Is this shady or normal for hockey parents?

[Yukon Joe]

Sorry please explain Club hockey to me? Is this the same as Academy hockey?

So @Slats432 and I go back and forth because he's a "club" hockey coach and I'm a "club" hockey parent, both in Edmonton (I hope our banter is all friendly!).

So this terminology might only be to Edmonton/Alberta. "Club" hockey is the elite AA/AAA hockey, where you have to try out and you might not make it. It' still a non-profit club that has existed for decades. "Federation" hockey is the hockey where everyone plays, it's just a matter of what tier you're assigned to. It's also non-profit.

"Academy" hockey is where you go to a school which is also your hockey team (see CSSHL). It's outside of Hockey Canada's control, but they do place a lot of kids in the WHL draft. It's very expensive ($30k plus per year), and I believe is for-profit.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

This is really interesting. This thread has talked a lot about nutty parents, but not a lot about questionable organizations. I guess it’s important to note that questionable organizations are basically run by nutty parents (volunteers). We’ve been with our current organization for 2 years and it feels like we’ve already seen a lot.

I really like the idea of paying a bit more for proper coaching. Right now there’s a big difference in our organization between rep coaching and everything else. Spending a year with “coach dad” can often feel like losing a year of development. I also feel like there are a lot of dudes coaching just to guarantee that A) their son always makes a team despite being a borderline player and B) they can stack certain teams so their kid will have a fun year.

My daughter’s org has paid coaches and it makes a huge difference.

Some of the dad coaches mean well but don’t really know the game well.

In Squirt I taught my daughter how to use a snapshot and it took months for her to learn the proper techniques… and an assistant dad coach on her team yelled at her for not using “sweep shots”.

I tried to let it go but then he told her how to handle a 2-1 completely wrong a couple weeks later and I had to ask him to stop offering my daughter bad advice.

I appreciate volunteer dads, but if you don’t know wtf you are talking about, it can really hurt kids development.

 

[Minnesota Knudsens]

My daughter’s org has paid coaches and it makes a huge difference.

Some of the dad coaches mean well but don’t really know the game well.

In Squirt I taught my daughter how to use a snapshot and it took months for her to learn the proper techniques… and an assistant dad coach on her team yelled at her for not using “sweep shots”.

I tried to let it go but then he told her how to handle a 2-1 completely wrong a couple weeks later and I had to ask him to stop offering my daughter bad advice.

I appreciate volunteer dads, but if you don’t know wtf you are talking about, it can really hurt kids development.

Yeah there’s 2 sides to it. Sometimes you need people to step up just to have teams/organizations in the first place, but then if they don’t know what they’re doing…

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Yeah there’s 2 sides to it. Sometimes you need people to step up just to have teams/organizations in the first place, but then if they don’t know what they’re doing…

Before my daughter had paid coaches, the main coaches were always decent to pretty good.

It was the assistant coaches, some who couldn’t even skate, teaching the kids improperly.

And ya it’s a catch 22 because they are stepping up to help and while I coached when I was younger, I want nothing to do with it anymore because of crazy parents.

So I didn’t want to come off as one of the annoying and crazy dads like I used to despise when I see them teaching bad technique or saying dumb shit.

99% of the time I just held my tongue and told my daughter to just pretend like she was listening to them, but to ignore those dads “advice”.

 

[patnyrnyg]

So @Slats432 and I go back and forth because he's a "club" hockey coach and I'm a "club" hockey parent, both in Edmonton (I hope our banter is all friendly!).

So this terminology might only be to Edmonton/Alberta. "Club" hockey is the elite AA/AAA hockey, where you have to try out and you might not make it. It' still a non-profit club that has existed for decades. "Federation" hockey is the hockey where everyone plays, it's just a matter of what tier you're assigned to. It's also non-profit.

"Academy" hockey is where you go to a school which is also your hockey team (see CSSHL). It's outside of Hockey Canada's control, but they do place a lot of kids in the WHL draft. It's very expensive ($30k plus per year), and I believe is for-profit.

