Is mcdavid too good not to win a cup?

[Grifter3511]

Right? It doesn’t matter if you put up 4 points a game if you are constantly giving up 3 at the same time. Because that means the rest of your team has to have a perfect game to win. Which doesn’t happen.

There's a difference between being on the ice when a goal is scored and being responsible for the goal being scored. McDavid can be blamed for the turnover on the game winner. Can he be faulted for the other two? It would have been nice (nice in context to the discussion, I'm pulling for the Kings) if he had been able to corral the atrocious no look pass from Bouchard into the slot, but should he have been doing something differently on that play? I don't recall the sequence on the other goal against he was on the ice for. Conversely, he was a crucial component in all 4 goals scored by his team.

 

[tabness]

so far he's clearly not good enough

 

[Cool Hand Puke]

There's a difference between being on the ice when a goal is scored and being responsible for the goal being scored. McDavid can be blamed for the turnover on the game winner. Can he be faulted for the other two? It would have been nice (nice in context to the discussion, I'm pulling for the Kings) if he had been able to corral the atrocious no look pass from Bouchard into the slot, but should he have been doing something differently on that play? I don't recall the sequence on the other goal against he was on the ice for. Conversely, he was a crucial component in all 4 goals scored by his team.

I just watched the replay of the 4th kings goal, you can absolutely put blame on him for floating and letting that puck lazily enter the slot.

Adding to this, he floats away from the play instead of covering the slot on the 3rd goal…

 

[nbwingsfan]

First off, I’m not the one you apparently told multiple times. Secondly, if McDavid played more defense… edmonton would be much better. MacKinnon is constantly backchecking and playing defense even on his non scoring nights. So in that regard, if you exchange McDavid for MacKinnon, they would be much closer to winning. You are talking about the four nations mvp after all.

Would you like to show me how McDavid was going to help stop those goals? Which of them would “backchecking harder” have actually made a difference? That should be interesting.

Also at calling MacKinnon a good defensive player

 

[Cool Hand Puke]

Would you like to show me how McDavid was going to help stop those goals? Which of them would “backchecking harder” have actually made a difference? That should be interesting.

Also at calling MacKinnon a good defensive player

I refer you to the post above.

 

[Cool Hand Puke]

Would you like to show me how McDavid was going to help stop those goals? Which of them would “backchecking harder” have actually made a difference? That should be interesting.

Also at calling MacKinnon a good defensive player

I don’t know why you’re laughing. Mackinnon is a much better defensive and transition player than McDavid and it’s not even close. You suggesting otherwise is laughable and just proves you don’t watch Mackinnon at all.

 

[Grifter3511]

I just watched the replay of the 4th kings goal, you can absolutely put blame on him for floating and letting that puck lazily enter the slot.

Adding to this, he floats away from the play instead of covering the slot on the 3rd goal…

I totally disagree on the 4th goal. Not only is McDavid in the slot and the closest player on both teams to his goalie, he's also reading the play and starting to head to the corner/boards because the natural play is for bouchard to continue pushing the puck along the wall. The LAST thing Bouchard should be doing is blindly passing out into the slot. IDK maybe he knew McD was there and was trying to get it to him. But unless McD called to Bouchard to signal that he wanted the puck, there's no good reason for Bouchard to make that pass. The fact that McDavid, who has some of the best hands in the league, misses the puck that was quite close to him, leads me to believe that he in no way communicated he wanted Bouchard to throw the puck to him.

So McD heads to the front of the net, and then sees his dman get the puck and begins to head to he boards to be an outlet/retrieve the puck.

 

[landy]

Would you like to show me how McDavid was going to help stop those goals? Which of them would “backchecking harder” have actually made a difference? That should be interesting.

Also at calling MacKinnon a good defensive player

2nd peried 15:13ish. Kuzmenko beats McDaivd and shouldve had a wrap around goal. Fastest player in the world...only when he has the puck.

2nd period 12:22sh. Watched and gives whoever a free shot.

2nd period 5:13ish. McDavid coasting in the corner doing nothing. Goal

2nd period 2:17ish. McDavid calls for it in front of his own net. Goal

3rd period :51ish. A random crap backhand to nowhere here giving up the GWG goal against. Leon half-asses back and even after the goal, you never see McDaivd in the shot. Dude neever even attempted to come back.

A no one is saying MacKinnon is Barkov, but he is a million times better than this effort and this was simply cherry picking the highlight video and not the whole game.

 

[landy]

I totally disagree on the 4th goal. Not only is McDavid in the slot and the closest player on both teams to his goalie, he's also reading the play and starting to head to the corner/boards because the natural play is for bouchard to continue pushing the puck along the wall. The LAST thing Bouchard should be doing is blindly passing out into the slot. So McD heads to the front of the net, and then sees his dman get the puck and begins to head to he boards to be an outlet/retrieve the puck.

He called for the puck...

 

[Cool Hand Puke]

2nd peried 15:13ish. Kuzmenko beats McDaivd and shouldve had a wrap around goal. Fastest player in the world...only when he has the puck.

2nd period 12:22sh. Watched and gives whoever a free shot.

2nd period 5:13ish. McDavid coasting in the corner doing nothing. Goal

2nd period 2:17ish. McDavid calls for it in front of his own net. Goal

3rd period :51ish. A random crap backhand to nowhere here giving up the GWG goal against. Leon half-asses back and even after the goal, you never see McDaivd in the shot. Dude neever even attempted to come back.

