Is Leon Draisaitl on pace to be the best non-“big six” nation hockey player ever?

[Treb]

Marian f***ing hossa joining a superteam to win 3 cups does not mean he had a better career than Leon Draisaitl who has been a top 5 or 6 plsyer for 5-6 year window. Hossa had maybe a 2 year window he was a top 6/7 player in the league

Statsny may have been a top 5/6 player level, didnt follow hockey back then

Draisaitl has passed Hossa for peak/prime and career is probaboy 1 or 2 years away.

Draisaitl will pass Hossa very soon, I agree.

Whether he pass Statsny remains to be seen.

 

[Voight]

Since the OP was clearly asking about ethnicity not place of residence, Mikita makes sense to count as Slovakian since that's where he was born.

You can argue since he was raised in Canada he counts as Canadian for this topic. But I have to imagine the ones who say Mikita is Canadian unironically say Brett Hull is Canadian because he was born there

To be fair Hull moved to Canada at 8 and stayed there until he was 18.

He only represented the US because he asked to be on the 1986 World Championship team and Hockey Canada said no.

No. Hasek, Kopitar, Chara, Stastny,


Imo Hossa was better than Leon. Leon is 6-10 (in this category) for me.

Hasek played for the Czech Republic, which is one of the big six nations.

 

[hamzarocks]

Draisaitl will pass Hossa very soon, I agree.

Whether he pass Statsny remains to be seen.

Statsny has high pt totals but low hart finishes

Was this due to being on bad teams?

He put a lot of pts up no doubt but had zero shot at any awards due to his era having 2 of the GOATs.

If draisaitl can put 2-3 more top 5 player in the league seasons I am confident he moves ahead of Stastny who doesnt seem to be a top 5-7 player for a decade

Draisaitl being one of the best playoff performers all time also gives him a huge boost vs most players

 

[tarheelhockey]

I don’t think that’s fair. Czechs had a good generation in the 90’s led by the Jagr and Hasek but the next generation the Slovaks were better with Chara, Hossa, Gaborik, Halak. Since then neither country has done great relatively speaking.

In the high level view:

Years ranked higher in IIHF table (since 2003)
Czechia 20
Slovakia 1

Olympic medal table (since 1992)
Czechia 1 gold, 1 bronze
Slovakia 1 bronze

IIHF medal table (since 1992)
Czechia 14
Slovaki 4

NHL total points scored / 1000 point scorers
Czechia 35,512 / 2
Slovakia 14,401 / 2

NHL total games played / 1000 game careers
Czechia 76,568 / 13
Slovakia 26,637 / 6

NHL HOF’ers
Czechia 2
Slovakia 2, or 3 if including Mikita

IIHF HOF’ers
Czechia 26
Slovakia 10

IIHF Directorate Award winners
Czechia 21
Slovakia 6

Including the Czechoslovak era, based on the current nationality of their hometowns:

Czech
Bubnik
Cerny
Drobny
Elias
Gut
Hamrlik
Hasek
Havlat
Hejduk
Hertl
Hlinka
Bobby Holik
Jiri Holik
Holocek
Horesovsky
Kaberle
Kralik
Lang
Nedved
Jagr
Martinec
Modry
Nedomansky
Novy
Pastrnak
Pospisil
Pouzar
Rucinsky
Ruzicka
Straka
Suchy
Svoboda
Tikal
Vlach
Vokoun
Voracek
Zabrodsky

Slovak
Bondra
Chara
Demitra
Dzurilla
Gaborik
Golonka
Hossa
Liba
Mikita (controversial)
Paloft
Satan
Starsi
Svehla
Peter Stastny
Anton Stastny
Visnovsky


Again it’s not that Slovakia doesn’t have its high points, but the Czechs are (and have always been) a tier above.

 

[authentic]

I'd rather build a team around Kopitar than Draisaitl.

I was thinking the same thing. Might have to rethink that one by the end of Draisaitl’s career though.

 

[Rorschach]

So his competition is:

Chara, Hossa, Josi, Kopitar? I'd say he's trending to be, if not already.

Just borrowing your list:
Draisaitl over…
Kopitar - two time playoff lead scorer, Conn Smythe finalist, 2 Cups: No
Chara - Norris, Cup as captain, multiple Final appearances: No
Josi- Norris, 1 Final: Maybe
Hossa - 3 Cups while playing first line, many Final appearances on three different teams: No

I think this question is being asked way too early.

 

[Soundwave]

Draisaitl's 17 points in 5 games (!!!!) while playing on one leg in Oilers-Flames series of two years ago is the greatest modern single series playoff performance IMO.

Dude looked like he was barely able to move to start the series.

 

[Three On Zero]

Mikita
P. Statsny
Hossa
Chara
Kopitar
Draisaitl
A. Statsny
Bondra
Gaborik
Josi

 

[KillerMillerTime]

If your talking RS only, yes
If you include and weight PO greater than RS, nope its Kopitar.

 

[Three On Zero]

If your talking RS only, yes
If you include and weight PO greater than RS, nope its Kopitar.

Kopitar is getting widely disrespected in this thread, the guy is/was a stud

 

[MessierII]

If your talking RS only, yes
If you include and weight PO greater than RS, nope its Kopitar.

That’s a tough argument when Draisaitl has the 5th best playoff points per game ever.

 

[KillerMillerTime]

That’s a tough argument when Draisaitl has the 5th best playoff points per game ever.

That's ok but Kopitar has had a great career with two Cups and didn't have a generational teammate like LD which obviously elevated his game.

 

[MessierII]

That's ok but Kopitar has had a great career with two Cups and didn't have a generational teammate like LD which obviously elevated his game.

