Is Matthews the worst playoff performer ever?

[SUX2BU]

he doesn't "lay it on the line" ..................................

 

[Beville]

him and Marner are just not compatible. I'm willing to bet Matthews explodes with a line driver/play maker that shows up in the playoffs. Now should a player worth that much need someone like that is another question.

Who did he play with at 4 Nations? We should’ve have seen something like this, really.

 

[flyingfingers]

No they arent he is injured. Why does HF boards ignore injuries? Is it because people here didnt ever play competitve sports?

Alfredsson, Hossa, Datsyuk lots of greats were labelled playoffs chokers that reversed that mantra.

First 9 playoffs of those players:

Alfredsson: 79 games, 29 goals, 58 points, 1 conference finals appearance
Hossa: 98 games, 31 goals, 76 points, 1 conference finals and 2 finals appearances
Datsyuk: 121 games, 32 goals, 91 points, 2 conference finals and 2 finals appearances, 1 Stanley Cup

Matthews: 66 games, 25 goals, 58 points, 0 conference finals or finals appearances

Matthews is in the ballpark of Alfredsson's career playoff start, but the primary difference is that at no point was Alfredsson considered a top 5, let alone top 3, NHL player. He was never in the top 10 or top 15, really. Neither was Hossa, for that matter. Datsyuk was the closest, but he figured it out and won a cup in 07/08 (his 6th playoff appearance).

Considering the expectations of him, it's hard to think of a bigger playoff choker than Matthews.

Can he turn it around? Sure. Maybe one day in the future he'll have a great run in him.

But the criticism he's getting now is MORE than fair.

 

[jbeck5]

In the last 30 years? I don't know if anyone has mentioned Yashin.

Over 2 years, he posted this, in his prime. One of the years he was 2nd in hart votes.

82-44-50-94 (4-0-0-0)
82-40-48-88 (4-0-1-1)

Heck, his last couple playoff years for the islanders went like this:

47-15-19-34 (5-0-1-1)
58- 18-32-48 (5-0-0-0)

His NHL stats are 850-337-444-781, or 82-33-43-76 average.

His playoff stats are 48-11-16-27, or 82-18-27-45

To go from a 76 point guy to 45 point guy is a huge downgrade. Basically goes from a first liner to a second liner right away.

 

[HockeyVirus]

Again I suggest Marner is clearly worse. 1 shot in his last 3 games.

 

[PainForShane]

If Nathan MacKinnon can turn around an entire career after a good rookie year followed by a few years of basically being a bum, Matthews can turn his (thus far underperforming) playoff 'career' around as well.

If Toronto doesn't want him, I wouldn't think twice about trade 2 firsts and an impact player (ie productive middle six forward) to take him over in Utah

 

[bert]

First 9 playoffs of those players:

Alfredsson: 79 games, 29 goals, 58 points, 1 conference finals appearance
Hossa: 98 games, 31 goals, 76 points, 1 conference finals and 2 finals appearances
Datsyuk: 121 games, 32 goals, 91 points, 2 conference finals and 2 finals appearances, 1 Stanley Cup

Matthews: 66 games, 25 goals, 58 points, 0 conference finals or finals appearances

Matthews is in the ballpark of Alfredsson's career playoff start, but the primary difference is that at no point was Alfredsson considered a top 5, let alone top 3, NHL player. Neither was Hossa, for that matter. Datsyuk was the closest, but he figured it out and won a cup in 07/08 (his 6th playoff appearance).

Considering the expectations of him, it's hard to think of a bigger playoff choker than Matthews.

Can he turn it around? Sure. Maybe one day in the future he'll have a great run in him.

But the criticism he's getting now is MORE than fair.

I mean anyone that has Matthews in the top 3 let alone top 5 is dreaming. Yes 9 years is a long time most of those players broke out before that. The point is he is only 27 years old to think that he just wont be good ever come playoffs is silly. Players dont just lose their ability. I am a sens fan so by no means am I looking at giving the leafs excuses. But you would have to have an agenda to ignore the fact he is clearly injured right now.

 

[Egghead1999]

If Nathan MacKinnon can turn around an entire career after a good rookie year followed by a few years of basically being a bum, Matthews can turn his (thus far underperforming) playoff 'career' around as well.

If Toronto doesn't want him, I wouldn't think twice about trade 2 firsts and an impact player (ie productive middle six forward) to take him over in Utah

Utah is not in AZ anymore. Why trade for AM when you can have MM for free?

 

[flyingfingers]

I mean anyone that has Matthews in the top 3 let alone top 5 is dreaming. Yes 9 years is a long time most of those players broke out before that. The point is he is only 27 years old to think that he just wont be good ever come playoffs is silly. Players dont just lose their ability. I am a sens fan so by no means am I looking at giving the leafs excuses. But you would have to have an agenda to ignore the fact he is clearly injured right now.

Connor McDavid, Nathan MacKinnon and Auston Matthews top TSN's Top 50 NHL Player list | TSN

Connor McDavid is the NHL’s No. 1 player for an eighth consecutive season in TSN’s annual pre-season poll - the top choice on 20 of 20 ballots in TSN tabulations.

www.tsn.ca

I don't think anyone is saying Matthews sucks, or that he'll never have a good playoff run.

But can you win when he's your centerpiece making 13.25M per season? The Leafs have tried all sorts of configurations around him, but the results are the same. This year he has a top notch power forward to play with who's been awesome... but that hasn't helped him.

He's not an elite skater and he doesn't use his size. He has an out-of-this world shot, but in the playoffs, the opportunities to get that shot off in space don't open up nearly as much as they do during the season, when most games are played at 65-75% effort.

When those openings aren't there in the offensive end, he can't seem to create much. This has been the case for his entire playoff career.