Yeah, there is definitely a difference in the terminology. Here it seen as Tier 1, which is AAA. These are (supposed to be) the elite players at their age group. Teams can't just decide in the beginning of the season they want to play tier 1. In my district, they have to be approved and it is a process. An examples of tier 1 leagues here is the THF (Tier 1 Hockey Federation) and AYHL (Atlantic Youth Hockey League). THF is owned by a group called Black Bear. Then, there is tier 2. Which is AA and below. Our district has the NJYHL (New Jersey Youth Hockey League) and DVHL (Delaware Valley Hockey League). The NJYHL does have 2 teams in NY. One that has a rink on Staten Island and Bayonne, NJ. The other is Ramapo, NY which is near the border of southern ny and northern NJ. So yes, you could go to a rink in NY and see a NJ banner hanging. In NY, they have a Long Island league. Think is the LIAHA and then the HVL (Hudson Valley League) and many teams will play in both leagues to get extra games and variety. They also have teams from Connecticut. There is also the AHF (also owned by Black Bear) which is for tier 2 teams. However, they are not part of a district at least at 10U and I dont think 12U. Not sure how they work into 14U and older.

If you speak to someone around here and mention the term "club hockey" they are going to think you are talking about any kind of travel hockey, whether it is tier 1 or tier 2. if you say "elite", they are going to think "tier 1". If you say "federation" they are likely just going to think it is just another name for "club" or "travel. Around here, all the tier 1 tryouts are on the same days. The district determines when the earliest day tryouts can happen and then tier 2 is usually about 2 weeks later. Again, district determines the earlies they can start and all teams hold on the same days. Parents then sign contracts after tryouts committing to that team. You can get a release after you sign, but that is between the family and the club and how different organizations handle that varies. I do not know of any geographic restrictions from where teams can draw players in the NJYHL, DVHL, LIAHA, HVL. THF. AYHL, AHF. No idea about when you go "upstate" as you go further north towards Albany or West. as you go towards Syracuse, Rochester, Buffalo. For Tier 2, teams will have a few cuts, but it is not hard to find a team unless you are a novice and just not ready. If for example a team has 25 skaters show up for 12U tryouts, they will likely create 2 teams. If they have 35, they may create 3. In some cases, if a kid does not make the top team for a club, they may not sign with the 2nd if they don't think it will be the level of competition they want. AFTER tryouts, you will see many clubs posting on fb groups that they are looking for a few players to fill out their roster. Yes, some kids will go to more than 1 tryout. And, some teams will have a supplemental or 2nd tryout maybe a week or so later.

If you say "house league" to someone around here, it means at one particular rink. Every rink runs their house league differently. For the most part, it is for the beginner. Skating ability can vary WIDELY. When my daughter played house, she had a year of skating lessons, then 2 years (2 covid years) of the NY Rangers Learn to Play. Some other kids were on the ice for the first time. Some had some skating experience (learn to skate) but first time playing hockey. Our house league has 1 practice and 1 game per week. How it is divided depends on the number of kids, but for the most part it will be 8U and 12U. They will allow some older kids to play 12U house if they are beginners. For the spring, some rinks will have spring house league which is more competitive. Generally set up for their travel players to stay on ice, but without the same commitment. 1-2 sessions per week. Mix of games and practices.

 

[Slats432]

Yes, big differences in terminology.

Here in minor hockey

AAA/AA
Tier 1 (House/Federation)
Tier 2
Tier 3
and House/Federation goes down to tier 8.

Unless you play in an unsanctioned league, then they use things like Prep or Varsity so the kids don't get caught up in whether they play AAA or AA. Tough to get a parent to play $30K to play AA hockey.

 

[Minnesota Knudsens]

Here in Southern Ontario (Northern Ontario does their own thing out of necessity):

AAA
AA/A
BB/B or MD
Select
House League

You can’t drive half an hour without tripping over an organization so a lot of smaller ones are amalgamating due to declining enrolment. A bigger city like London might have multiple rep teams at some levels due to larger population. IMO we have a competitive balance issue at the House League level. It’s not uncommon to see a B level quality player playing against a kid that’s basically learning to skate/play. This kid doesn’t want to travel or just wants to play with his friends, but then goes out on the ice and scores at will. So despite seeming like a “learn to play” level, any given House League team can usually have 5 or 6 really talented players on it. I have to imagine this affects enrolment greatly. Imagine playing the whole season and barely touching the puck? Sounds like Edmonton’s tier system handles this issue a lot better.

