Is Vilardi the most expendable prospect?

[Raccoon Jesus]

This is not a guy you move because he couldn't hack it at C, especially when everyone and their grandma and Lt. Dan's legs seem to agree he's got a W game anyway, and with a million Cs in the org.







This is a guy you develop and put in a position to succeed, not turn into a 4C. I'm concerned he's getting Clague'd and his handling coming off this road trip will speak loudly of what the org thinks of him.

 

[johnjm22]

His shooting has been the biggest surprise about his game. Problem is, he's rarely in a position to use it.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

His shooting has been the biggest surprise about his game. Problem is, he's rarely in a position to use it.

Because they've been overly concerned at playing him 8 minutes at center on the 4th line in the Dzone.

Put your people in a position to play to their strengths. Making Vilardi cover 200ft of ice in a defensive role ain't it.

Bringing this one back as it's relevant again

 

[lumbergh]

I don’t think his skating is why he’s struggling. It’s Vilardi’s ability to drive play. He needs to further develop his abilities to win puck battles, find space and time, and enter the zone with control. He’s finding himself on the wrong side of the puck or out of the play a lot and it’s like playing a man down.

These are things he could be working on with Wrobo in Ontario. It’s where he should be when he emerges from COVID purgatory. He’ll come back a better player.

 

[johnjm22]

Because they've been overly concerned at playing him 8 minutes at center on the 4th line in the Dzone.

Put your people in a position to play to their strengths. Making Vilardi cover 200ft of ice in a defensive role ain't it.

The majority of his starts have come in the offensive zone. He's always gotten some PP time.

In order to have an opportunity to shoot the puck, you have to be outplaying your opponent.

Vilardi Shots Per 60min by year:
19/20 8.4
20/21 4.4
21/22 2.4

It's gotten progressively worse.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

The majority of his starts have come in the offensive zone. He's always gotten some PP time.

In order to have an opportunity to shoot the puck, you have to be outplaying your opponent.

Vilardi Shots Per 60min by year:
19/20 8.4
20/21 4.4
21/22 2.4

It's gotten progressively worse.

That's just objectively wrong. The only regular forward with a lower % of ozone starts this year is Danault. Vilardi hasn't even started 45% of his shifts in the ozone. Kaliyev, on the flipside, has started 60. One's being used as a weapon, one is being buried.

Makes sense if you want to forge him into a C, but I think most of us agree that's a silly thing to do in this org at this point.

 

[kingsfan28]

Nope. There are plenty including Kupari. He's playing well at times since the call up, but Byfield has his spot already and it's too early to claim he's a legit NHL player. Too many are willng to toss away Valardi because in his 70 or so games, he hasn't figured it out yet. Give him time.

Now imagine if we got Jack Hughes, I bet we'd see people calling for him to be traded too, because he's only score 20 goals in 115 games. And btw, Valardi has 4 fewer points in 45 fewer games than Hughes.

 

[Kurrilino]

Actually i would like to see what he can do with 2 speedy wingers.
I never thought i would say this but i can see him center Iafallo and Kempe.

For now, i would give him some time in Ontario and go for the cup, when he comes back he should have some more tries at Center
in 22/23.
If that doesn't do it, we still can move him to wing. This guy is 22, not 32

 

[johnjm22]

That's just objectively wrong. The only regular forward with a lower % of ozone starts this year is Danault. Vilardi hasn't even started 45% of his shifts in the ozone. Kaliyev, on the flipside, has started 60. One's being used as a weapon, one is being buried.

Makes sense if you want to forge him into a C, but I think most of us agree that's a silly thing to do in this org at this point.

TOTAL:

EVEN STRENGTH ONLY:

Are you getting your numbers somewhere different than me?

He was playing 14:33 per game with 1:56 of PP time per game.

And still only had 7 shots in 7 games.

 

[Statto]

When the Kings acquired Lias Andersson from the Rangers for a late 2nd round pick, Lias was in a similar situation as Vilardi is now: a struggling former 1st round pick.

You've got to think Vilardi's value is probably something similar.

IMO, since he likely has such little value, you might as well hold on to him and try and develop him on wing.

With the Kings having a lot of prospects Vilardi should be concerned about getting passed up on the organization depth chart. Kupari and Kaliyev have likely passed him already.

Agreed. A 2nd round pick does little for us at this stage of development and you only let someone with his talent go to fill a meaningful hole and right now we wouldn’t get true value for his talent.

