Player Discussion Jeremy Swayman III- still nothing

[wintersej]

So deals signed in 2018 should be the benchmark for a deal signed in 2024?

Only sport where a deal signed 6 years ago is the benchmark for today.

I mean how many elite young goalies get signed every year? Is Shesterkin 4x5.6 recent enough?

 

[DKH]

I have to admit the entertainment value of this thread has been fantastic

I’m with you

If they reached a deal tonight I would hope they don’t let it get out till first day of TC

We got a lot of time to kill and the topics to get fired up are slim after this

Hopefully one of the Canadian reporters or the Empty Net guys report Sweeney offered Sway 8 years @ 5 M and mailed it with a pizza stain on it, and the 5 was 5.5 but the second 5 was whited out

Sweeney should be fired is historically the month of September filler anyways

 

[Pia8988]

I mean how many elite young goalies get signed every year? Is Shesterkin 4x5.6 recent enough?

Off his ELC. The Bruins chose to do a shorter bridge. Should have offered him 4 years last season, but they couldn't because of someones incompetence. So here we are.

 

[MarchysNoseKnows]

Hopefully one of the Canadian reporters or the Empty Net guys report Sweeney offered Sway 8 years @ 5 M and mailed it with a pizza stain on it, and the 5 was 5.5 but the second 5 was whited out

@NeelyDan id like to submit this as post of the year please.

 

[Bounces R Way]

Why don't the Bruins simply just sign Swayman to a reasonable contract?

are they stupid?

 

[analyser]

Why don't the Bruins simply just sign Swayman to a reasonable contract?

are they stupid?

What is considered reasonable as their are many opinions on what he is worth. I am sure their is quite a difference on what number Sway and DS have in mind.

It is just a vicious circle and it seems like nobody wants to give an inch.

Should they settle for 6.2 his salary would still increase by close to 65.33%. A lot of people would probably consider this a fair number over a 4 year period considering his lack of NHL experience.

The real value will only come down to what they can negotiate. Hopefully they can somehow come to an agreement.

 

[Mad-Marcus]

That just so much higher than any of the recent elite goalies have gotten, even adjusted by cap hit percentage. I don’t buy it.

I agree, but this is the number that gets it done within reason, IMHO. The cap went up, finally after paying back the COVID kitty. Salaries were somewhat stagnant for 4 years. This is a reasonable ask based on investment in a probable franchise player.
It's around the same $ Tuukka got early in his career. (yes Rask was 1st rounder and had that 2010 season where he easily could have won the Vezina)
Now anything over that is just greed on Team Swayman.
It's a number that shows goodwill from both parties.
I'd love it to come in under 7M, but I don't see that compromise happening.

I don’t understand all the angst towards an agent trying to get his client what he deserves? I mean we all watch hockey for the players no? Is 1-1.5 mil more for a core piece a big deal? There has been more angst shown to Swayman for trying to get his than taking on a horrible contract in Korpisalo.


Core piece, long term fixture, 25 year old goalie who has the balls and moxie to bring this team places. 8x6 is insulting not negotiating

I'm curious what's an agent's percentage these days?

I kid, I kid!

An overlook fact is, if the Bruins weren't in self-imposed Cap Hell, last year, they probably would have, or tried to get a 3-4 year bridge deal done at around 5M. But we all know how the cap mismanagement (bad drafting included) brought us to this point.

 

[KillerMillerTime]

For sure. Mac also needs to play t
within his capabilities He's no Makar or Hughes......but he thinks he is.
Chuck was playing better in 2019 than he is now.

Last year first who #37 and it showed.

 

[Mad-Marcus]

Last year first who #37 and it showed.

Hard to win when you lose most of your defensive zone start FO's

 

[KillerMillerTime]

Is it though? We won’t know until they actually play. And how much does the situation in net impact that? Lots of unknowns as of now.

Grez had literally 7-10 games all year where he maxed out his PMD skills. The rest he was bailing out on in his own end. U will be getting max effort 85% of the time in is own end from Zadorov.

 

[wintersej]

Off his ELC. The Bruins chose to do a shorter bridge. Should have offered him 4 years last season, but they couldn't because of someones incompetence. So here we are.

Swayman had a one year deal off his ELC and because Shest started his ELC at an older age because of the KHL time he wasn’t any further from UFA rights than Swayman.

 

[DKH]

Bruins defense should dominate middle of ice and transition well

Leach will be a good teacher for Louhri and Peeke.

One of the reasons I’d certainly go 8 with the Swaychise is with his Uber skillset and that defense, the addition of EL overall game, Sway is going to put up Buffalo’ Hasek numbers next few years

I’m expecting 8 yrs starting first year at 6 M and high numbers at 10 M at end

Swayman and Boston is a great match in so many ways ~ both should be focused on a long deal

 

[KillerMillerTime]

Damn you to hell.