A no one is saying MacKinnon is Barkov, but he is a million times better than this effort and this was simply cherry picking the highlight video and not the whole game.

View attachment 1021009

People think I’m calling MacKinnon a Selke Caliber center are making up arguments when really I’m saying MacKinnon is a better defensive player than McDavid which is really a low bar to set.

 

[Grifter3511]

He called for the puck...

Can you please show me when? I've watched the replay a few times now and I don't see any indication.

 

[Cool Hand Puke]

Can you please show me when? I've watched the replay a few times now and I don't see any indication.

While I didn’t see him calling for the puck, but saying he’s expecting the pass to go up the boards also wasn’t going to help as he’s coasting at the red line in the middle of nowhere… not near a spot to get the puck and move it up the board and also not in a spot to defend the two guys in the slot. He’s stuck in no man’s land.

 

[CN8]

I’m trying to think off hand , did Thornton win anything else than 1 hart and 1 Ross?

 

[Grifter3511]

While I didn’t see him calling for the puck, but saying he’s expecting the pass to go up the boards also wasn’t going to help as he’s coasting at the red line in the middle of nowhere… not near a spot to get the puck and move it up the board and also not in a spot to defend the two guys in the slot. He’s stuck in no man’s land.

Hes literally transitioning from the slot to the wall. It's clear as day Bouchard doesn't have the space to slap the puck around the boards. It's going to be a soft tap and if the puck makes it into the corner he's also in position to be the first player to get to it and turn up ice.

 

[Cool Hand Puke]

Hes literally transitioning from the slot to the wall. It's clear as day Bouchard doesn't have the space to slap the puck around the boards. It's going to be a soft tap and if the puck makes it into the corner he's also in position to be the first player to get to it and turn up ice.

If he’s transitioning then he’s not doing a very good job because at best he’s pointing at the corner. Since we’re talking about how well someone plays defense that started this topic. My point still stands. We teach our youth to not leave two players alone in the slot regardless of how good you are. Apparently that art is lost on a player like McDavid.

 

[bambamcam4ever]

Out of curiousity, who is Edmonton's Guentzel and Kessel? I guess Hyman and Nuge are the comparables?

Also, does Pittsburgh win if they're facing the 2024 Florida Panthers? Conversely, do the Oilers win last year if they are facing the 2017 Predators?

The 2017 Penguins beat the 2017 Capitals, a much stronger team than last year's Panthers.

Despite the Penguins winning, the Caps were a better team.

But yeah I'd expect Edmonton to beat Nashville

 

[Cup Or Bust]

Imagine the bias someone has to have to try and convince others that McDavid was to blame on the game winning, soft floater from the high slot that a player fanned on and ended up in the back of the net? You have to think pretty highly of yourself if you think anyone is buying the manure you are selling.

 

[Grifter3511]

If he’s transitioning then he’s not doing a very good job because at best he’s pointing at the corner. Since we’re talking about how well someone plays defense that started this topic. My point still stands. We teach our youth to not leave two players alone in the slot regardless of how good you are. Apparently that art is lost on a player like McDavid.

Funny, because that's exactly where I said the puck would be if Bouchard played it on. He wasn't in position to hammer it around the boards.

Also, Oilers were in possession of the puck. Are you technically playing defense when your team has the puck?

Anyways, I'm tired of defending a player I'm not even a fan of. I hope Kings win, but I'm not blaming McDavid.

 

[NoName]

McDavid is definitionally not to good to win a Cup, until he wins a Cup.

 

[Cool Hand Puke]

Funny, because that's exactly where I said the puck would be if Bouchard played it on. He wasn't in position to hammer it around the boards.

Also, Oilers were in possession of the puck. Are you technically playing defense when your team has the puck?

Anyways, I'm tired of defending a player I'm not even a fan of. I hope Kings win, but I'm not blaming McDavid.

You’re acting like Bouch wasn’t contesting with someone else for the puck behind the net…

 

[Grifter3511]

The 2017 Penguins beat the 2017 Capitals, a much stronger team than last year's Panthers.

I think that is highly debatable. But since it's objectively impossible to prove I'll take your opinion on it.

 

[CN8]

He probably has a ring if he gets drafted anywhere else other than Edmonton.

Buffalo?

 

[Susannah]

No individual player ever wins championship alone no matter how good the player is. It is always a team achievement.

 

[TheLegend27]

I don’t know why you’re laughing. Mackinnon is a much better defensive and transition player than McDavid and it’s not even close. You suggesting otherwise is laughable and just proves you don’t watch Mackinnon at all.

The difference between Mack and McDavid defense is negligible. Whatever mistakes you’re thinking of right now that McDavid made, I could provide a similar compilation for MacK. When HFBoards use the word “it’s not even close” you just know that’s it’s in fact close.

McDavid on that Avs roster has a few cups by now.

 

[Cool Hand Puke]

The difference between Mack and McDavid defense is negligible. Whatever mistakes you’re thinking of right now that McDavid made, I could provide a similar compilation for MacK. When HFBoards use the word “it’s not even close” you just know that’s it’s in fact close.

McDavid on that Avs roster has a few cups by now.

MacKinnon has 4x the amount of blocked shots as McDavid this year and double his total last year. To couple that with the fact that he also more hits every year and more takeaways… all metrics point to MacKinnon being better defensive player who has in fact won a cup. MacKinnon had more than double the hits and takeaways in their 4 game sweep of the oilers in 2022.

factoring into scoring 4 points in a game doesn’t guarantee a win if you play poor defenseZ