Post-Game Talk: Huge comeback win! Jets 4-3

[bennylundholm]

I think Petan has a shot at being a regular even when everyone is healthy.
Pomo's main concern with Petan is defensively. If he can show that he can handle the defensive part of his game, I think Pomo can trust him enough to play good minutes. And he is capable of generating some big offence.

 

[GNP]

Really don't get Maurice's love affair with Copp, is it his hair, seriously Copp is pretty good defensively but that's about it, he is a decent 4th liner and that is really where he should slot in! IMO

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I can see why Maurice likes Copp, and that's because he's much like Lowry, in that he's big, a good skater, and is very good defensively. He's also similar to Lowry, in that they both do not have great scoring touch.

I watched Copp score a couple of beautiful goals last year, in the top corner of the net, and I thought-- "man this guy is underrated". After watching him this year, I've seen him continually miss the net, on some great scoring chances. Hands of stone it seems.

Copp either needs a lot of target practise, or just use him as a defensive shut down player, along with Lowry. He is a good skater, and he does hustle.

 

[GNP]

Some of it is that Myers is just not that good. He's not bad, and he's amazing to have as the 3rd guy after Trouba and Buff... but without those two in front his limitedness gets exposed.

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I have to stick up for Myers here, in that he does come up with some really "big goals" and he's one of our best offensive defenseman. He won us the game in overtime against the Caps, and has scored other big goals. He also is a great guy on the power play, and his shot "seldom" misses the net.

I'm not saying he's our best defenseman, but he's certainly an upper middle type of defenseman that a lot of teams would love to have.

He does make some mistakes in the defensive zone ( like vs the Caps) but you can always count on him to score goals when you need them. I believe he had 2 goals called back in the last 5 games-- and that was bad luck.

I think he's a great team player, and very valuable to the Jets -- and he'll end up winning us a lot of games, with his offensive scoring ability. When you have a guy that can score from the back end like Myers- "you have to keep him."

 

[KingBogo]

One of the posts on defensive play got me thinking about giveaways/takeaways, so I took a look at who was leading the way for the Jets. Interesting list:

Forwards

1. Armia +21
2. Little +14
3. Lowry +14
4. MP + 13
5. Scheifele + 11
6. Tanev +9
7. Rosie - 0
8. Copp - 1
9. Hendricks -2
10. Connor - 4
11. Laine - 14
12. Ehlers - 15
13. Wheeler - 17

Defense

1. Chiarot -11
2. Morrissey -13
3. Enstrom -23
4. Trouba - 23
5. Myers -30
6. Buff -33
7. Kulikov - 33

Pretty impressive by Armia and Morrissey taking into account minutes played.

 

[GNP]

One of the posts on defensive play got me thinking about giveaways/takeaways, so I took a look at who was leading the way for the Jets. Interesting list:

Forwards

1. Armia +21
2. Little +14
3. Lowry +14
4. MP + 13
5. Scheifele + 11
6. Tanev +9
7. Rosie - 0
8. Copp - 1
9. Hendricks -2
10. Connor - 4
11. Laine - 14
12. Ehlers - 15
13. Wheeler - 17

Defense

1. Chiarot -11
2. Morrissey -13
3. Enstrom -23
4. Trouba - 23
5. Myers -30
6. Buff -33
7. Kulikov - 33

Pretty impressive by Armia and Morrissey taking into account minutes played.

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Good list, and it says a lot - "just look at Chiarot" here, who I think is a reliable steady defenseman, yet a lot of posters dump on him ??? I don't get it.

Plus the guy's got a great shot -"one of the hardest shots on the team -- up to 107 mph. Can really take out a lot of ankle bones.

 

[scelaton]

One of the posts on defensive play got me thinking about giveaways/takeaways, so I took a look at who was leading the way for the Jets. Interesting list:

Forwards

1. Armia +21
2. Little +14
3. Lowry +14
4. MP + 13
5. Scheifele + 11
6. Tanev +9
7. Rosie - 0
8. Copp - 1
9. Hendricks -2
10. Connor - 4
11. Laine - 14
12. Ehlers - 15
13. Wheeler - 17

Defense

1. Chiarot -11
2. Morrissey -13
3. Enstrom -23
4. Trouba - 23
5. Myers -30
6. Buff -33
7. Kulikov - 33

Pretty impressive by Armia and Morrissey taking into account minutes played.

