Is Patrik Elias worthy to get to HHOF?

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

I feel like that would be setting the bar down a bit in all honesty...great player...but not in the hall of fame.

It's to late for that, the bar is already to low, the HHOF is easy to get into compared to other sports.

 

[Felidae]

Ignoring his cups and elite two way play, is there precedent for a guy with 1,000+ points and 3+ top 10 scoring finishes not making the hall of fame?

Theoren Fleury.

Though him being left out of the hall might be more off ice related

 

[Wierzbowski426]

With Elias I'm always torn, he was a great player that would have most certainly put up more points on a different team. He was an elite 2 way player, better defensively than a lot of guys that are in and better offensively than most of the defensive guys that are in. Here is where the problem is, his numbers don't jump off the page, sure he surpassed the 1000 point threshold that HoF likes but just barely. They also like to see 500 goals, and he came up almost 100 under that.

The 2 Stanley Cups and strong international play certainly helps his case, and any individual award would have made him a lock, but seeing as he doesn't have that I can see why he's been left out to this point.

I wouldn't be shocked if he eventually makes it in, but he's the definition of fringe HoF player if there ever was one. Just because there are worse players that are in already doesn't mean they should lower the bar to those players level.

Personally, I'd say super close but, no. I'd also would have said no to a lot of players that are already in and I would have already put Mogilny in, it's a damn shame he's still on the outside looking in.

It's already been lowered. Why are you choosing to enforce this barrier on Elias? Seems odd.

 

[NJ DevLolz]

If Zetterberg is in, so should Elias.

 

[HugeInTheShire]

It's already been lowered. Why are you choosing to enforce this barrier on Elias? Seems odd.

I just don't feel it should have been lowered as far as it already has been, all I'm saying is if I was voting I'd be a lot harder to get a Yes from than the currently are.

 

[Golden_Jet]

If Zetterberg is in, so should Elias.

Zetterburg isn’t in

 

[DickSmehlik]

I find the arguments so boring now due to the increasingly loose standards the NHL employs in allowing players into the HHOF.

Was the player very good? Sure, let him in then.

They should rename it the Hall of Very Good Hockey Players.

 

[Elvs]

The best forward on one of the most succesful teams in modern history, with two Stanley Cups to boot (both which he played a major part in winning), yes, Patrik Elias should get into the HHOF. Especially with the bar already being where it is.

 

[Mach2]

Currently, there are only two players in the HHOF with a last name beginning with "E" (Esposito brothers).
Thus, Patrik Elias will definitely be inducted because of all the "E-name" hockey players, Patrik was...absolutely one of them.

 

[Wierzbowski426]

Zetterburg isn’t in

Ok how about Alfredsson?

 

[tarheelhockey]

Ok how about Alfredsson?

If we’re brutally honest — Alfredsson is in because he played his whole career for a Canadian team which never had a higher peak than during his best years. Is he a HOF’er if he plays for Phoenix, probably not.

 

[Fataldogg]

As a Rangers fan who got to see a ton of Elias throughout his career, I have a great appreciation for him. To me, he was always a pivotal clutch player for the Devils organization and was a big part of their late 90's early 2000's run where they won multiple Cups. Where there are some players, like Joe Nieuwendyk who I would consider to be a compiler over time, Elias actually peaked quite high in the NHL too. I believe there was a season where the only two players to get more points than him were a prime Jaromir Jagr and Joe Sakic. He was never a passenger on that Devils team, he was one of the truly great players on their team who carried the load.

He is the Devils all time leading goal scorer, point getter, won two Stanley Cups with them, has over 1,000 career points, an absolutely great playoff performer. Keep in mind this was during the dead puck era, there weren't players scoring 140+ points and 70 goals in that era. I've seen a ton of Elias, which might make me a bit bias, but I personally think there are worse players already in the Hall of Fame.

Admitting Elias into the Hall of Fame doesn't lower the bar in my opinion. Letting Kevin Lowe in is what set the bar low.

I vote, YES, let Elias into the HOF.

 

[Golden_Jet]

If we’re brutally honest — Alfredsson is in because he played his whole career for a Canadian team which never had a higher peak than during his best years. Is he a HOF’er if he plays for Phoenix, probably not.

