Is Bettman plotting for a 36-team NHL?

[WTG]

Add a European division if you really want to grow the game. There are plenty of hockey nations and places where the game can grow. I personally think that serious backing can spark hockey in the Netherlands. Skating is already a big thing, people are tall, and the country is pretty sports-crazy. The country already is a top nation in field hockey. I think that it could work (I am very biased). Germany is already emerging with top talent too. Those are places where there can be growth.

Having some of the other big teams in Europe join the NHL would grow it as well. However, I suppose their hockey associations wouldn't like that too well. Just like the super-league issues in football. I don't think that will go down well.

Chasing revenues is what the NHL is after not real growth though.

 

[Three On Zero]

Do you own a team? What fan cares about revenue? They constantly ad advertising, raise ticket prices, show no games for free..who cares? They're not hurting for money. Anyone who goes grocery shopping knows what hurting for money is. NHL owners can't relate.

It hurts above the individual level. Adding too many teams diluted former rivalries down to seeing each other 3x a season. It'll probably go down to 2x if they go to 36 teams. It's not a good thing. Any older fan will tell you, there was time we used to circle the calendar for a game against Montreal or Buffalo. Now, not so much. The word "rivals" doesn't even exist anymore.

All fair points, I just want to see the game grow

 

[BB79]

All fair points, I just want to see the game grow

At what point should it be done growing? Not sarcastic just curious. I come across a lot of people who say that, I find it interesting as someone who thinks the league should have stopped growing a long while ago.

Growing by things such as adding the women's pro league is good. I just think the NHL itself has gone too far

 

[WatchfulElm]

The only expansion I might support at this point is the addition of a European division, because these would be natural markets, and fans in those countries deserve to see the top players. I mean, Stockholm makes a lot more sense than Salt Lake City...

But of course it poses a massive challenge because of the time zones and travelling. And I doubt this will ever happen.

 

[Fenway]

Since the NHL started expanding in 1967 it has been amazing that only one franchise went belly up (Oakland/Cleveland) but the Sharks of today can trace their beginning to the Seals/Barons.

There have been painful relocations of 3 of the 4 WHA teams, the sad saga of both Atlanta teams, Kansas City relocating to Denver/New Jersey and Atlanta 2.0 winding up in Winnipeg.

The Whalers owner finally admitted to a Hartford radio station in 2007 that leaving Connecticut was a blunder but his hatred of the Governor of the state clouded his thinking. He owned 25% of SportsChannel New England ( today NBC Sports Boston ) and in the late '90s, the value of RSNs exploded. The Whalers had the same territory as the Bruins and the only restriction was games against the Bruins his signal would be blacked out in Boston and Providence. The Bruins signal would be blacked out in Connecticut.

He would have wound up with a brand new arena under his control just as UConn basketball exploded in both the men's and women's divisions. All he had to do was suffer the losses at the Civic Center while the new building was being constructed and he refused.

Why the Thrashers wound up moving to Winnipeg has been well-documented and it had nothing to do with lack of fan support. The truth came out a couple of years after the team left and it caused the NBA to order the owners of the Hawks to sell the team.

The Flames moving came down to Calgary oilmen had to get a NHL team because Edmonton had one and they offered far more than what the franchise was worth.

Quebec moving to Denver was manipulated by Molson who simply wanted the Nords out of the province. You must remember that the Nords had a very large following on the Island of Montreal and in 1994-1995 they had a very good team. The Habs were struggling and the cost of building the new Molson Centre was out of control.

Molson had enough clout with Quebec politicians to prevent funding for a new arena in Quebec City and then offered the Nords owner a golden parachute.

The fans in Quebec were blindsided because five weeks after this game - they were gone.

NORDIQUES’ MOVE TO DENVER FINALIZED

Denver, which lost an NHL franchise in 1982, got another one Wednesday. Despite a last-ditch effort by local businessmen to keep the Nordiques in Quebec, league owners approved the sale of the club…

www.chicagotribune.com

NEW YORK — Denver, which lost an NHL franchise in 1982, got another one Wednesday.

Despite a last-ditch effort by local businessmen to keep the Nordiques in Quebec, league owners approved the sale of the club to a group that will move the team to Denver.

As expected, owners approved the sale of the Nordiques to COMSAT Entertainment Group for $75 million. Every team supported the transfer except Montreal, which abstained.
The team winding up in Colorado had Molson's fingerprints all over it because of their connections with Coors.

I have always wondered what would the NHL have done if the Nords won the Cup in 1995.

NHL hockey is a business and has been from the start

Why do we have three periods? It allows TWO intermissions to sell concessions.

Keith Olbermann did this almost 10 years ago and he summed up the business of hockey in 6 minutes.

 

[DelZottoHitTheNetJK]

We have a team playing in a low tier NCAA arena but yeah let's add 2 more teams, makes sense

Like anything else in life, it's all about the money

 

[Fenway]

We have a team playing in a low tier NCAA arena but yeah let's add 2 more teams, makes sense

Like anything else in life, it's all about the money

Bettman will never concede that Arizona was a failure and will cite to his deathbed if the Coyotes didn't exist Auston Matthews never puts on skates.