Then there’s an issue with stacking House League teams. It’s usually an experienced coach dad with a son that’s very good at the game. He will approach 2 other dads of really talented players to be assistant coaches, and then before they even have the evaluation/player draft, that team already has 3 great players. The 4 other teams will be coached by well meaning dads. When they do the player draft, the experienced coach will then use his advanced player knowledge to absolutely fleece the other coaches. Then his team spends the year destroying the other teams.

You might not expect this, but it often feels as if House League is taken more seriously than the next level up (Select). House League can often have multiple championships and tournaments depending on where you live, whereas Select seems more like an exhibition showcase with a bunch of tournaments that nobody seems to really care about.

 

[Yukon Joe]

Then there’s an issue with stacking House League teams. It’s usually an experienced coach dad with a son that’s very good at the game. He will approach 2 other dads of really talented players to be assistant coaches, and then before they even have the evaluation/player draft, that team already has 3 great players. The 4 other teams will be coached by well meaning dads. When they do the player draft, the experienced coach will then use his advanced player knowledge to absolutely fleece the other coaches. Then his team spends the year destroying the other teams.

So here's what our local club does. (this is aside from AAA/AA).

Every kid does a series of times skating drills. Frontwards, backwards, agility, weave. This is all very impartial as a stopwatch doesn't lie. From there, kids are broken down to several tier groups and do evaluation scrimmages.

We hire "independent" evaluators who can then adjust kids up or down from these tier groups. This is all outside of the club's actual control.

Once those evaluations take place, this is where shenanigans can happen. The club starts making phone calls to get head coaches - there's never enough volunteers. Different potential head coaches can say "okay I'll do it - but only if you give me kids X & Y" (and presumably their dads as well). Now kids X & Y still need to be in the same tier group - they can't just pull a Tier 1 kid down to Tier 3, or vice versa, but some coaches can have some pull in who from the same tier group gets put on their team. Or if the head coach is on the board of directors they can have a lot of pull on putting together their team - from kids within the right tier group.

Beyond that though they just try to assign kids to teams, trying to balance ages (and keeping in mind friend requests).

So with that process some teams will be better than others, but there's no super-stacked teams.

And there definitely aren't any player drafts by coaches. That just seems nuts.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

So here's what our local club does. (this is aside from AAA/AA).

Every kid does a series of times skating drills. Frontwards, backwards, agility, weave. This is all very impartial as a stopwatch doesn't lie. From there, kids are broken down to several tier groups and do evaluation scrimmages.

We hire "independent" evaluators who can then adjust kids up or down from these tier groups. This is all outside of the club's actual control.

Once those evaluations take place, this is where shenanigans can happen. The club starts making phone calls to get head coaches - there's never enough volunteers. Different potential head coaches can say "okay I'll do it - but only if you give me kids X & Y" (and presumably their dads as well). Now kids X & Y still need to be in the same tier group - they can't just pull a Tier 1 kid down to Tier 3, or vice versa, but some coaches can have some pull in who from the same tier group gets put on their team. Or if the head coach is on the board of directors they can have a lot of pull on putting together their team - from kids within the right tier group.

Beyond that though they just try to assign kids to teams, trying to balance ages (and keeping in mind friend requests).

So with that process some teams will be better than others, but there's no super-stacked teams.

And there definitely aren't any player drafts by coaches. That just seems nuts.

This all sounds a lot like what happens with many org around me, and the politics that happen.

Sometimes an org can’t find a coach for a particular team and his kid isn’t exactly good enough to play at that level, but makes the team because of his dad coaching.

As an example…

There is one girl my daughter knows who has a famous dad, and he took over an elite girls program.

This girl is ok, but she isn’t in any way a AAA girls type player.

Yet she keeps making the team every season because her dad is the coach.

 

[WarriorofTime]

Seems like something ought to be done about making everything so skater focused in terms of evaluation/grouping. Of course skating is important, but it seems like it becomes the only thing. It's no wonder Canadian/American kids skate so much better than Europeans when you get to these junior aged international competition. But guess what.. some of those bad skating Europeans are able to catch up and become great players even if they were a bit behind at that time.

It's encouraging a system where if your skating isn't at X level at by Y age, why even bother, or possibly even worse, training specifically for skating drills above all else, which should be a means to an end, not the end all be all itself.

