Value of: If Arizona offersheets Matthews what do you do?

[Dr Quincy]

Really!!! American kid, born and raised there, idolized the Yotes growing up. Can live in relative anonymity, community wise. Remember, this is the kid who spurned the normal hockey route and took the money to play in Europe. I am not convinced he is completely happy in Toronto. He is playing second fiddle to JT and Marner. I know it is blasphemy to Leaf fans, of which I am one, but maybe trade 34 in the offseason. Get quite a haul for him and fix a lot of warts. And if the Leafs do win a Cup, they can still give him a ring, like the 04 Red Sox did with Nomar. He still would have helped them win, be it in a secondary manner.

1) People grow up. Who someone rooted for as a kid means less and less the older you get and the more professional years you have. Your career is a business.
2) "Spurned the normal hockey route"... as you said, he was an American kid.... who went to the US NDTP. That IS the normal route. What he did by going to Switzerland is he did what was in the best interests of his professional future and made sure to earn an income. In other words: he chose business over sentimentality.
3) Who says he wants to live in relative anonymity? And it's ironic that some posters say: He'll be a hero in Arizona and will make the whole state hockey crazy.. while you are saying that Arizona will not be too focused on him. Which is it? If the same side is arguing 2 opposite things, at least 1 of them must be wrong.
4) I'm sure Nomar would have preferred not being dealt to a loser team and would have rather have actually won a World Series. It's the achieving the ring that matters, not the actual piece of jewelry. He has a better shot at winning in TOR (or any number of cities if he wants to sign an offer sheet) than in the greater Phoenix/Glendale/Scottsdale/Tempe/Flagstaff/Winslow area.... or wherever that team is going to be playing in 3 years.

 

[LeafsNation75]

1) People grow up. Who someone rooted for as a kid means less and less the older you get and the more professional years you have. Your career is a business.

We saw that when Steven Stamkos re-signed with Tampa Bay instead of possibly signing with the Leafs when he almost became a UFA in 2016.

 

[Mudds]

Not all teams want to give signing bonuses and it's one advantage the Leafs have, the same way others can mention the no state tax advantage the Lightning have and used it when they re-signed Kucherov and tried to use when they talked to Tavares.

Signing bonuses are still salary cap. Arizona will want to do anything to get people in the seats

 

[LeafFever]

Signing bonuses are still salary cap. Arizona will want to do anything to get people in the seats

He's right though, most teams can't do the signing bonuses. leafs now have a big advantage. Players want it and often it makes the actual $ paid-out less after 1-2 years than the cap hit.
Tavvares got 15.25 million on July 1st and 27 million in cash this season alone. Matthews will want something like that.
I see nothing that tells me Arizona is in that situation to pay that.

 

[LeafsNation75]

He's right though, most teams can't do the signing bonuses. leafs now have a big advantage. Players want it and often it makes the actual $ paid-out less after 1-2 years than the cap hit.
Tavvares got 15.25 million on July 1st and 27 million in cash this season alone. Matthews will want something like that.
I see nothing that tells me Arizona is in that situation to pay that.

I remember before the Leafs traded Bryan McCabe to the Panthers they didn't want to do it before a specific date because McCabe was due a signing bonus. Instead the trade happened after McCabe was paid it by Toronto, so that's one example of an NHL team who couldn't afford a contract with a signing bonus.

 

[Neutrinos]

Why would Matthews want to go there and not be able to contend?

Hometown and big money is great and all but not if you're going to be out of the playoffs all the time. They need a lot more work before Matthews would go imo. he will get good money in Toronto, be on a contender - and the team dynamics make it seem like a family already

So Matthews can make more money each year AND get a longer off-season to spend with his family and friends?

Why would he say no to that?

 

[thepuckguru]

the max will be 15.9 I think. But is it anymore hilarious than non-Leaf fans claiming Arizona can afford that?

The max deal is 20% of of cap total. Cap is expected to be $83 million, therefore max deal is $16.6 million.
Beyond that there is a good chance that the billionaire owner of the Houston Rockets, Tilman Fertitta, will be the owner of the yotes. He has plenty of money to pay that to Matthews, however his intention is to move the team to Houston so why throw that much money and those 4 first round picks for a non-hometown boy.

