Ivan Demidov vs. Cayden Lindstrom

[Xirik]

Except Lindstrom is nowhere near as good as M Tkachuk. And Kaprizov is likely just as valuable in the playoffs with a decent team around him.

that's your opinion which in your long history of posting has been proven wrong.

 

[EK392000]

Except Lindstrom is nowhere near as good as M Tkachuk. And Kaprizov is likely just as valuable in the playoffs with a decent team around him.

The post you’re responding to is about play styles only.

A feisty power forward vs an ultra skilled winger.

They impact the game in different ways. Poster was just voicing a preference. Not sure how you thought he was suggesting Lindstrom > Matthew Tkachuk.

 

[UED]

Lindstrom is generational but Demidov is a generational generational prospect, it's even better.

 

[CBJx614]

Matthew Tkachuk is like one of the smartest player out there and dominates with his IQ mostly, you're looking probably at something closer to Brady or I'd say even Alex Tuch would be a lot closer. It's still a special, and great player, but the Matthew Tkachuk ones are way out of line.

The post you’re responding to is about play styles only.

A feisty power forward vs an ultra skilled winger.

They impact the game in different ways. Poster was just voicing a preference. Not sure how you thought he was suggesting Lindstrom > Matthew Tkachuk.

This.

Lindstroms IQ might not be his greatest asset, but it's far from one of his weaknesses.

 

[stevo61]

It will be a hard thing to judge really. If Lindstrom is the 2C powerforward behind Fantilli putting up 30-40 or more goals theyll have no regrets regardless of what Demidov does.

Montreal is in the same boat. They rightly feel theyve probably drafted their 1st elite offensive talent in.... forever.

Demidov likely scores a fair bit more points, lindstrom brings some big and nasty. I think they both have the ability to bring offense on their own too which is a plus. Basically it will boil down to how many more points do you think Demidov needs to score to be seen as being more valuable than the big center should they both reach their potential

 

[Mrb1p]

This.

Lindstroms IQ might not be his greatest asset, but it's far from one of his weaknesses.

Then again it would still not be "Matthew Tkachuk" it would be "Alex Tuch". They don't hold the same value.

 

[5cotland]

I am not trying to shit on Demidov or anything here but I honestly think that Demidov is massively over-hyped and unproven.

He has been playing at the junior level in Russia and although he has had a great season at that level, he has little to no experience at all playing high pressure tournaments or the KHL. He will definitely have that time to develop but you would think this is something that would have been an important part of his development by now.

The Russian junior level is extremely poor quality and is important for top prospects from Europe to have that pro experience in their draft year. It is obvious he has a lot of skill but a top 5 pick just seems like a massive reach.

 

[TheBeastCoast]

Then again it would still not be "Matthew Tkachuk" it would be "Alex Tuch". They don't hold the same value.

I think you are selling Lindstrom pretty short if you think his comparable is Alex Tuch, even if I do agree that Matthew Tkachuk isn't perfect comp either.

 

[Michoulicious]

Demidov doesn't have a herniated disc.

 

[Mrb1p]

I think you are selling Lindstrom pretty short if you think his comparable is Alex Tuch, even if I do agree that Matthew Tkachuk isn't perfect comp either.

A 70 pts horse on skates with a shot and physicality? He's exactly that. Mind you Lindstrom may be more nasty but splitting hair..

I am not trying to shit on Demidov or anything here but I honestly think that Demidov is massively over-hyped and unproven.

He has been playing at the junior level in Russia and although he has had a great season at that level, he has little to no experience at all playing high pressure tournaments or the KHL. He will definitely have that time to develop but you would think this is something that would have been an important part of his development by now.

The Russian junior level is extremely poor quality and is important for top prospects from Europe to have that pro experience in their draft year. It is obvious he has a lot of skill but a top 5 pick just seems like a massive reach.

And Lindstrom has played 60 games in the CHL. Your point is invalid.

 

[stevo61]

Demidov doesn't have a herniated disc.

Ok? Id wager good money a good number of people in the NHL right now have herniated disc's if they were checked out but are asymptomatic.

 

[Fantomas]

The Russian junior level is extremely poor quality

Just pulling this out of your a$$, mate

 

[Michoulicious]

Ok? Id wager good money a good number of people in the NHL right now have herniated disc's if they were checked out but are asymptomatic.

Problem is he's one of the symptomatic ones, unfortunately.

Wish him the best, but I had Lindstrom DND for me before #15 for that reason.

Without it he was in my top 10.

Hopefully everything turns out fine and he has a great career! However the difference in talent between him and guys like Iginla, Demidov, Catton, Dickinson, Buium, etc. was not worth the injury risk.

I had Demidov at #2 anyways.

 

[5cotland]

Just pulling this out of your a$$, mate

The MHL is very poor league.

And Lindstrom has played 60 games in the CHL. Your point is invalid.

CHL >>>>>>>> MHL

 

[Rob Sense]

The MHL is very poor league.


CHL >>>>>>>> MHL

Not quite....

