Player Discussion Jeremy Swayman -V - all still silent

[MarchysNoseKnows]

Take it with a grain of salt, but Spitting chicklets guys are doubling down and saying Sweeney is “fudging” the truth in his recent press conference. They claim they do know the offer Sweeney gave to Swayman and it was the one they reported from before in the low $6s.

Again take it with a grain of salt because tumors have been very off.

Whit says he stands by the info on no call back for three weeks then immediately says “maybe it’s somewhere in the middle”. Ok.

 

[UncleRico]

Whit says he stands by the info on no call back for three weeks then immediately says “maybe it’s somewhere in the middle”. Ok.

He said “I stand by what I was told, (Sweeney) is going to call me a liar, I think he’s fudging the truth. Now who knows, idk, maybe it’s somewhere in the middle, but I know the offer and it was a lowball, slap in the face offer”

So seems like he admits there may be some gray area in the reported 3 weeks no talking, but he is sure of it being a “slap in the face offer”

Again take it with a grain of salt.

 

[MarchysNoseKnows]

He said “I stand by what I was told, (Sweeney) is going to call me a liar, I think he’s fudging the truth. Now who knows, idk, maybe it’s somewhere in the middle, but I know the offer and it was a lowball, slap in the face offer”

So seems like he admits there may be some gray area in the reported 3 weeks no talking, but he is sure of it being a “slap in the face offer”

Again take it with a grain of salt.

If he knows the offer why isn’t he saying it? Was this just the initial offer or have they come up?

The stupidest thing about all of this is crapping on Sweeney for not choosing arbitration. First, it’s obvious Swayman did not take to that kindly so why would Sweeney do that if he wanted to try to build a long term relationship? Second, if Sweeney went arb Swayman could choose a two year deal and walk himself to UFA. Why would any GM do that?

 

[UncleRico]

If he knows the offer why isn’t he saying it? Was this just the initial offer or have they come up?

The stupidest thing about all of this is crapping on Sweeney for not choosing arbitration. First, it’s obvious Swayman did not take to that kindly so why would Sweeney do that if he wanted to try to build a long term relationship? Second, if Sweeney went arb Swayman could choose a two year deal and walk himself to UFA. Why would any GM do that?

Pretty sure spittin chiclets said a few weeks ago the offer was in the low $6s.

Idk like I said three times take it with a grain of salt.

Obviously you aren’t doing that lol, but not surprising since you freak out any time someone says Sweeney

 

[JoeIsAStud]

The worst thing on this whole scenario might be the fact that I feel compelled to click on this thread on the slight chance there is news, and instead it is just watching agendas spin

 

[YukonCornelius]

The point of reduced workload and the fact Swayman has never been a #1 isn't valid - for one thing, when a team anoints you the #1 in a playoff year you ARE the number one - when said team trades its other goaltender in the off season it is further proof that you are #1.

The idea that he would rise to 5th in salary with a deal like Sorokin got isn't valid either because in the next 2 or 3 years Shesterkin, Oettinger, Demko (if healthy) and possibly an outlier or two among the unproven young guys (given the league's seemingly current policy of locking up their young stars long term earlier and earlier) will have bypassed him.

So if Swayman is 9th or 10th in earnings 4 years from now would anyone call that fair considering most people already consider him in the top echelon of goaltenders and has a good possibility of getting even better while the Bobrovskys and Vasilevskyis decline?

No one knows what has been offered and I'm on board of giving him a long term deal at a minimum of $8.5M - risk? Of course, same risk as any other star who signs a long term deal. If Sweeney doesn't think he's worth it that's his prerogative but you can't blame Swayman for securing his future projected worth among his peers.

I would bet Sway would take a very short term deal to prove his worth, then establish in UFA the demand for him but of course that isn't good for Sweeney, who values him enough to bet the farm on him as his #1 and not let him get to UFA status, but seemingly not willing to pay him top dollar.

The league is shifting rapidly to signing stars early to long term deals, witness the parade of recent "unproven" high dollar contracts - GMs are betting that back halves of contracts will be bargains, sacrificing a few early years of overpayment - seems like a better idea than overpaying for back ends of long term deals doesn't it?