In the worst case he busts out here. I would prefer that over sending him away for almost nothing to see him explode somewhere else.

That’s my feeling exactly. If he completely busts now at worst we lose out on a 2nd rounder, but the pay off is potentially huge if he puts it together. There may not be a spot here long term due to the number of prospects but I’d like to think a bit of patience would at least increase his value. That’s the pragmatic, business view.

I love the kid by the way, I want him in our top 6 for years to come because I find him fun to watch when he’s on it. With his battles to recover from those back issues I cannot help but root for him and really hope he makes it.

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

TOTAL:

EVEN STRENGTH ONLY:

Are you getting your numbers somewhere different than me?

He was playing 14:33 per game with 1:56 of PP time per game.

And still only had 7 shots in 7 games.

Ahh I see. I'm getting mine from Natural Stat Trick. not sure what's accounting for the difference offhand other than ES vs. 5v5 but they appear to be discounting neutral zone altogether? not sure:

But look at the difference in zone starts between Kaliyev and Vilardi. Not saying they SHOULD be equal and I agree Vilardi has more to learn and give--but they're using him like they use Danault in the majority of game situations. The shooting is worrying, but hard to generate shots when you're getting buried like that.

But therein lies the question, I guess--are they doing that to sharpen him? Hard to tell. But they're certainly not getting the most out of him using him like that. I wouldn't touch a thing right nwo, don't get me wrong, but the above is why I would love to see him next to Danault/Iafallo. Or at least taking Brown's spot, even temporarily. Jump start him, don't snowball him. Or send him to Ontario to rehab and get big minutes for a bit, I'm with you there too. Just 4th line and scratch...waste at this point.

 

[FSL KINGS]

AHL conditioning

Bottom 6, roll 4 lines for end of year or playoffs.

Lias, Byfield, Vilardi
Turcotte, Kupari, Kaliyev

*I'm only fine with trading Vilardi for a major upgrade.

 

[Schmooley]

AHL conditioning

Bottom 6, roll 4 lines for end of year or playoffs.

Lias, Byfield, Vilardi
Turcotte, Kupari, Kaliyev

*I'm only fine with trading Vilardi for a major upgrade.

I think those lines are good. Are you saying for the nhl or ahl?

 

[Lt Dan]

This is not a guy you move because he couldn't hack it at C, especially when everyone and their grandma and Lt. Dan's legs seem to agree he's got a W game anyway

This is news to me. Me and my legs aren't on speaking terms

 

[Eagle Fang]

Nope. There are plenty including Kupari. He's playing well at times since the call up, but Byfield has his spot already and it's too early to claim he's a legit NHL player. Too many are willng to toss away Valardi because in his 70 or so games, he hasn't figured it out yet. Give him time.

Now imagine if we got Jack Hughes, I bet we'd see people calling for him to be traded too, because he's only score 20 goals in 115 games. And btw, Valardi has 4 fewer points in 45 fewer games than Hughes.

Yea it's pretty mind boggle to me that people are ready to throw in the towel on Vilardi. I mean the guy's played 71 NHL games total and that's with missing a ton of time the last 3 years. He has A LOT to work on, but just from an overall skill standpoint he might arguably have the most skill of any young player in the org.

If he were 24-25 sure there's an argument. He just turned 22 three months ago.

As others have said, put him on the wing with talent and see what happens.

 

[Fishhead]

Points per 60 min:

Vilardi: 1.83
Kaliyev: 2.05
Kupari: 1.27

Gabe started terribly this year and he's a lot closer to Arty, who is a pure scorer. He's been around a bit longer, but it's easy to forget that he's only 7 months older than Kupari. It's easy to be down on him right now, especially with Kupari doing fine with electric speed and Gabe's lines struggling since Lias went down, but those point numbers really show just how productive he can be.

 

[LAKings88]

No one is saying they hate Vilardi or don’t want him to succeed.

It just appears to me that Vilardi isn’t going to have a place on the team sooner than later if something doesn’t change.

I don’t see a future for him at center with the three other main centers locked up.

He is not a bottom six player.

Maybe I should change the title to Vilardi’s future in the org. Or something.

 

[bland]

None of these fancy stats mean a damn thing, tics of percentages here and there, so what.

What matters is he hasn't run with the ball yet and there are plenty of other options just itching for their shot just behind him. You don't move him because he won't develop, you move him because you can get better elsewhere in the lineup while actually improving on his spot. Kupari has shown more in similar time, and both Byfield and Turcotte are good bets to show more in less time.