How many cups he win without Richards and Carter and Voynov etc? Yes Kopi won cups and won them young but what did he accomplish when he didn’t have an elite supporting cast? I see a lot of really bad finishes in there.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Helmut Balderis is another name that should be getting talked about. He was unbelievable for his time.

 

[centipede2233]

Definitely wins best German. The hockey Übermensch if you will.

I still like Chara and Kopitar more as complete hockey players. Leon certainly a prolific producer but to me he cheats the game a lot. Talent wise he'd rank high but actually plenty of talented players have played in this league, and not very many of them a sizeable chunk of their on ice career with a fwd like McDavid. I'm also contractually obligated to hate all things Oilers so grain of salt etc.

I agree here. Look at the finals where drasaitl was a complete non factor. Players like kopitar and chara contribute in other ways and are made for playoff hockey. If I’m a small market team and I need to generate sales, I take drasaitl, if I’m a playoff team, I’d take kopitar or chara. As far as best player, drasaitl is the most talented, but I feel like kopitar and chara are better all around players, and it doesn’t hurt that their games are tailor made for the most important part of the season, the playoffs!

 

[Midnight Judges]

The emphasis on place of birth and nationality within the hockey community is unhealthy and without merit.

 

[MacMacandBarbie]

Statsny has high pt totals but low hart finishes

Was this due to being on bad teams?

He put a lot of pts up no doubt but had zero shot at any awards due to his era having 2 of the GOATs.

If draisaitl can put 2-3 more top 5 player in the league seasons I am confident he moves ahead of Stastny who doesnt seem to be a top 5-7 player for a decade

Draisaitl being one of the best playoff performers all time also gives him a huge boost vs most players

Didn’t he disappear in games 6 and 7 of the second round? He was also a non factor in the 3rd and 4th rounds. A player who has only compiled points against mid tier opposition in early rounds isn’t ’one of the best playoff performers of all time’

 

[MacMacandBarbie]

That’s a tough argument when Draisaitl has the 5th best playoff points per game ever.

He played in a high scoring era with an offensive minded team, and most of his points are in the early rounds. Raw stat arguments are so lazy.

Chara is hands down better with a better career. I don’t see Drai ever surpassing Chara, he was a freak. I think he ends up 2nd best, and with time will surpass Kopitar.

 

[tsujimoto74]

To clarify, I meant big six. Slovakia was left out.

That's a pretty big omission. Chara was pretty, pretty, pretty good.

 

[tsujimoto74]

HASEK!!!!!?

OP include Czechia in his big 6.

 

[hamzarocks]

Didn’t he disappear in games 6 and 7 of the second round? He was also a non factor in the 3rd and 4th rounds. A player who has only compiled points against mid tier opposition in early rounds isn’t ’one of the best playoff performers of all time’

Marian hoss had 0G + 0A in games 5 and 6 of 2010, 2013 and 2015 SCF as well.

The hawks had deeper teams with elite goaltending in 2013 and very good in 2015

Draisaitl was a huge reason of making the WCF with his play in R1 and R2

He has the 5th or 6th best ppg all-time at the moment.

Cups are won by depth+special teams+goaltending ultimately at the final games of a round/deep into the playoffs

No doubt Draisaitl has to be better as 6 pts in his last 12 playoff games is not good enough. He was super close to winning this year despite that poor play. We will see if he repeats that sort of play again or returns to his dominant self next 2-3 years where the oilers appear to be a top 2 or 3 contender league wide

 

[GhostfaceWu]

Kopitar is two-time playoffs leading scorer while playing Selke-level defense and won the Cup twice with one time being the captain. Both Cup runs he garnered many Conn Smythe votes

Draisaitl has placed third in playoff leading scoring and only once. He has scoring numbers but while playing behind McDavid.

Absolute nonsense post. Two 30 plus point runs in three years one being in 16 games the guy has 16 more playoff goals in 20 plus less playoff games. Pretty easy to be defensively responsible when you have prime doughty playing 30 minutes a game and prime quick stealing games every other playoff game totally the same as playing with bouchard and Skinner in place of this two.

 

[Dirty Dog]

OP include Czechia in his big 6.

I see that, what do I know

 

[MacMacandBarbie]

Marian hoss had 0G + 0A in games 5 and 6 of 2010, 2013 and 2015 SCF as well.

The hawks had deeper teams with elite goaltending in 2013 and very good in 2015

Draisaitl was a huge reason of making the WCF with his play in R1 and R2

He has the 5th or 6th best ppg all-time at the moment.

Cups are won by depth+special teams+goaltending ultimately at the final games of a round/deep into the playoffs

No doubt Draisaitl has to be better as 6 pts in his last 12 playoff games is not good enough. He was super close to winning this year despite that poor play. We will see if he repeats that sort of play again or returns to his dominant self next 2-3 years where the oilers appear to be a top 2 or 3 contender league wide

Draisaitl is better than Hossa. But he is nowhere near among the best playoff performers of all time, despite the impressive PPG stat you found on him. You really could argue that his underperforming cost his team a cup this year, as he didn't play anywhere up to his standards, and wasn't a good enough 2C to win a cup. I was extremely disappointed in his performance as a bandwagon Oilers fan this year.

 

[MessierII]

Draisaitl is better than Hossa. But he is nowhere near among the best playoff performers of all time, despite the impressive PPG stat you found on him. You really could argue that his underperforming cost his team a cup this year, as he didn't play anywhere up to his standards, and wasn't a good enough 2C to win a cup. I was extremely disappointed in his performance as a bandwagon Oilers fan this year.

Broken finger and broken rib. Draisaitl has been the best oiler in the playoffs in this era. More consistent than McDavid even.