise goalie, not easy to find.

As far as Krug, I didn't want him anyways but if the old wives tales are correct they Bruins had offered a contract at some point, Krug came back to ink it and they pulled it.

Agree on the pettiness from both sides.

The old wives tale is they had agreed, then Gross came back asking for more anfter they had an angreement and then Sweeney told him to pound sand.

 

[SwayHeyKid]

The old wives tale is they had agreed, then Gross came back asking for more anfter they had an angreement and then Sweeney told him to pound sand.

well if that is truly it (never heard this one before) then yes Gross should pound sand although honestly I can't believe they would have wanted Krug back at that kind of extension.

 

[MarchysNoseKnows]

well if that is truly it (never heard this one before) then yes Gross should pound sand although honestly I can't believe they would have wanted Krug back at that kind of extension.

Dom has the story. Was told on his pod again a few weeks back. I don’t believe their agreement was anywhere near what he got.

 

[SwayHeyKid]

Dom has the story. Was told on his pod again a few weeks back. I don’t believe their agreement was anywhere near what he got.

Ah ok, then that makes sense. The contract was a complete head scratcher IMO.

 

[The Un4casted Storm]

I always laugh at this. The NHL isn't the Supreme Court. We don't have Stare Decisis here. A GM is free to pay one guy a certain amount and deny another guy later on.

Lol, well, I'm glad I was able to make you laugh then. We could all use a bit more of that in this thread haha

 

[DKH]

Not to me it doesn’t.

Ask the anti-Swayman crowd. They’ve been slamming him, his arrogance, his greediness, his selfishness and his lack of experience/success for the last six weeks.

Personally, I think Swayman is every bit as important to the Bruins hopes as McAvoy, Pastrnak and Marchand.

Korpisalo may turn out to be a positive contributor. Remains to be seen. But he’s no Sway.

You can love Swayman and slam him

I think he’s going to be a star but if he wants 9 M AAV (I’m told he doesn’t) he’s a greedy prick

And STFU about arbitration ~ you sound like a whiney freakin bitch

I would sign him 8/64 or 6/50 tonight both exceed Saros who’s every bit as good and has a resume

He’s going to sign and be better for the experience but his agent brought all this on

I’d fire his ass if he represented me - he’s a media whore obvious to anyone who followed the Nylander saga

The Bruins responded with the 10 M AVV using a radio non-hockey talk show host that hit a bullseye and I’m sure caught Swayman off guard since he knows it’s BS

Gross thought he could throw mud while wearing a new suit - sorry dude this ain’t the Greendale CC human beings they are going up against

 

[Grimey]

You can love Swayman and slam him

I think he’s going to be a star but if he wants 9 M AAV (I’m told he doesn’t) he’s a greedy prick

And STFU about arbitration ~ you sound like a whiney freakin bitch

I would sign him 8/64 or 6/50 tonight both exceed Saros who’s every bit as good and has a resume

He’s going to sign and be better for the experience but his agent brought all this on

I’d fire his ass if he represented me - he’s a media whore obvious to anyone who followed the Nylander saga

The Bruins responded with the 10 M AVV using a radio non-hockey talk show host that hit a bullseye and I’m sure caught Swayman off guard since he knows it’s BS

Gross thought he could throw mud while wearing a new suit - sorry dude this ain’t the Greendale CC human beings they are going up against

Had a good laugh at the Community reference. Was joking that if Utah went with Hockey Club they may as well take a page out of Greendale and call themselves the Utah Human Beings

 

[JoeIsAStud]

You can love Swayman and slam him

I think he’s going to be a star but if he wants 9 M AAV (I’m told he doesn’t) he’s a greedy prick

And STFU about arbitration ~ you sound like a whiney freakin bitch

I would sign him 8/64 or 6/50 tonight both exceed Saros who’s every bit as good and has a resume

He’s going to sign and be better for the experience but his agent brought all this on

I’d fire his ass if he represented me - he’s a media whore obvious to anyone who followed the Nylander saga

The Bruins responded with the 10 M AVV using a radio non-hockey talk show host that hit a bullseye and I’m sure caught Swayman off guard since he knows it’s BS

Gross thought he could throw mud while wearing a new suit - sorry dude this ain’t the Greendale CC human beings they are going up against

yeah this is where I am at. Sway is a smart guy. Certainly smart enough to take a look at PuckPedia and see where the Bruins are against the cap. If he thinks he can get 9+ million then he isn't as smart as he says he is. He was on a team last year that was so cap strapped they could not have the full roster, so he should understand how much pressure that puts on everyone on the roster including the goalies

Right about 8 million for 8 years should work for the team. Allows the team to actually play with a full roster and compete, and is more money than he and his family should be able to spend for the next 5 generations.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

They could have spent less for Korpisalo and easily gotten a better goalie.

And if the choice is Zadorov and no Swayman OR Swayman and no Zadorov it's not even a debate. Having a crap goalie really doesn't make for a better team.


This is ridiculous. They could have easily gotten a player cheaper and better than Korpisalo and they wouldn't have to give up a Vezina goalie to do it (though they also wouldn't have gotten Letourneau). It's ludicrous to say that there weren't better and cheaper goalies available.

The only way they could make a deal for Ullmark was to take Korpisalo back.

Zadorov filled a need. Signing Swayman has nothing to do with signing Zadorov.