Kevin27nyi
Registered User
- Aug 5, 2009
- 19,990
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James Hagens
- Thread starter blinkman360
- Start date
Island definitely is producing players at college level now and some good success at pro level. Hagens I’d guess has chance to be the guy who makes big impact at nhl level in mold of fox and mcavoy but at forward position. I’m 45 and this success to me is relatively a last twenty or so year thing.
maybe in the middle of his bridge deal he can quietly ask for a trade like Tkachuk did with Calgary .
I might be in a nursing home by then
I might be in a nursing home by then
Tbf you're a pretty weird guy yourself. Figured you'd dig it.
periferal
Registered User
- Jul 5, 2007
- 29,122
- 18,327
Hagens is the type of player you get to draft when you fully commit to a rebuild.
Alas according to too many around here who think any semblence of this team can reach the semifinals again (with Lou as GM), we're not allowed to do that around here, so you'll have to keep dreaming.
Hagens is the type of player you hope you can draft, because if if your team tanks so badly as to be the worst in the league, you have a 1 in 4 chance in getting to draft. Considering that there's a player this good less than half the time at 1st overall, the chance is really less than 1/8 or 12.5%. (There's a player as good as a blue chip prospect as Hagens in about 40% of drafts.)
I can respect it if people say they'll take their (small) chances. But it's both tedious, and, and stupid to have arguments based on misleading (really - false) claims.
Seems like your suggestion of trading Nelson for a 1st rounder may have worked.
2ndGenIslander
Registered User
2ndGenIslander
Registered User
Having watched MD in a video on this board he said, and I paraphrase , If you want a player you make the call don’t wait to hear he might be available you go after him. So maybe he pulls some strings and lands THE KID FROM THE ISLAND. After choosing Schaffer.
Disgraced Cosmonaut
Registered User
I see Hagens dropping to 4 - 7. I think you try to trade for him, if you can but it doesn't seem likely that you take him at 1 OA. Maybe work a few trades back, collecting nice pieces as you go down in the draft.
ScaredStreit
Registered User
Moving Dobson to get Hagens so we can still draft Schaefer is ridiculous. It's basically moving Dobson for a player who might be as good as him one day. If Hagens was from Michigan, Canada, Europe, anywhere other than Long Island this wouldn't be a discussion. Taking the blinders off-yes it would be nice to get Hagens-and sure if he was still projected to be the #1 pick-or even in the conversation-it would be a great story if we got him. But it's just not meant to be and that's fine.
The best thing to do is not to overthink it and take Schaefer. If drafting a defensemen who only played in 17 games is seen as too risky that's fine-take Misa. Taking Hagens at #1 no longer makes sense and neither does moving Dobson to get him.
The last time we drafted 1st overall there were some talks about whether we'd take the defensemen or one of the two forwards. If Duchene was from Long Island and we took him over Tavares or Hedman that would go down as a terrible choice.
The best thing to do is not to overthink it and take Schaefer. If drafting a defensemen who only played in 17 games is seen as too risky that's fine-take Misa. Taking Hagens at #1 no longer makes sense and neither does moving Dobson to get him.
The last time we drafted 1st overall there were some talks about whether we'd take the defensemen or one of the two forwards. If Duchene was from Long Island and we took him over Tavares or Hedman that would go down as a terrible choice.
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My 2 cents with Hagens is he seems to perform well at all the tournaments he plays with guys his own age, and while his first year of college might not be the best in terms of a guy you want to draft #1 I think his size may have played a bit into that.
MY guess is he ends up being a Nick Suzuki kind of guy with the possibility of better
MY guess is he ends up being a Nick Suzuki kind of guy with the possibility of better
Throttle
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- Sep 22, 2020
- 5,421
- 5,144
It makes sense if you don’t feel Dobson is really worth $8-9M long term, beyond his single 70 point season, he’s been a 50 point guy that’s a trainwreck defensively in critical moments and has done nothing to help the power play.
Trading Dobson relieves you of paying that money, you get the PR win with Hagens, also get Schaefer and then have two 1st rounders next year in a deep draft.
You can cover on Dobson fairly well via trade or UFA for known performance and warts.
I’m not into the LI Hagens kool aid, but the Isles can pull it off, it works with repositioning the team, and removes the risky proposition of paying Dobson big money.
But Hagens is not from Michigan, Canada, Europe, or whatever.
He's from the Island.
He's an avowed Islander fan and is the son of hockey person who Long Islanders in the hockey community all know.
And no matter what plateauing or staleness in his progress folks feel they've recognized in a year where he put up a PPG as a pureblood freshman against often older competition and 9 points & a +8 in 7 WJC games on the way to gold, he was THE dominant player in his age group in DY-2 and DY-1.
There wasn't any question coming into the season.