Can you imagine if the unthinkable happens - The Coyotes make the playoffs and then go on a run?

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

Hockey is a game of mistakes...especially with so much systems play going on. The best way to increase mistakes is to expand and increase the number of mistake-prone players in the league. Teams are so over-coached right now, and the baseline talent for systems play is so good, it's really hard to get a lot of excellent chances in a game. It's at the point we have to rely on high tech sticks to increase shot velocity and handcuffing defensemen so forwards get easier access into the zones.

But I think once you get to 36 teams, you will have to restructure the league a fair bit. How do you balance travel around 36 cities, and giving the fans in each market at least one opportunity per season to see all the stars, while also maintaining rivalries? It's not like baseball where you can play a bazillion games in a season. And also, how do you keep it balanced with 13 teams in the western conference, and make it somewhat fair for travel in western divisions?

It's difficult. I'm not entirely in favor of more expansion...but not entirely against it, either. Either way, we do have to do something to make the games more interesting to watch. If people are so adamant on neutering physical play, the only thing left is to get the goals going up on a regular basis.

 

[Chuck Norris Trophy]

Let's just make it an even 50 while we're at it.

 

[Fenway]

The NHL BOG is looking at a major reboot.

Right now nobody will challenge Jeremy Jacobs but the clock is ticking.

BUT the DNA will not change

If Fred Fifflehoffer shows up at the NHL offices with a Billion Dollar cashier's check to put a team in Glendive, Montana they will consider it.

 

[tmlms13]

The league is water-ed down too much already, they need to contract.

Like think about goalies, there is what 10 maybe 15 teams where you don't have to think about it or go with the hot hand. The rest are struggling to just get competent goalies and it will only get worse.

How many 7-6 games will there be where its basically last shot wins.

 

[fcpremix88]

Atlantic: Quebec City
Metro: Atlanta x3
Central: Houston
Pacific: Sal Tlay Ka Siti

 

[Hischier and Hughes]

I see comments about a 36-team league affecting rivalries but heres a perspective to consider...

You could run 4-team divisions like football; would this not increase rivalries ten-fold over a decade or so?

Imagine the Devils Islanders Rangers and Flyers having their own division to fight over... as a Devils fan its actually quite terrifying lol. Or Edmonton Calgary Vancouver Seattle, woof!

Just something to consider with how many clumps of teams we tend to have nowadays. And yeah, ive looked and had some trouble choosing which teams to be left out and so on (im looking at you, Ottawa) - but just as a fun exercise, its interesting to see what combinations are come up with.

 

[Not The One]

Quebec moving to Denver was manipulated by Molson who simply wanted the Nords out of the province. You must remember that the Nords had a very large following on the Island of Montreal and in 1994-1995 they had a very good team. The Habs were struggling and the cost of building the new Molson Centre was out of control.

Molson had enough clout with Quebec politicians to prevent funding for a new arena in Quebec City and then offered the Nords owner a golden parachute.

Lol, what is this? This is just flat-out false conspiracy-level logic. Every single statement is wrong.

The Canadian dollar was hurting teams bigtime, the QC government at that time truly had no money or public support to fund a public arena, Bettman desperately wanted to chase US dollars and the Habs had absolutely nothing to do with it.

 

[dracom]

36 just seems like way too many teams. not sure if there would be enough talent for that many teams; unless some teams just have absolute horrid rosters full of bottom 6 and bottom pairing players.

 

[Voight]

NHL is just a Ponzi scheme at this point, being held together by expansion fees.

32 is more than enough teams. 36 won't survive. Hockey just sent that popular and never will be.

Besides, you'd have to find people willing to pay the expansion fees. If the NHL wants $1bn or more, that's a steep cost.

The owner of the Jazz for example, is worth $2.1bn. I doubt he's going to liquidate and pay a billion dollar fee.

 

[Voight]

Since the NHL started expanding in 1967 it has been amazing that only one franchise went belly up (Oakland/Cleveland) but the Sharks of today can trace their beginning to the Seals/Barons.

There have been painful relocations of 3 of the 4 WHA teams, the sad saga of both Atlanta teams, Kansas City relocating to Denver/New Jersey and Atlanta 2.0 winding up in Winnipeg.

The Whalers owner finally admitted to a Hartford radio station in 2007 that leaving Connecticut was a blunder but his hatred of the Governor of the state clouded his thinking. He owned 25% of SportsChannel New England ( today NBC Sports Boston ) and in the late '90s, the value of RSNs exploded. The Whalers had the same territory as the Bruins and the only restriction was games against the Bruins his signal would be blacked out in Boston and Providence. The Bruins signal would be blacked out in Connecticut.

He would have wound up with a brand new arena under his control just as UConn basketball exploded in both the men's and women's divisions. All he had to do was suffer the losses at the Civic Center while the new building was being constructed and he refused.

Why the Thrashers wound up moving to Winnipeg has been well-documented and it had nothing to do with lack of fan support. The truth came out a couple of years after the team left and it caused the NBA to order the owners of the Hawks to sell the team.