Seeing those names, and others, might make drink. I won’t. But jeeeeesh!

I was trying to get sober in the early nineties. Hard fought battle. One that was NOT made easier by Bruins teams in the 90, nor those players.

Actually the first 4 years of the 90's were damn good. 1 SCF and 3 ECF in a row with a great 92-93 RS before the MAY DAY disaster.

 

[KrejciMVP]

Bruins defense should dominate middle of ice and transition well

Leach will be a good teacher for Louhri and Peeke.

One of the reasons I’d certainly go 8 with the Swaychise is with his Uber skillset and that defense, the addition of EL overall game, Sway is going to put up Buffalo’ Hasek numbers next few years

I’m expecting 8 yrs starting first year at 6 M and high numbers at 10 M at end

Swayman and Boston is a great match in so many ways ~ both should be focused on a long deal

Hasek was elite of elite and I'd pay him. The Swayman get paid campaign is trying to say he's that guy but odds are he isn't

 

[KillerMillerTime]

Hard to win when you lose most of your defensive zone start FO's

So what was%?

 

[Mad-Marcus]

Overall <50%. I'm looking for an advanced stats site that breaks that down, but all late season that was talked about by the media. It's obviously, loudly, reared its head against FLA.

Good site for Stat Geeks:NHL Team Stats


Only Coyle and Zacha were >50% over the entire season

 

[UncleRico]

Hasek was elite of elite and I'd pay him. The Swayman get paid campaign is trying to say he's that guy but odds are he isn't

I haven’t seen one person compare him to Dominick hasek besides DKH who makes 50 insane comparisons a day and 90% of them are jokes

 

[Dr Quincy]

You are all over the place Doc.

I was talking arbitration and you brought up OHL stats. Those are not admisable stats.

Anyway, I'm just gonna go back to reading this thread. It was more entertaining that way.

I have always believed Swayman should get paid and will go back to waiting to see how it turns out. Just not going to debate all the rumors of which none have been verified to this point.

I'm not all over the place. I know OHL stats aren't usable in arbitration and wasn't suggesting they were. You were challenging Swayman's "true facts" statement, I believe taking what he said overly literal as opposed to what he meant. The B's, as is their right, cherrypicked certain stats to make their case. That's fine, and the stats themselves are true.

But the OVERALL TRUTH may be different than the stats. I could've picked any number of NHL "true stats" that were misleading when comparing players. I chose Poitras, to drive the point home, since I know you have been a big fan of his from the beginning.

I have zero problem with the B's cherrypicking stats at the arbitration that show Swayman is closer to Karel Vejmelka or whoever they used in order to keep his salary down. Nothing unethical about that.

I just think it's a stupid strategy. Like I said, Sway's agent should have warned him about that. But somebody in the B's front office should've said "You know, goalies are fairly emotional, maybe using a really dumb, stupid, misleading comp to save a million on a guy that we think is a huge piece of our future, is just a really dumb shortsighted thing to do."

By the looks of it, I'd say nobody warned Sweeney about that, and the results are what we see today. A somewhat acrimonious negotiation. Swayman will get signed, because neither side really has an option to do otherwise. But will the length be what the B's want? And was that $1m saved for 1 year worth it?

 

[Dr Quincy]

I don’t understand all the angst towards an agent trying to get his client what he deserves? I mean we all watch hockey for the players no? Is 1-1.5 mil more for a core piece a big deal? There has been more angst shown to Swayman for trying to get his than taking on a horrible contract in Korpisalo.


Core piece, long term fixture, 25 year old goalie who has the balls and moxie to bring this team places. 8x6 is insulting not negotiating

Always remember the quote from the movie North Dallas 40 uttered by John Matuszak, complaining about the coach and front office:

Every time I call it a game, you call it a business.
But every time I call it a business, you call it a game.

So it goes for fans as well. They want the front office to take the hard line with players, but if a player uses his rights to act in his best interest we get "Why do they want to get paid so much to play a game?"

 

[Dr Quincy]

I agree, but this is the number that gets it done within reason, IMHO. The cap went up, finally after paying back the COVID kitty. Salaries were somewhat stagnant for 4 years. This is a reasonable ask based on investment in a probable franchise player.
It's around the same $ Tuukka got early in his career. (yes Rask was 1st rounder and had that 2010 season where he easily could have won the Vezina)
Now anything over that is just greed on Team Swayman.
It's a number that shows goodwill from both parties.
I'd love it to come in under 7M, but I don't see that compromise happening.


I'm curious what's an agent's percentage these days?
View attachment 905735 I kid, I kid!