Pay the man.

It’s absolutely valid. Just because the Bruins “annoint” Swayman as their #1 doesn’t mean they should pay him a premium well above what he’s earned based on the full picture of his performance. You can say he’s a victim of circumstance having shared responsibility with Ullmark, but that doesn’t change the fact that he’s still unproven as a stand alone #1, and should not be asking for anything close to $9mm plus.

 

[nORRis8]

because he wants to be paid like a top end goalie.

And there lies the problem...he isn't.

A good goalie yes, even very good yes. Top end at age 25 while sharing duties? No. Could be. But not yet. He has potential. To get paid like you're a somebody and won a Cup? Not happening. Prove it. Still pouting from last years arbitration? Boo hoo. Grow up. The Bruins are trying to build a team not be a "Make Jeremy Swayman Rich Foundation". So hold out. I couldn't give a $#!t.

3......2........1.......

 

[ON3M4N]

And there lies the problem...he isn't.

A good goalie yes, even very good yes. Top end at age 25 while sharing duties? No. Could be. But not yet. He has potential. To get paid like you're a somebody and won a Cup? Not happening. Prove it. Still pouting from last years arbitration? Boo hoo. Grow up. The Bruins are trying to build a team not be a "Make Jeremy Swayman Rich Foundation". So hold out. I couldn't give a $#!t.

3......2........1.......

Contracts aside, what goalies would you rather have over Swayman?

 

[SwayHeyKid]

Pretty sure spittin chiclets said a few weeks ago the offer was in the low $6s.

Idk like I said three times take it with a grain of salt.

Obviously you aren’t doing that lol, but not surprising since you freak out any time someone says Sweeney

What is the weird obsession with the management of this team? Is there a more pro management fanbase in hockey? Sports?

Contracts aside, what goalies would you rather have over Swayman?

Not towards me but I’ll take Igor only

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

What is the weird obsession with the management of this team? Is there a more pro management fanbase in hockey? Sports?


Not towards me but I’ll take Igor only

What???

 

[BigGoalBrad]

As his agent should.



The amount of spinning going on here is hilarious. Don’s going to need to refresh his resume if he plans on a Korpi Bussi pairing because he has to show Swayman who is boss

No employer employee relationships anctually are personal. And these ones the players have are scrutinized by the fanbase and public at large on both ends. I had better companies offer me more than my current job. Right now this second probably should have taken one of them.

I didn’t use that to try and get a raise and I didn’t mention it to my boss either or his boss either.

The reason I turned down more was I sort of want to ride the current role for 30 years until I’m 70. One other job was perfect and as close to an Amazon or google as my industry has everyone would have understood me going it easily could have been leverage etc. And yeah as of right now I’m not sure I made the right call other than I am happy I didn’t say anything to my employers about it. I’ll get a raise another way like performing.

 

[SwayHeyKid]

What???

Question is clear. I guess maybe I should say HF not fans as a whole. Haven't you said numerous times lack of championships aren'tany fault of management?

 

[Dr Hook]

I am not sure why there needs to be a villain in this situation rather than two camps who have their respective positions and don't seem to budging much from them at the moment. It doesn't necessarily make Sweeney cheap or Swayman greedy.

 

[Dizzay]

The way I see it, there must be a sizeable gap between what Swayman is asking vs what the Bruins are willing to go to, whether it be dollars or term.

What I think is fair:
4 years x 7.5 million dollars AAV

Swayman:
1. Ranks him the 6th (really 5th because Price is never playing again) among active goalies. Becoming the 5th highest paid goalie in the NHL after never being the clear cut #1 on your own team in any of his first 3 seasons is an accomplishment on its own.
2. After 4 years, and the cap has gone up as significant as everyone is predicting, he can still cash in for one more big contract.