If we’re being brutally honest here then -

He also played in 5 Olympics, only Selanne had more for NHLers. It’s based on International play and NHL as well.

Also pick any 10 year sample between 97/98 and 2011/12, and he finishes anywhere from third to fifth in points in the league. That’s pretty solid results.

@Wierzbowski426

 

[Wierzbowski426]

If we’re being brutally honest here then -

He also played in 5 Olympics, only Selanne had more for NHLers. It’s based on International play and NHL as well.

Also pick any 10 year sample between 97/98 and 2011/12, and he finishes anywhere from third to fifth in points in the league. That’s pretty solid results.

@Wierzbowski426

And Elias has two Stanley Cups and Alfredsson 0. We could do this all day.


He's got a similar case to Elias. Ergo, Elias should get in.

 

[Golden_Jet]

And Elias has two Stanley Cups and Alfredsson 0. We could do this all day.

We’re comparing individual performances, where Elias doesn’t come close to top 3-5th in points over a 14 year sample, pick the 10 year sample you want.

You posted a team stat, with Brodeur leading the team in that regard, but congrats on getting the cup.

 

[tarheelhockey]

I believe there was a season where the only two players to get more points than him were a prime Jaromir Jagr and Joe Sakic.

While true, that was the 2001 season when the competition was absolutely brutal. The top 10 included Jason Allison, Alex Kovalev, Martin Straka, Doug Weight, and broken versions of Forsberg and Palffy. A whole bunch of guys were missing or walking-dead who should have been competing in that top-10 range (Lemieux, Lindros, Kariya, Forsberg, Palffy, Leclair, maybe Yzerman, etc). While Elias’ season was still very good in a vacuum, contextually there is a non-Elias reason that only a couple of guys finished ahead of him.

He also played in 5 Olympics, only Selanne had more for NHLers. It’s based on International play and NHL as well.

What does that mean, though? Only players Alfredsson’s age and older had the opportunity to do this. Connor McDavid won’t have a chance to do it, and neither did Gretzky. It’s as much a function of Alfredsson’s birth year as anything else.

 

[Golden_Jet]

While true, that was the 2001 season when the competition was absolutely brutal. The top 10 included Jason Allison, Alex Kovalev, Martin Straka, Doug Weight, and broken versions of Forsberg and Palffy. A whole bunch of guys were missing or walking-dead who should have been competing in that top-10 range (Lemieux, Lindros, Kariya, Forsberg, Palffy, Leclair, maybe Yzerman, etc). While Elias’ season was still very good in a vacuum, contextually there is a non-Elias reason that only a couple of guys finished ahead of him.



What does that mean, though? Only players Alfredsson’s age and older had the opportunity to do this. Connor McDavid won’t have a chance to do it, and neither did Gretzky. It’s as much a function of Alfredsson’s birth year as anything else.

I see you conveniently cut this out of your reply, or is that a function of age as well.

Also pick any 10 year sample between 97/98 and 2011/12, and he finishes anywhere from third to fifth in points in the league.

 

[tarheelhockey]

I see you conveniently cut this out of your reply, or is that a function of age as well.

Also pick any 10 year sample between 97/98 and 2011/12, and he finishes anywhere from third to fifth in points in the league.

I cut it out because I had no comment on it. But if you’re going to force a comment, I would note that this technique puts Claude Giroux and John Tavares in the HHOF.

 

[Xirik]

I cut it out because I had no comment on it. But if you’re going to force a comment, I would note that this technique puts Claude Giroux and John Tavares in the HHOF.

they probably will be.

 

[seafoam]

Not my era so I won't comment.

 

[tarheelhockey]

they probably will be.

If it makes everyone feel better, I’ll be in here pushing back on them as well

 

[pekka55]

If it makes everyone feel better, I’ll be in here pushing back on them as well

Yeah, the whole thing is a mess. IMO there's no need to have multiple people get into the Hof every single year. Sometimes it's ok to just say we're not going to induct anyone this year.

What should've been a very exclusive club soon became "if you score a 1000 points over 15 years, then you're in".