 

[LeafsNation75]

The max deal is 20% of of cap total. Cap is expected to be $83 million, therefore max deal is $16.6 million.
Beyond that there is a good chance that the billionaire owner of the Houston Rockets, Tilman Fertitta, will be the owner of the yotes. He has plenty of money to pay that to Matthews, however his intention is to move the team to Houston so why throw that much money and those 4 first round picks for a non-hometown boy.

If the Rockets owners did eventually plan to move the Coyotes to Houston why would Matthews sign an offer sheet with them knowing that? Even if he wanted to play at home at some point in his career it wouldn't make sense if they are not going to be in Arizona anymore.

 

[indigobuffalo]

The poll is dumb. You’d be crazy to match Arizona’s offersheet.

If they OS Matthews at $16Mx7 years Toronto can not afford that and Arizona can.

Nothing you can do about it.

Except get 4x 1st round picks and sign Duchene as a UFA for probably $8M (saves $4M against the expected cost for Matthews) and you can keep Gardiner and Kapanen.

To me that’s a better situation for the Leafs AND the Coyotes.

Hell if I was Bettman I would force it to happen.

Leafs would have:
Hyman - Tavares - Marner
Kapanen - Duchene - Nylander
Marleau(Johnsson after 2019-20) - Kadri - Johnsson(Moore after 2019-20)
Lindholm - Gauthier - Grundstrom

Plus you have 8x consecutive 1st round picks to keep the cupboards stocked.

 

[indigobuffalo]

IMO the gap between Matthews and Duchene is not 4x first round picks and $4M in cap.

 

[thepuckguru]

If the Rockets owners did eventually plan to move the Coyotes to Houston why would Matthews sign an offer sheet with them knowing that? Even if he wanted to play at home at some point in his career it wouldn't make sense if they are not going to be in Arizona anymore.

Exactly. It's not going to happen.

 

[BlueBaron]

IF Matthews wants out, you just offer him the couple years to bring him to UFA ASAP at the $10.1 figure. Toronto isn't going to take only two 1sts, and a 2nd, 3rd. They match everytime. But then they're paying him +$10M and have to balance the cap, while AZ waits for him to hit UFA. Then they have a shot at him in three years. For free.. Costs them nothing. Offering him max money and term just locks him into Toronto for seven years when/if they match or costs them a fortune in compensation.
Matthews obviously has to actually want out to make it work.

If he wants out you don't need to offer him anything. He'll just take deals to be A UFA as soon as possible and it would be tampering to call him and ask his long term plans.

Since all indications are he is a happy Leaf I'd start the count down for 8 years from now.

 

[wetcoast]

Again I'm only talking about if Arizona offersheets Matthews and the value is 4 1sts (any legitimate offersheet for Matthews will be 4 1sts)

Toronto's offer for McDavid could be something crazy like

4 1sts (remember those are Arizona unprotected 1st round picks)
2 1sts (from Toronto)
Sandin

Again I'm asking if Toronto should call Edmonton first before match Arizona offer, I have no idea what the offer would have to be with 6 1st round picks going one way (I'm just spit balling on the offer but the bulk of the value will be be Arizona 4 1sts).

For a team like Edmonton if they want to restart their rebuild but this time doing it properly this could be one hell of an offer

Just because Toronto would be in a cap jam doesn't mean that the Oilers are going to trade McDavid.

Simply put the Oilers aren't trading him.

 

[Drytoast]

Take the picks and tip my hat thanks

 

[wetcoast]

So Matthews can make more money each year AND get a longer off-season to spend with his family and friends?

Why would he say no to that?

Arizona is a pretty decent team on the rise.

Adding Mathews would make them a playoff team year in and year out.

 

[604]

I hate how fans talk about a team "offer sheeting" or "giving an offer sheet" to somebody. The player has to sign an offersheet, and I can't see any reason why Matthews would sign in Arizona.

You can't see why the money and playing in his hometown might be reasons he would go there?

 

[ChompChomp]

You can't see why the money and playing in his hometown might be reasons he would go there?

Hell the Sharks offered Tavares more money but he went home to Toronto.

 

[Dr Quincy]

You can't see why the money and playing in his hometown might be reasons he would go there?

You can't see why shaky ownership that is looking to sell off after owning the team for a year in a market that isn't viable, may not actually have the money? And that even if they did, the same offer would come from 30 other teams?

The hometown thing is big to fans, not to pros. Is it any factor at all? Maybe for some. But it's way down on the list.

 

[604]

You can't see why shaky ownership that is looking to sell off after owning the team for a year in a market that isn't viable, may not actually have the money? And that even if they did, the same offer would come from 30 other teams?