NHL Equivalency and Prospect Projection Models: Building the NHL Equivalency Model (Part 2)

A Few Minor Updates on an Established Framework

towardsdatascience.com

 

[Dr Quincy]

Id argue the opposite, if Lindstrom hits his ceiling you're looking at a Matthew Tkachuk level guy, how many of those exists in the NHL? Not many guys can produce at that level with that style of play.

Granted, I think Demidov is more likely to hit his potential, but his playstyle comes with it's own set of challenges as well.

I'd argue that he's not at all like Tkachuk. Yes he's physical but that's about it. He completely lacks Tkachuk's vision and passing. Lindstrom's upside is still a rare commodity- a competitive, physical goal scorer. But you are giving him traits he's never displayed at a lower level and suggesting that they will develop at a higher level. It's possible but there's nothing to suggest that they are there.
I really don't see Lindstrom as a 69 assist guy in the NHL.

I like Demidov's upside more and think he has a likelier chance of hitting his upside. I like Lindstrom a lot as a player and don't think a team was wrong for selecting him over Demidov, but it's definitely not what I would have done.

 

[Felidae]

The MHL is very poor league.


CHL >>>>>>>> MHL

Let's say for the sake of argument what you're saying is true.

Demidov for his age group has still produced at a rate in the MHL only rivaled by 2 other players. Michkov who has proven himself in the KHL and tournaments, and Kucherov.

that's massive potential that can't be overlooked regardless of league quality.

 

[General Fanager]

I do not remember even 1 mock or scouting report that had Lindstrom before Demidov.

Its hilarious now that The Habs have Demidov he is somehow over rated and The Habs made a mistake....

 

[Mrb1p]

The MHL is very poor league.


CHL >>>>>>>> MHL

Yes, but not the WHL who's the weaker of the three Canadian leagues. Especially when you consider the gold division of the MHL, that's probably stronger than the WHL.

It just makes senses that a 37 team league of one country would be stronger than a league of a 22 teams from three provinces.

 

[viceroy]

Lindstrom is generational but Demidov is a generational generational prospect, it's even better.

I don't think either are anywhere near generational. Heck Celebrini ain't either.

It is obvious he has a lot of skill but a top 5 pick just seems like a massive reach.

So you think drafting Demidov at 5th is a reach? Ivan Demidov? The guy who's ranked #2 on most Draft lists? Okie dokie.

Not quite....View attachment 893228

NHL Equivalency and Prospect Projection Models: Building the NHL Equivalency Model (Part 2)

A Few Minor Updates on an Established Framework

towardsdatascience.com

Man am I crazy or does that list say the LNAH is higher than the NCAA? Division1 NCAA? And by LNAH do they mean Ligue Nord-Americaine de Hockey? i.e. Quebec Semi-Pro?

Yes, but not the WHL who's the weaker of the three Canadian leagues.

You don't think the Q is the weakest?

 

[Mrb1p]

I don't think either are anywhere near generational. Heck Celebrini ain't either.



So you think drafting Demidov at 5th is a reach? Ivan Demidov? The guy who's ranked #2 on most Draft lists? Okie dokie.



Man am I crazy or does that list say the LNAH is higher than the NCAA? Division1 NCAA? And by LNAH they mean Ligue Nord-Americaine de Hockey? i.e. Quebec Semi-Pro?



You don't think the Q is the weakest?

Not anymore. I see a lot of CHL and I figure the WHL, especially goaltending are absolutely bad. I think there's also no depth to most teams, it's one or two players, maybe two lines and then guys that shouldn't be in the WHL. I guess the BCHL is leeching a bit of talent, and of course the USHL/NCAA. The league has also devolved into a soft high offense with mostly back and forth rush offense. The grind is a lot more present in the Q.

The top guys are obviously as good or better. I

 

[Gravity]

Is there a reason we need all these Demidov vs threads? OP isn't even a Habs fan.

 

[Gravity]

It will be a hard thing to judge really. If Lindstrom is the 2C powerforward behind Fantilli putting up 30-40 or more goals theyll have no regrets regardless of what Demidov does.

Montreal is in the same boat. They rightly feel theyve probably drafted their 1st elite offensive talent in.... forever.

Demidov likely scores a fair bit more points, lindstrom brings some big and nasty. I think they both have the ability to bring offense on their own too which is a plus. Basically it will boil down to how many more points do you think Demidov needs to score to be seen as being more valuable than the big center should they both reach their potential

*If* Lindstrom sticks at C. If he's a winger, we won't regret it much given he went before our pick and we already have a big beast in Slafkovsky.

 

[Dr Quincy]

I do not remember even 1 mock or scouting report that had Lindstrom before Demidov.

Its hilarious now that The Habs have Demidov he is somehow over rated and The Habs made a mistake....

Hockey Prospect Black Book has Lindstrom 2nd and Demidov 4th. But I do think MOST lists had Demidov higher, as do I.

 

[Just Linda]

Not quite....View attachment 893228

NHL Equivalency and Prospect Projection Models: Building the NHL Equivalency Model (Part 2)

A Few Minor Updates on an Established Framework

towardsdatascience.com

Not to be a contrarian but that's a pretty outdated list. It includes numbers from before Russia's leagues saw a severe drop in talent due to a drop in foreign talent.