And yeah, he's only 27. But it seems like the miles and injuries are already starting to add up... so it's easier to be bearish on Matthews than bullish.

 

[Garbageyuk]

He’s very clearly injured and has been all season. At some point a decision was made not to shut him down. Maybe due to recovery needing to be quite long. He hasn’t been himself all year. It’s highlighted more now, but this isn’t even normal playoff Matthew’s. it sucks to see a guy with his talent unable to play his game.

Leafs fans have been saying this literally every year of his entire career, every playoffs. He’s either secretly the toughest guy in NHL history playing through injury nonstop, or…

 

[PainForShane]

Utah is not in AZ anymore. Why trade for AM when you can have MM for free?

I very much doubt we'll be able to sign Marner. Also, we're pretty loaded on wing (even moreso when you consider our higher end prospects like But, Iginla) and we need another center to play with Cooley.

I have to think if Matthews stays quiet in gm6 (or longer depending how the Leafs do), our GM will make a push. I doubt we get him but a person can dream

 

[sampollock]

Again I suggest Marner is clearly worse. 1 shot in his last 3 games.

34 gets the pass ... I just dont get it for the past 7 years

 

[bert]

Connor McDavid, Nathan MacKinnon and Auston Matthews top TSN's Top 50 NHL Player list | TSN

Connor McDavid is the NHL’s No. 1 player for an eighth consecutive season in TSN’s annual pre-season poll - the top choice on 20 of 20 ballots in TSN tabulations.

www.tsn.ca

I don't think anyone is saying Matthews sucks, or that he'll never have a good playoff run.

But can you win when he's your centerpiece making 13.25M per season? The Leafs have tried all sorts of configurations around him, but the results are the same. This year he has a top notch power forward to play with who's been awesome... but that hasn't helped him.

He's not an elite skater and he doesn't use his size. He has an out-of-this world shot, but in the playoffs, the opportunities to get that shot off in space don't open up nearly as much as they do during the season, when most games are played at 65-75% effort.

When those openings aren't there in the offensive end, he can't seem to create much. This has been the case for his entire playoff career.

And yeah, he's only 27. But it seems like the miles and injuries are already starting to add up... so it's easier to be bearish on Matthews than bullish.

I dont think he is the only problem I think its because their two most veteran players are the softest of the group and that is Tavares and Reilly. Then you add Marner to that and the total collection of money and elite players is very easy to play against and doenst really have the alpha in them.

I also think its ridiculous to suggest that the miles and injuries are adding up on a 27 year old. He takes care of his body he just happens to be hurt right now with an actual injury not wear and tear.

Matthews is simply too good to be the piece to give up on and blame when its really 4 players. He plays the most important position and is the best of that group of 4. I think they gotta move off the other 3.

Nylander is not like the rest he is a gamer.

 

[sampollock]

 

[flyingfingers]

I dont think he is the problem I think its because their two most veteran players are the softest of the group and that is Tavares and Reilly. Then you add Marner to that and the total collection of money and elite players is very easy to play against and doenst really have the alpha in them.

Matthews is simply too good to be the piece to give up on and blame when its really 4 players.

Nylander is not like the rest he is a gamer.

Matthews is every bit as soft as Marner, Tavares and Reilly. You can't leave him out of that group. Nylander is the only one who's elevated his game.

Now I don't think they will move off Matthews, at least not in the next two years.

But Marner is as good as gone (if they lose this series) and probably Tavares as well. They'll fill those roles with different players, but IMO, I don't think it'll make that big a difference.

Matthews is their biggest issue.

You used the word alpha, and he has zero alpha in him. I don't understand why they ever thought it was a good idea to make him captain.

Even at the 4 Nations, it seemed like he was so happy to defer to guys like the Tkachuks and JT Miller.

He's the James Harden of the NHL. Insane individual talent. Some eye-popping numbers. But not a winner if he's your main guy.

 

[Kennerback]

View attachment 1036581

He’s a snappy dresser.

 

[Oilslick941611]

No they arent he is injured. Why does HF boards ignore injuries? Is it because people here didnt ever play competitve sports?

Alfredsson, Hossa, Datsyuk lots of greats were labelled playoffs chokers that reversed that mantra.

McDavid won the conn smythe on the losing team last playoffs while injured.

Its an attitude and sheer determination and Matthews doesn't have it.

 

[sampollock]

He’s a snappy dresser.

check his hand.... and of course no purse

 

[sampollock]

McDavid won the conn smythe on the losing team last playoffs while injured.

Its an attitudea and sheer determination and Matthews doesn't have it.

fans now think the figs will go after McDavid. it never ends

 

[Oilslick941611]

fans now think the figs will go after McDavid. it never ends

whos saying that?

 

[sampollock]

whos saying that?

few posts on these threads.
like Gretz and so many others were destined to the figs

 

[Oilslick941611]

Its funny, everyone loves to parrot how his goals per game is similar to Ovi, but nobody wants to say why they use goals per game instead of seasonal output

Exactly, theres no guarantee they play the same amount of games. Its time to drop Matthews a few tiers

 

[Oilslick941611]

few posts on these threads.
like Gretz and so many others were destined to the figs

I just dont understand why you quoted me to say that, it off topic, I'm an Oilers fan and didn't mention anything about McDavi to the leafs.

 

[sampollock]

I just dont understand why you quoted me to say that, it off topic, I'm an Oilers fan and didn't mention anything about McDavi to the leafs.

no sorry I did not mean that... my mistake you never said that

 

[Summer Rose]

whos saying that?

I've seen lots of people speculate that McDavid will sign in Toronto as a UFA, but I'm not sure if any of them are sane. Personally I find the idea rather preposterous.