 

[Yukon Joe]

Seems like something ought to be done about making everything so skater focused in terms of evaluation/grouping. Of course skating is important, but it seems like it becomes the only thing. It's no wonder Canadian/American kids skate so much better than Europeans when you get to these junior aged international competition. But guess what.. some of those bad skating Europeans are able to catch up and become great players even if they were a bit behind at that time.

It's encouraging a system where if your skating isn't at X level at by Y age, why even bother, or possibly even worse, training specifically for skating drills above all else, which should be a means to an end, not the end all be all itself.

So - it's really hard to quantify if someone is "good at hockey", but much easier to quantify if someone is good at skating. And guess what - being good at skating correlates very highly with being good at hockey, even if it doesn't exactly track 100%. I don't care how great you are with your hands, or how good you can see the game, if you can barely skate.

But even in the evaluation process I described skating drills are only the start of the process, not the end. Hell years ago (I think 7) I started a thread here about my own kid who absolutely bombed his very first skating drills (he was just in a mood/having a bad day), but killed it in evaluations and was moved up several tiers by the end.

I can tell you that since then we usually go in with a few families to rent a sheet of ice for an hour to practice those drills, and they are sometimes worked on in some hockey camps - but it's still a tiny portion of any training they do over the summer. There's a very rapid point of diminishing returns - if you don't know how to do the drills you can do very badly by making just basic mistakes, but once you know how to do the drills it still just comes down to your skating.

It's if you're doing a standardized test - if you don't know how to fill in a bubble sheet you're going to bomb the test no matter how smart you are, but once you know how to fill in the bubble sheet you still need to know your stuff to do well.

 

[patnyrnyg]

This all sounds a lot like what happens with many org around me, and the politics that happen.

Sometimes an org can’t find a coach for a particular team and his kid isn’t exactly good enough to play at that level, but makes the team because of his dad coaching.

As an example…

There is one girl my daughter knows who has a famous dad, and he took over an elite girls program.

This girl is ok, but she isn’t in any way a AAA girls type player.

Yet she keeps making the team every season because her dad is the coach.

So here's what our local club does. (this is aside from AAA/AA).

Every kid does a series of times skating drills. Frontwards, backwards, agility, weave. This is all very impartial as a stopwatch doesn't lie. From there, kids are broken down to several tier groups and do evaluation scrimmages.

We hire "independent" evaluators who can then adjust kids up or down from these tier groups. This is all outside of the club's actual control.

Once those evaluations take place, this is where shenanigans can happen. The club starts making phone calls to get head coaches - there's never enough volunteers. Different potential head coaches can say "okay I'll do it - but only if you give me kids X & Y" (and presumably their dads as well). Now kids X & Y still need to be in the same tier group - they can't just pull a Tier 1 kid down to Tier 3, or vice versa, but some coaches can have some pull in who from the same tier group gets put on their team. Or if the head coach is on the board of directors they can have a lot of pull on putting together their team - from kids within the right tier group.

Beyond that though they just try to assign kids to teams, trying to balance ages (and keeping in mind friend requests).

So with that process some teams will be better than others, but there's no super-stacked teams.

And there definitely aren't any player drafts by coaches. That just seems nuts.

And is this all done in one rink. As in this is for the league at The Rink on Main Street? Or, are there several rinks involved and a kid can get placed on a team based out of whatever rink they are based out of? Or, do the teams use all the rinks and the schedule is randomized?

 

[Yukon Joe]

And is this all done in one rink. As in this is for the league at The Rink on Main Street? Or, are there several rinks involved and a kid can get placed on a team based out of whatever rink they are based out of? Or, do the teams use all the rinks and the schedule is randomized?

OK, so this is Canada, and the majority of rinks are owned by the City (or neighboring municipalities).

City is divided into zones, so our home club covers only a portion of the city. Games can be at any city-owned rink around town. It's all organized through Hockey Edmonton, which is in turn run by Hockey Alberta, then Hockey Canada.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

And is this all done in one rink. As in this is for the league at The Rink on Main Street? Or, are there several rinks involved and a kid can get placed on a team based out of whatever rink they are based out of? Or, do the teams use all the rinks and the schedule is randomized?

I’m in the US and there are a dozen.. maybe more… org around me.