The Flames moving came down to Calgary oilmen had to get a NHL team because Edmonton had one and they offered far more than what the franchise was worth.

Quebec moving to Denver was manipulated by Molson who simply wanted the Nords out of the province. You must remember that the Nords had a very large following on the Island of Montreal and in 1994-1995 they had a very good team. The Habs were struggling and the cost of building the new Molson Centre was out of control.

Molson had enough clout with Quebec politicians to prevent funding for a new arena in Quebec City and then offered the Nords owner a golden parachute.

The fans in Quebec were blindsided because five weeks after this game - they were gone.

NORDIQUES’ MOVE TO DENVER FINALIZED

Denver, which lost an NHL franchise in 1982, got another one Wednesday. Despite a last-ditch effort by local businessmen to keep the Nordiques in Quebec, league owners approved the sale of the club…

www.chicagotribune.com

NEW YORK — Denver, which lost an NHL franchise in 1982, got another one Wednesday.

Despite a last-ditch effort by local businessmen to keep the Nordiques in Quebec, league owners approved the sale of the club to a group that will move the team to Denver.

As expected, owners approved the sale of the Nordiques to COMSAT Entertainment Group for $75 million. Every team supported the transfer except Montreal, which abstained.
The team winding up in Colorado had Molson's fingerprints all over it because of their connections with Coors.

I have always wondered what would the NHL have done if the Nords won the Cup in 1995.

NHL hockey is a business and has been from the start

Why do we have three periods? It allows TWO intermissions to sell concessions.

Keith Olbermann did this almost 10 years ago and he summed up the business of hockey in 6 minutes.

I can't stand the pretentious Molson family, but man take off the tinfoil hat.....

 

[SheldonJPlankton]

40-team NHL with a 5 round 32-team playoff format.

Sweet.

 

[PeE eL DuBoiS]

With 32 teams as is, some teams will go 50, 60, even 100 years without winning the cup. Depressing to think about.

You say potato, I say Toronto.

 

[garbageteam]

The NHL will keep adding teams so long as there are owners who are willing to put up the money (to quite possibly lose) and support the team year in year out. People aren't going to "tune out" of the game or their team because the league as 32, 36, 40 or even 60 teams.

You can saturate the entire continent with teams and so long as the product is still entertaining and the marketing and fan dollars are still there

If miraculously you have 8 owners with a billion USD and have the wherewithal and stomach to lose money yet continue supporting their team, I don't see any reason why the NHL would say no to even 40, nevermind 36. Canucks fans won't tune out just because there are "too many teams". Miami fans probably wouldn't either. And if you had 2, 4, or even 8 more teams... that's 2, 4, or 8 more captive audiences.

At some point the NHL will almost force feed hockey to markets just by being there. Outside of some glaring examples (Arizona), it generally works. You don't see zero people interested or going to a game in Nashville, or Florida, or (back then) Atlanta or Winnipeg.

You add a team, you add more fans interested in hockey than the (very few) fans you lose just because a team is added.

You can legitimately put a team in Houston, Atlanta, Salt Lake City, Kansas City, Portland, Hartford, Quebec City and GTHA2 and well, there you have it. 8 more markets' worth of fans. Hell you could throw in San Diego, Charlotte, Cincinnati, Indianapolis, Austin, Cleveland and even Saskatoon or Halifax in there because why the hell not.

The barrier is having the owner willing to front that money.

 

[cowboy82nd]

Add a European division if you really want to grow the game. There are plenty of hockey nations and places where the game can grow. I personally think that serious backing can spark hockey in the Netherlands. Skating is already a big thing, people are tall, and the country is pretty sports-crazy. The country already is a top nation in field hockey. I think that it could work (I am very biased). Germany is already emerging with top talent too. Those are places where there can be growth.

Having some of the other big teams in Europe join the NHL would grow it as well. However, I suppose their hockey associations wouldn't like that too well. Just like the super-league issues in football. I don't think that will go down well.

Chasing revenues is what the NHL is after not real growth though.

I don’t see a European division working right now.

 

[alko]

Let's just make it an even 50 while we're at it.

Every USA state and every Canadian province will have their NHL team.

 

[SEALBound]

Bettman will never concede that Arizona was a failure and will cite to his deathbed if the Coyotes didn't exist Auston Matthews never puts on skates.

Can you imagine if the unthinkable happens - The Coyotes make the playoffs and then go on a run?

The Coyotes have never been able to build anything major because they've never got the big time franchise player. They needed Matthews. They needed Bedard.

Whenever they are THAT bad, they end up with Strome or Hayton types. Not bad players but all successful teams now have a Matthews or McDavid or Crosby, some sort of major franchise power. When you think about it...Coyotes are really the only team left in the NHL that have never really had one to lean on. They have been stuck in that mediocrity purgatory for decades. Thats why I was really rooting for them to get Bedard.

I worry that expanding the league to 36 could just add 4 more teams to that mediocrity purgatory.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Christ I hope not. There's maybe 7 or 8 good teams this year.

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

So, back to seeing teams once a year and having no rivalries to boot on top of incompetent members of the NHL and terrible refs.