An overlook fact is, if the Bruins weren't in self-imposed Cap Hell, last year, they probably would have, or tried to get a 3-4 year bridge deal done at around 5M. But we all know how the cap mismanagement (bad drafting included) brought us to this point.

They could have chosen the 2 year option during last year's arbitration. That would have left them enough $ to still sign Lindholm, Zadorov and 1 other decent F.

But they didn't. They chose 1 year, meaning here we are now.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

Why don't the Bruins simply just sign Swayman to a reasonable contract?

are they stupid?

Yes, that's it.

 

[DKH]

Hasek was elite of elite and I'd pay him. The Swayman get paid campaign is trying to say he's that guy but odds are he isn't

I think he is going to be - but he doesn’t have track yet

I are betting on him

If you are All in ~ 8 years
Less you aren’t convinced ~ 4 years

I’ve read 8 years 6 M a year 8/48

I’ve read only 4 years 6.2 M 4/25

My conclusion
1. History has shown no one gets the Bruins stuff from their end ahead

Assuming Sweeney, Gold, and Neely are a tight lipped group with information

2. Lot of ‘I thinks and believes’ out there

Is it 4 ? Is it 8?

All just noise to me

Common sense and understanding of the cap the roster, league, team - that it’s humans not fantasy & money is not always the determining factor

Happiness should always be the silver medal and money can get the bronze

So

I’d bet on him long term ~ I think he’s an assassin and will rise to occasion

But my issue is right now I’m not going $10 M average years 1-8. Ridiculous

I want to see a 2-3 year window of high end 54 ish regular season games and the playoff performance we witnessed

The scale of balance and as a Libra I’m at

4/25 at $6.5 M
or my preference
8/60-68 so split it 8/64 at 8M

He starts at 6 and last 2-3 years he is at $10 M

 

[Mad-Marcus]

The Cap freeze screwed Swayman over in terms of not getting a great 2nd, bridge, contract. Debrusk's 1st extension, Charlie's 1st extension, etc(all the B's youngin's went through this, Carlo, Gryz, etc)
He is just in that no man's land of not having fully proved it to get the "franchise" tag.

I have to think most of us expect him to be that franchise goalie, but him and his team to use bitterness of arbitration over the reality that he hasn't fully proven he is a 60+ game(inc PO's) guy, is disingenuous on his part.
He had 1 fantastic run in the playoffs, we've seen this before, and have it disappear. His post All Star game slump is the sobering stat that SHOULD give everyone pause that he has just a little more to prove. I'm glad his confidence has him chest beating that he is just as good as the other top goalies in the league. He just hasn't done it as long or as consistently (he will, just hasn't been around long enough)

So what was%?

They could have chosen the 2 year option during last year's arbitration. That would have left them enough $ to still sign Lindholm, Zadorov and 1 other decent F.

But they didn't. They chose 1 year, meaning here we are now.

They didn't because he would have been a FA, not an RFA coming out of it.


I'll keep beating my chest that 7.5M is the right price, very very good $$ for a 25YO's first big contract. It's top 10ish money, IMO little high for what he has proved, so far, but not disrespectful to him and his camp. It leaves the B's some room to add at the TDL. How many years, well that's the problem, will he take 3 to get more in his prime, or will he take a fair contract that gives him long term security in the event of health issues (no one expects the Spanish Inquisition, do they).

If he expects to get >8, he should expect to be playing somewhere else. Maybe some place w/o a very good defensive team in front of him.

 

[DKH]

Actually the first 4 years of the 90's were damn good. 1 SCF and 3 ECF in a row with a great 92-93 RS before the MAY DAY disaster.

Oh seriously ….that May Day series where Bob Sweeney ruined the Bruins as a Sabres was top 5 toughest

 

[KrejciMVP]

The Cap freeze screwed Swayman over int terms of not getting a great 2nd, bridge, contract. Debrusk's 1st extension, Charlie's 1st extension, etc(all the B's youngin's went through this, Carlo, Gryz, etc)
He is just in that no man's land of not having fully proved it to get the "franchise" tag.

I have to think most of us expect him to be that franchise goalie, but him and his team to use bitterness of arbitration over the reality that he hasn't fully proven he is a 60+ game(inc PO's) guy, is disingenuous on his part.
He had 1 fantastic run in the playoffs, we've seen this before, and have it disappear. His post All Star game slump is the sobering stat that SHOULD give everyone pause that he has just a little more to prove. I'm glad his confidence has him chest beating that he is just as good as the other top goalies in the league. He just hasn't done it as long or as consistently (he will, just hasn't been around long enough)




They didn't because he would have been a FA, not an RFA coming out of it.

If the dude pulled off what the st Louis goalie did in 2019 winning a cup but a rd vs toronto is all his team can't point to