Most org have their own home rinks they play out of.

These rinks are mostly privately owned and rent the ice out to these org for the season.

There is a rink owned by an NHL team, which runs a AAA program out of it.

Another rink is owned by a university, which rents the ice out to an org my daughter used to play for.

In my daughters case, her team is independently owned and the owners also own the rink they play at, which is pretty unusual around here.

We don’t have any boundary restrictions like Canada.

Kids just play wherever they make a team.

 

[Minnesota Knudsens]

I’m in the US and there are a dozen.. maybe more… org around me.

Most org have their own home rinks they play out of.

These rinks are mostly privately owned and rent the ice out to these org for the season.

There is a rink owned by an NHL team, which runs a AAA program out of it.

Another rink is owned by a university, which rents the ice out to an org my daughter used to play for.

In my daughters case, her team is independently owned and the owners also own the rink they play at, which is pretty unusual around here.

We don’t have any boundary restrictions like Canada.

Kids just play wherever they make a team.

So I don’t know if it’s the same in the States, but in Canada, one organization might have access to say 4 locations in their jurisdiction. Keep in mind, this is a relatively small area, but also that these 4 locations might have multiple ice rinks (up to 4 rinks in one location). A hockey organization may have to compete with the local ringette team, a workplace team or some random bunch of dudes that book it for fun. But usually there is enough ice time for everyone.

 

[patnyrnyg]

I’m in the US and there are a dozen.. maybe more… org around me.

Most org have their own home rinks they play out of.

These rinks are mostly privately owned and rent the ice out to these org for the season.

There is a rink owned by an NHL team, which runs a AAA program out of it.

Another rink is owned by a university, which rents the ice out to an org my daughter used to play for.

In my daughters case, her team is independently owned and the owners also own the rink they play at, which is pretty unusual around here.

We don’t have any boundary restrictions like Canada.

Kids just play wherever they make a team.

I am talking more about "house" league or this federation league.

Yeah, that is how it is near me, too. In some cases, more than one org rents ice at the same rink.

 

[Minnesota Knudsens]

So - it's really hard to quantify if someone is "good at hockey", but much easier to quantify if someone is good at skating. And guess what - being good at skating correlates very highly with being good at hockey, even if it doesn't exactly track 100%. I don't care how great you are with your hands, or how good you can see the game, if you can barely skate.

But even in the evaluation process I described skating drills are only the start of the process, not the end. Hell years ago (I think 7) I started a thread here about my own kid who absolutely bombed his very first skating drills (he was just in a mood/having a bad day), but killed it in evaluations and was moved up several tiers by the end.

I can tell you that since then we usually go in with a few families to rent a sheet of ice for an hour to practice those drills, and they are sometimes worked on in some hockey camps - but it's still a tiny portion of any training they do over the summer. There's a very rapid point of diminishing returns - if you don't know how to do the drills you can do very badly by making just basic mistakes, but once you know how to do the drills it still just comes down to your skating.

It's if you're doing a standardized test - if you don't know how to fill in a bubble sheet you're going to bomb the test no matter how smart you are, but once you know how to fill in the bubble sheet you still need to know your stuff to do well.

So I agree with this, but there is definitely a range when it comes to skating. You can’t be terrible at skating, but you don’t have to be a figure skater either.

For example, in my son’s recent tryout, one of the criticisms was his backward skating. But the actual drill was backward skating around the faceoff circles. Fair enough. But when they get to actual scrimmages, I didn’t see one forward utilize a skill like that. This is not to say that it’s not an important hockey skill, maybe just not at that level.

The history of the NHL is full of really fast skaters that had hands of stone and also, really good scorers that were knocked for their skating.

So my point is: As long as you’re within an acceptable range skating wise, other attributes important to the game of hockey gain critical importance. Size, strength, shooting accuracy, deking/elusiveness, tenacity on the puck, hand-eye, etc. And the only way to assess this is to watch players play the game.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

So I don’t know if it’s the same in the States, but in Canada, one organization might have access to say 4 locations in their jurisdiction. Keep in mind, this is a relatively small area, but also that these 4 locations might have multiple ice rinks (up to 4 rinks in one location). A hockey organization may have to compete with the local ringette team, a workplace team or some random bunch of dudes that book it for fun. But usually there is enough ice time for everyone.