The hometown thing is big to fans, not to pros. Is it any factor at all? Maybe for some. But it's way down on the list.

I'm responding to you who said, "I don't see any reason." I put two out there pretty easily.

I didn't say he would 100% do it or that he should do it.

You are responding to a post based putting words in my mouth while I'm actually responding to you using what you actually said.

 

[indigobuffalo]

You can't see why shaky ownership that is looking to sell off after owning the team for a year in a market that isn't viable, may not actually have the money? And that even if they did, the same offer would come from 30 other teams?

The hometown thing is big to fans, not to pros. Is it any factor at all? Maybe for some. But it's way down on the list.

Conjecture. Conjecture. Conjecture.

Congrats! You’ve summoned the ghost of Socrates.

Even if the average NHLer didn’t care about playing in their hometown, that’s irrelevant when we’re addressing one specific one.

We don’t really know whether Matthews cares about a) more money than Toronto can offer, b) his hometown, or c) being THE GUY on the team. He’s not even a 1C on Toronto right now.

There’s no evidence to say these reasons support or oppose the likelihood of Matthews signing an offer sheet.

And as for the Coyotes’ financial issues, they’re bolstered by the NHL profit sharing plan, and even if the team loses money that is just a tax write-off for the owner so it’s negligible to begin with.

What would be of interest is a player asset that brings in a lot of fans and sells a lot of merchandise.

Hard to imagine that Matthews doesn’t do a lot of both.

 

[LeafsNation75]

Hell the Sharks offered Tavares more money but he went home to Toronto.

One major difference. Tavares was a UFA, where as Matthews can only be an RFA.

 

[Cubs2024wildcard]

He's right though, most teams can't do the signing bonuses. leafs now have a big advantage. Players want it and often it makes the actual $ paid-out less after 1-2 years than the cap hit.
Tavvares got 15.25 million on July 1st and 27 million in cash this season alone. Matthews will want something like that.
I see nothing that tells me Arizona is in that situation to pay that.

A millionaire who doesn't have money?

Lol whut?

 

[LeafFever]

A millionaire who doesn't have money?

Lol whut?

They cheat to reach the cap floor. The organization owes more debt than value the entire franchise. Owner in every way, shape and form appears to be spending the bare minimum

 

[LeafFever]

Conjecture. Conjecture. Conjecture.

Congrats! You’ve summoned the ghost of Socrates.

Even if the average NHLer didn’t care about playing in their hometown, that’s irrelevant when we’re addressing one specific one.

We don’t really know whether Matthews cares about a) more money than Toronto can offer, b) his hometown, or c) being THE GUY on the team. He’s not even a 1C on Toronto right now.

There’s no evidence to say these reasons support or oppose the likelihood of Matthews signing an offer sheet.

And as for the Coyotes’ financial issues, they’re bolstered by the NHL profit sharing plan, and even if the team loses money that is just a tax write-off for the owner so it’s negligible to begin with.

What would be of interest is a player asset that brings in a lot of fans and sells a lot of merchandise.

Hard to imagine that Matthews doesn’t do a lot of both.

They lost 50 million last season alone after revenue sharing. And losses aren't tax write-offs at all. Their franchise right now is essentially worthless given they owe more than they'd get in a sale.

 

[HogtownSabresfan]

Conjecture. Conjecture. Conjecture.

Congrats! You’ve summoned the ghost of Socrates.

Even if the average NHLer didn’t care about playing in their hometown, that’s irrelevant when we’re addressing one specific one.

We don’t really know whether Matthews cares about a) more money than Toronto can offer, b) his hometown, or c) being THE GUY on the team. He’s not even a 1C on Toronto right now.

There’s no evidence to say these reasons support or oppose the likelihood of Matthews signing an offer sheet.

And as for the Coyotes’ financial issues, they’re bolstered by the NHL profit sharing plan, and even if the team loses money that is just a tax write-off for the owner so it’s negligible to begin with.

What would be of interest is a player asset that brings in a lot of fans and sells a lot of merchandise.

Hard to imagine that Matthews doesn’t do a lot of both.

The Coyotes can make it work by shortening the term — Leafs won’t like that at all because not buying UFA years. Offer him 5 x $15 M.

This leaves Matthews with one massive contract still somewhere at 27. Big difference than hitting UFA at 29.

Leafs might not match — personally I’d take the four picks and run if you can lineup another centre.