Bruins:
3. This gives the Bruins some safety as Swayman will have to bet on himself to be the man, no longer supported by Ullmark, for a full season and beyond.
4. There's legitimate qustions what Lindholm will look like now. Does he resemble the 65-80 point player in Calgary or does his regression get worse? How does Marchy look post 3 surgeries? Does Zadorov fit on the top pair at 5 million? If things go south, and a rebuild needs to happen, Swayman at lesser years and $$$$ is much easier to move than Swayman at 8 years. (I dont think the above will happen but it's a business, and with that comes risks).

Don, Jeremy.......4 years x 7.5/per........give him the guaranteed lockout money, let's get er going here. I want to book my Boston trip and I will not be doing so with the chance of seeing Korpisalo and Bussi back to back.

 

[PaulD]

It’s absolutely valid. Just because the Bruins “annoint” Swayman as their #1 doesn’t mean they should pay him a premium well above what he’s earned based on the full picture of his performance. You can say he’s a victim of circumstance having shared responsibility with Ullmark, but that doesn’t change the fact that he’s still unproven as a stand alone #1, and should not be asking for anything close to $9mm plus.

Swayman could be the next Matt Murray for all we know. Murray was great when sharing the load with Fluery. Fluery left after 2nd Cup and Murray's game went south .....permanently.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

Question is clear. I guess maybe I should say HF not fans as a whole. Haven't you said numerous times lack of championships aren'tany fault of management?

Depends on the context of the conversation.

When the Bruins get to the finals or have a great (or greatest ever) regular season and posters blame management for not having the "right kind" of team, yes, I think that is wrong. Not management's fault.

Seems to me there is a ton of anti-management (and ownership) types among Bruins fans both on this site and in general. Nowhere close to the most pro-management fanbase you suggested.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

The way I see it, there must be a sizeable gap between what Swayman is asking vs what the Bruins are willing to go to, whether it be dollars or term.

What I think is fair:
4 years x 7.5 million dollars AAV

Swayman:
1. Ranks him the 6th (really 5th because Price is never playing again) among active goalies. Becoming the 5th highest paid goalie in the NHL after never being the clear cut #1 on your own team in any of his first 3 seasons is an accomplishment on its own.
2. After 4 years, and the cap has gone up as significant as everyone is predicting, he can still cash in for one more big contract.

Bruins:
3. This gives the Bruins some safety as Swayman will have to bet on himself to be the man, no longer supported by Ullmark, for a full season and beyond.
4. There's legitimate qustions what Lindholm will look like now. Does he resemble the 65-80 point player in Calgary or does his regression get worse? How does Marchy look post 3 surgeries? Does Zadorov fit on the top pair at 5 million? If things go south, and a rebuild needs to happen, Swayman at lesser years and $$$$ is much easier to move than Swayman at 8 years. (I dont think the above will happen but it's a business, and with that comes risks).

Don, Jeremy.......4 years x 7.5/per........give him the guaranteed lockout money, let's get er going here. I want to book my Boston trip and I will not be doing so with the chance of seeing Korpisalo and Bussi back to back.

Exactly what I suggested before this whole negotiation even started. Most posters didn't think it was a good idea, wanted more years.

Anyway, very much like your view of fairness.

 

[Eddie Munson]

Contracts aside, what goalies would you rather have over Swayman?

Contract and age aside, I'd take Vasilevskiy, Hellebuyck, Shesterkin. To me those are your elite, top end guys who are work horses and perennial Vezina candidates.

The next tier which I think Swayman is in but all these guys are interchangeable to me (again, age and contract aside): Bobrovsky, Oettinger, Demko, Saros, Sorokin, Markstrom, Ullmark.

So in terms of just skill, I would take the top group over Swayman and the bottom group as a comparable alternative. Anyone else in the league I'd consider a downgrade.

Now that second group, there's guys in there probably in the top-5 annually for Vezina votes but Ullmark and Swayman are the only two I wouldn't currently consider work horses.

 

[Pia8988]

No employer employee relationships anctually are personal. And these ones the players have are scrutinized by the fanbase and public at large on both ends. I had better companies offer me more than my current job. Right now this second probably should have taken one of them.

I didn’t use that to try and get a raise and I didn’t mention it to my boss either or his boss either.