I lived in Canada for seven years so I’m vaguely familiar with how it works there.

In terms of ice time, it’s not much different in the US, except more rinks are privately owned.

The only rink I can recall being owned by the local govt around me closed 25 yrs ago.

Anyway, the privately owned rinks around us have the same scheduling conflicts with ice time.

As an example the org my daughter used to play for rented the ice from a local ice complex right down the road from us that has two ice pads, both inside so they run all year long.

The rink also rented ice out to an all girls org, several local high school teams, etc.

The rink also runs a learn to play program, an ADM program and a house league that runs from 10u up to 18u.

They also run in house skill camps and various independent/incorporated instructors regularly rent the ice for their clinics.

Then you have the figure skaters, public skates, beer league, pickup, stick time etc

So as you can imagine their ice is pretty booked up all season.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

I am talking more about "house" league or this federation league.

Yeah, that is how it is near me, too. In some cases, more than one org rents ice at the same rink.

House league around us is basically just that, in house.

So it’s basically an affordable program kids can play in for fun, that involves zero travel and all of the games are played at the same rink each weekend.

Most rinks around us have a house league program and since almost every rink is privately owned, each of these programs is independently run.

If you sign up for rink A’s program, all of your kid’s games will be played there.

Rink A B C etc don’t run a house program together.

Parents I know who have kids in house basically sign them up for a league that is closest to their house.

 

[patnyrnyg]

House league around us is basically just that, in house.

So it’s basically an affordable program kids can play in for fun, that involves zero travel and all of the games are played at the same rink each weekend.

Most rinks around us have a house league program and since almost every rink is privately owned, each of these programs is independently run.

If you sign up for rink A’s program, all of your kid’s games will be played there.

Rink A B C etc don’t run a house program together.

Parents I know who have kids in house basically sign them up for a league that is closest to their house.

Sounds similar to what we have in the NY Metro area. Although, some places do have "Travel Lite". A few rinks will get together and schedule games. If they have some kids who are more advanced than most in house league, But for whatever reason do not play travel. In most cases, it is the parents are just not ready for that kind of commitment. It may be 4 rinks that are within a 15-20 minute drive of each other. They generally have early ice slots and it is usually just younger ages, 8U and 10U from what I understand. In NJ, it is a mix of privately owned rinks or owned by the state/township.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Sounds similar to what we have in the NY Metro area. Although, some places do have "Travel Lite". A few rinks will get together and schedule games. If they have some kids who are more advanced than most in house league, But for whatever reason do not play travel. In most cases, it is the parents are just not ready for that kind of commitment. It may be 4 rinks that are within a 15-20 minute drive of each other. They generally have early ice slots and it is usually just younger ages, 8U and 10U from what I understand. In NJ, it is a mix of privately owned rinks or owned by the state/township.

That’s pretty cool that they do that - gives the kids more competition then the same 5-6 teams.

I remember my daughter almost had a huge meltdown when she was 8 and played in a house league game.

She was in ADM and developing well, her skating was really good and her skill was just starting to emerge, etc

The rink she played ADM in, would “call” up last year ADM girls to play in a game or two with their house league girls team.

My daughter got her call up and we had never seen the girls house league team…

They were god awful and my daughter was trying to pass to these girls and make plays… but the girls couldn’t handle the passes or they would fall down.

I’ll never forget one play when my daughter chased down a loose puck and her teammate came in and took it off her, then that girl blindly threw it to the other team.

My daughter threw her head back and slammed her stick… I was like oh f*** stay calm child.

She came off the ice after the game and I knew what was coming…

“These girls suck” “they can’t even skate and robble robble!”

A grandma walked by staring at my daughter losing it and I was like “why me” and kept trying to calm her.

The coach of the team turned the corner and saw my daughter freaking out and asked me what was wrong and I made up some shit about how she “hates to lose”.

The coach laughed and told her she played well then took off.

That was the first and last house experience I had with her.

Not exactly the best experience for either of us.

 

[patnyrnyg]

That’s pretty cool that they do that - gives the kids more competition then the same 5-6 teams.

I remember my daughter almost had a huge meltdown when she was 8 and played in a house league game.