There are precious few spots here with a LOT of quality in the same age range. Not everybody is going to make it, and you have the luxory of picking the cream of the crop. Vilardi ain't the dregs, but he hasn't risen yet and is very much in danger of being lost in the shuffle.

He is an asset right now, not a fixture. If there wasn't a massive queue behind him then you give him all the time he needs. If he wants to give the wing a go, awesome, he still has waiver exemptions so he can learn in Ontario. He just hasn't shown that he can handle the NHL yet. Until he does, no need to give him something he hasn't earned.

 

[kings11]

He needs to be sent to Ontario and he needs to dominate and rebuild his confidence which I’m sure is low at the moment…
It’ll also allow him to round out his game

 

[Raccoon Jesus]

No one is saying they hate Vilardi or don’t want him to succeed.

It just appears to me that Vilardi isn’t going to have a place on the team sooner than later if something doesn’t change.

I don’t see a future for him at center with the three other main centers locked up.

He is not a bottom six player.

Maybe I should change the title to Vilardi’s future in the org. Or something.

None of these fancy stats mean a damn thing, tics of percentages here and there, so what.

What matters is he hasn't run with the ball yet and there are plenty of other options just itching for their shot just behind him. You don't move him because he won't develop, you move him because you can get better elsewhere in the lineup while actually improving on his spot. Kupari has shown more in similar time, and both Byfield and Turcotte are good bets to show more in less time.

There are precious few spots here with a LOT of quality in the same age range. Not everybody is going to make it, and you have the luxory of picking the cream of the crop. Vilardi ain't the dregs, but he hasn't risen yet and is very much in danger of being lost in the shuffle.

He is an asset right now, not a fixture. If there wasn't a massive queue behind him then you give him all the time he needs. If he wants to give the wing a go, awesome, he still has waiver exemptions so he can learn in Ontario. He just hasn't shown that he can handle the NHL yet. Until he does, no need to give him something he hasn't earned.

But see, this is the chicken-and-egg stuff that's bothering me so much.

You can't change if you don't play. Citing his past stats when the Kings were losing vs. harder teams while ignoring anything else in his track record is obtuse. This is how you end up jettisoning real talent, wondering how they're putting up numbers elsewhere, then going "well, they weren't going to succeed here."

It's not a 'fancy stat' to point out that one guy is getting mostly strong deployment including power play time with the best players on the roster vs. one getting literally the hardest starts on the team with the 12th-15th forwards. Play to your personnel's strengths.

And sorry but if you don't think even 5% is a HUGE margin between professionals at the top level I don't know what to tell you other than to read up on the British cycling team and 1% margins.

There are a lot of people around Vilardi fighting for playing time, he deserves nothing more than a fighting chance and he's not getting it. I question the development philosophy and the coaching until I see otherwise.

It'll all moot until after this road trip anyway, I suppose. But it's getting old watching people drag him for a stretch when the whole team was suffering.

 

[kilowatt]

If we could move Vilardi for a guy like Kaiden Guhle I'd consider it. I still just think we shift him to right wing and call it a day. He could be a top six forward.

 

[2-4 Slashin]

We will regret moving the type of player who can become your 10/12 season Ron Francis 2C. That’s what Villardi’s Skill set is like. He’s smart and skilled and that just gets better with time. He will make us eat crow forever if we trade him.

 

[Schrute farms]

Wow I can’t believe Gabe just turned 22. Seems like he’s been around much longer. But I guess it’s just been all the trials and tribulations with him/CV that makes it seem so. Young pup still

 

[tkb81]

22-23
Arvidsson Kopi Kaliyev
Iaffalo Danault Kempe
Andersson Byfield Turcotte
Moore JAD Lemieux
???

Brown?
Vilardi?
Kupari?
Prospect?

JAD & Kempe aren’t set in stone I guess.

haha i love the optimism of moving brown off kopi's wing .. its a dream we all share ... haha well except brownie

 

[No Name The Nameless]

I don’t think his skating is why he’s struggling. It’s Vilardi’s ability to drive play. He needs to further develop his abilities to win puck battles, find space and time, and enter the zone with control. He’s finding himself on the wrong side of the puck or out of the play a lot and it’s like playing a man down.

These are things he could be working on with Wrobo in Ontario. It’s where he should be when he emerges from COVID purgatory. He’ll come back a better player.

This is true. He loses more battles than he wins.