No-one has done at the U18 Worlds what he has. Heck, he outdid Auston Matthews, who like him was one of the few players ever to be at the U18 Worlds and a topscorer for two events before his respective draft year. In fact, Matthews had 22 points combined in two outings. Hagens had 22 points alone at last spring's event, the most ever by a player.
Long story short, he's the closest thing to a prodigal son with franchise face value that this organization has encountered to date.
And none of us should think this won't play a role in the thought process of this organization heading into the draft.
One shouldn't even think it shortsighted.
We've been burned by Tavares. To grab a player of this ilk with an immense possibility that he'd bleed blue & orange and spend his whole career here, is not to be played down or mocked as unimportant.
Especially when the belief is that, overall, he's some mix of Hughes, Cooley, Suzuki, and Beniers moving forward.
So, if you're taking Schaefer 1st overall and then 2 or 3 picks later you've got the opportunity to use Dobson as the key piece in grabbing Hagens, then all the aspects mentioned by @Throttle (James Hagens) are certainly going to play a role and they have a great deal of validity.
Adding to that is that in DeAngelo and Boqvist, you've got options right on the doorstep to cover Dobson's PP role and overall offensive output for the here and now.
And we've got no idea who Darche will be wanting to bring in here via trade or free agency.
Looking at Dobson in a vacuum is unrealistic. We are at a crossroads with him, one way or another.
Decisions have to be made.
The concern of Hagens being selected over Schaefer is very understandable and must be considered highly unlikely.
But thoughts of deals moving Dobson in order to select Hagens are going to sway around the chattersphere over the next month.
And I'd say, with good reason.
Thrasymachus
Registered User
- Jul 1, 2018
- 5,526
- 7,232
This is peak Tavares PTSD
If we have a winning franchise, maybe players will want to play for us regardless of where they were born?
The idea of trading Dobson for a pick that would become Hagens was floated on the trade board and there didn’t seem to be much interest. Chicago has D prospects coming along, Utah is fine with their current group, and Nashville desperately needs a 1C so they’ll probably draft one. Would be nice but I’m more pessimistic about it now.
Dobson straight up for pick 3, 4, or 5 won't be happening.
When we found out the Isles would pick 1st overall, the first thing I started thinking about is how you get Schaefer AND Hagens.
And the first thing stated was that it would hurt. So, a signed Dobson was the starting point and then Ritchie was the most logical attachment.
Now, I realize most will see that as "crazy talk" and straight up, it is. That was also admitted.
But the idea was more about what it would take to make this happen.
Not because it has to.
It's more about if and how much the owners and new management want the BPA and the hometown hero story.
And if it might be, then for me the question becomes if Dobson and Ritchie (and perhaps you throw in Finley) for #3 and Rinzel is doable deal from all sides?
For Chicago, it would basically mean that they're pushing the timeline of the rebuild up a notch. They've got the cap space.
They've got Levshunov, Korchinski, and Vlasic. That blueline starts to look a lot more formiddable.
Would Ritchie for them substitute anything they'd have been after by drafting a Hagens/Frondell/Martone.
For the Isles, it would mean deciding against the big, expensive contract Dobson is getting and also for the addition of hometown Hagens over the much closer Ritchie.
Again, this is not about if it's the best route to go or a thought about "we should do this".
It's solely a look at what might be doable if management were exploring a tolerable way to get both Schaefer and Hagens.
And admittedly, without even considering giving up any '26 picks.
***
I write this thinking that the team simply takes Schaefer and then keeps its ears open for other possibilities.
impaaaaaact
Registered User
All of the teams picking 4-7 need a center. I don't think he gets past Trotz at 5, and while it would be cool to have the LI kid here it would probably be just as cool for Hagens to get drafted by the best coach of his favorite team in his lifetime.
Not sure a message board represents what actual GMs may feel. Top pairing RHD defensemen entering their prime have a lot of value, the only issue may be contract for them but if they can do a trade and sign I think decent chance he can return 4th or 5th pick
ScaredStreit
Registered User
How does he being an Islander fan and form the Island justify passing on better players for him?
I wouldn’t do the deal from Utah’s or Nashville’s side. Had some hopes with Utah but their argument made sense, their bigger need is C. Zero hope with Nashville. They need this pick.
Whether one will choose to call it that or not, the owners are the same ones who experienced Tavares walking away for nothing.
The avenue is certainly open to them finding the scenario involving Hagens' emotional attachment to this franchise and the region to be uniquely attractive for their product - and its longevity.
There are many ways in which Darche can create a winner here.
Hagens would be a good story. He could become a great story. He could even become a legendary story.
It feels like some people feel averse to that... as if those pointing out the unique advantage of his ties to this franchise means they're denying other paths to success.
Since this is a thread entitled "James Hagens", I thought I'd write about a team-building path that includes him.
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