She was in ADM and developing well, her skating was really good and her skill was just starting to emerge, etc

The rink she played ADM in, would “call” up last year ADM girls to play in a game or two with their house league girls team.

My daughter got her call up and we had never seen the girls house league team…

They were god awful and my daughter was trying to pass to these girls and make plays… but the girls couldn’t handle the passes or they would fall down.

I’ll never forget one play when my daughter chased down a loose puck and her teammate came in and took it off her, then that girl blindly threw it to the other team.

My daughter threw her head back and slammed her stick… I was like oh f*** stay calm child.

She came off the ice after the game and I knew what was coming…

“These girls suck” “they can’t even skate and robble robble!”

A grandma walked by staring at my daughter losing it and I was like “why me” and kept trying to calm her.

The coach of the team turned the corner and saw my daughter freaking out and asked me what was wrong and I made up some shit about how she “hates to lose”.

The coach laughed and told her she played well then took off.

That was the first and last house experience I had with her.

Not exactly the best experience for either of us.

Same 5-6 teams? a lot of the house leagues are not even 2 teams. Just whoever shows up gets split into 2 teams and play.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Same 5-6 teams? a lot of the house leagues are not even 2 teams. Just whoever shows up gets split into 2 teams and play.

That’s… sad.

Maybe that’s why several rinks combine their programs then?

There are several big org within 25-30 mins of us, with about 700-800 kids who tryout for all of their teams from 10u to 18u.

These org all have several single A teams, birth year teams and AA at each level combined.

So like 10u travel will have AA, 4-5 single A teams and a birth year squad.

The kids who don’t make the travel teams just play house.

 

[Yukon Joe]

Same 5-6 teams? a lot of the house leagues are not even 2 teams. Just whoever shows up gets split into 2 teams and play.

I just counted. My kid who played U13 was in Tier 3 (out of 6). There were 28 total teams in Tier 3 alone. Let's see... 19 in Tier 1, 21 Tier 2, 24 in Tier 4, 25 in Tier 5, 29 in Tier 6. There is also a "Rec" division I know almost nothing about with 3 teams,

You can also add in 28 AA teams (although that covers a wider area).

And that's just the greater Edmonton area. 177 U13 teams. That's what - 2600 kids (assuming 15 to a roster)?

It just goes to how awesome, yet frustrating, Canadian hockey can be. It's all organized city-wide. There's no "home rink" for my kid's team - practices can be almost anywhere in the city (although they tend to be in our rough geographic area). Because it's all city-owned rinks they do prioritize ice times for kids (although by U13 the times are getting later and later). There's an awful lot of positives.

Yet just because of the sheer size it can be incredibly bureaucratic. There structure is Local club-Hockey Edmonton-Hockey Alberta-Hockey Canada, all of which can and do make rules that you need to follow.

(oh just for comparison I looked up the "unsanctioned" leagues. You can't do an apples-to-apples comparison because they don't do ages the same way, but I found 5 HSL teams for 2012 kids, and 2 JPHL teams in the U14 category).

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

I just counted. My kid who played U13 was in Tier 3 (out of 6). There were 28 total teams in Tier 3 alone. Let's see... 19 in Tier 1, 21 Tier 2, 24 in Tier 4, 25 in Tier 5, 29 in Tier 6. There is also a "Rec" division I know almost nothing about with 3 teams,

You can also add in 28 AA teams (although that covers a wider area).

And that's just the greater Edmonton area. 177 U13 teams. That's what - 2600 kids (assuming 15 to a roster)?

It just goes to how awesome, yet frustrating, Canadian hockey can be. It's all organized city-wide. There's no "home rink" for my kid's team - practices can be almost anywhere in the city (although they tend to be in our rough geographic area). Because it's all city-owned rinks they do prioritize ice times for kids (although by U13 the times are getting later and later). There's an awful lot of positives.

Yet just because of the sheer size it can be incredibly bureaucratic. There structure is Local club-Hockey Edmonton-Hockey Alberta-Hockey Canada, all of which can and do make rules that you need to follow.

(oh just for comparison I looked up the "unsanctioned" leagues. You can't do an apples-to-apples comparison because they don't do ages the same way, but I found 5 HSL teams for 2012 kids, and 2 JPHL teams in the U14 category).

Wait, so your kids team has to practice at various rinks during the season?