The reason I turned down more was I sort of want to ride the current role for 30 years until I’m 70. One other job was perfect and as close to an Amazon or google as my industry has everyone would have understood me going it easily could have been leverage etc. And yeah as of right now I’m not sure I made the right call other than I am happy I didn’t say anything to my employers about it. I’ll get a raise another way like performing.

If that works out for you great. For the vast majority of the corporate world, it doesn't.

 

[SwayHeyKid]

Depends on the context of the conversation.

When the Bruins get to the finals or have a great (or greatest ever) regular season and posters blame management for not having the "right kind" of team, yes, I think that is wrong. Not management's fault.

Seems to me there is a ton of anti-management (and ownership) types among Bruins fans both on this site and in general. Nowhere close to the most pro-management fanbase you suggested.

Disagree on the last part.

Agree with the above. Advancing past round 2 once in a decade is certainly not a bang up job by this current management team, I think we can all agree with that

Exactly what I suggested before this whole negotiation even started. Most posters didn't think it was a good idea, wanted more years.

Anyway, very much like your view of fairness.

It’s good for everyone but Swayman, agreed there. Fans, management, team, coaches….

 

[EverettMike]

If Swayman believes his AAV should start with an 8 and the Bruins believe it should start with a 6, I think the odds of him being traded are 50/50.

And even then I think the 50% he stays would likely mean him agreeing to a disastrous two-year deal where he tells them he's testing free agency no matter what and they have an even bigger problem soon enough.

 

[wintersej]

Contract and age aside, I'd take Vasilevskiy, Hellebuyck, Shesterkin. To me those are your elite, top end guys who are work horses and perennial Vezina candidates.

The next tier which I think Swayman is in but all these guys are interchangeable to me (again, age and contract aside): Bobrovsky, Oettinger, Demko, Saros, Sorokin, Markstrom, Ullmark.

So in terms of just skill, I would take the top group over Swayman and the bottom group as a comparable alternative. Anyone else in the league I'd consider a downgrade.

Now that second group, there's guys in there probably in the top-5 annually for Vezina votes but Ullmark and Swayman are the only two I wouldn't currently consider work horses.

Exactly. He is a top 10 goalie. He might be closer to 4 than 10, but it's splitting hairs. Him getting paid at the 6th best goalie for 4 years and then a chance to break into that upper tier if he proves it just seems like an obvious win win here.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

Disagree on the last part.

Agree with the above. Advancing past round 2 once in a decade is certainly not a bang up job by this current management team, I think we can all agree with that


It’s good for everyone but Swayman, agreed there. Fans, management, team, coaches….

Making it past the 2nd round means you are in the Final Four. In a 32-team league.

So looking at it in a different way, the Bruins have been top 8 in five of the last eight seasons. Including going to the finals once and having the best regular season ever in another.

So no, I think management has done bang up job. Especially considering needing to stay under a cap and having a dearth of top draft picks.

 

[nORRis8]

Contracts aside, what goalies would you rather have over Swayman?

Whatever the Bruins would pursue would be a step backwards.
Yes I want Swayman to be a Bruin just like everyone else. He knows the system , he knows the defence etc.
Anyone else would have to start from square one.
Right now Korpisalo is looking more and more to be our starter. Fine. He has decent numbers on crappy teams. See what happens.
The guy I did want the Bruins to purse but just got signed by the Canucks was Lankinen.

Other than that anyone else who I say would be trashed by the Jeremy Swayman Hero Squad Fan Club.

 

[Dr Quincy]

It’s absolutely valid. Just because the Bruins “annoint” Swayman as their #1 doesn’t mean they should pay him a premium well above what he’s earned based on the full picture of his performance. You can say he’s a victim of circumstance having shared responsibility with Ullmark, but that doesn’t change the fact that he’s still unproven as a stand alone #1, and should not be asking for anything close to $9mm plus.

So if the B's decide to sign Tyler Johnson, do you think they should offer him 3 or 4 million based on his proven performance? Or should they recognize that paying someone for past achievements instead of what you think they will do in the future may be a bad idea? Or is it really "It depends on which way results in a player getting less $ so that management 'win'?"