Armia also leads the Jets in this category, having surged into first place just this season:

Most under-appreciated relative to value to team:
1. Armia
2.Little
3. *
4.*
5.*

*Doesn't really matter, as no one else is close

 

[Holden Caulfield]

One of the posts on defensive play got me thinking about giveaways/takeaways, so I took a look at who was leading the way for the Jets. Interesting list:

Forwards

1. Armia +21
2. Little +14
3. Lowry +14
4. MP + 13
5. Scheifele + 11
6. Tanev +9
7. Rosie - 0
8. Copp - 1
9. Hendricks -2
10. Connor - 4
11. Laine - 14
12. Ehlers - 15
13. Wheeler - 17

Defense

1. Chiarot -11
2. Morrissey -13
3. Enstrom -23
4. Trouba - 23
5. Myers -30
6. Buff -33
7. Kulikov - 33

Pretty impressive by Armia and Morrissey taking into account minutes played.

Giveaways/Takeaways are pretty much worse than a useless stat. It is so ridiculously subjective as to make it actually more deceptive than anything, which is why it is worse than useless. What counts as a giveaway-takeaway can vary from play to play with the same stat keeper, nevermind when you try to compare between rinks. It really doesn't tell you anything.

 

[Ducky10]

Giveaways/Takeaways are pretty much worse than a useless stat. It is so ridiculously subjective as to make it completely useless. What counts as a giveaway-takeaway can vary from play to play with the same stat keeper, nevermind when you try to compare between rinks. It really doesn't tell you anything.

Thank you for saving me a lot of typing.

 

[KingBogo]

Giveaways/Takeaways are pretty much worse than a useless stat. It is so ridiculously subjective as to make it actually more deceptive than anything, which is why it is worse than useless. What counts as a giveaway-takeaway can vary from play to play with the same stat keeper, nevermind when you try to compare between rinks. It really doesn't tell you anything.

I guess you are right? Since there is no way Armia, Little, Lowry, MP and Scheifele can be associated with the best Jets at taking away and keeping control of the puck. It must be a random stat

 

[Derfel]

yeah slump isn't the right word but he seemed much more dynamic last year

He's a top 100 player in the league. He's fine. If anything, this "slump" makes him cheaper to lock up for 4-5 years.

 

[truck]

Armia also leads the Jets in this category, having surged into first place just this season:

Most under-appreciated relative to value to team:
1. Armia
2.Little
3. *
4.*
5.*

*Doesn't really matter, as no one else is close

Perreault though. He makes lines better - even within the top 6. He's probably the Jets 3rd best forward.

 

[Blue Shakehead]

So if Ben Chiarot is -11 on giveaways/takeaways in 440 minutes mostly against the leagues worst players and Buff is -33 in 1200 minutes against the leagues best players, who is better?

So the stat doesn't account for time on ice or quality of opponent. We also know it doesn't count how many times a player has full possession but gives up up by flipping it up the middle or icing it or just skating over center and dumping it otherwise Ben Chiarot would be -12 million over his career.

TL;DR: Giveaways/Takeaways are bullshit.

 

[truck]

I guess you are right? Since there is no way Armia, Little, Lowry, MP and Scheifele can be associated with the best Jets at taking away and keeping control of the puck. It must be a random stat

He is right though. Giveaways in particular are pure garbage - especially when not rated for ice time or as a percentage of touches.

 

[Treskov]

I think that this is just willful blindness. There is no valid comparison from a defensive liability POV between #55 and Laine. Love having Laine on the team, but he has regressed and is a serious defensive liability 5 on 5. He is very unreliable on board and one-on-one puck battles. Unless he cleans this up, he will be an even bigger liability in the playoffs. In that case, I would not blame Maurice one bit for limiting his ice time.

Sorry for slow answer. Too much work and stress.

I think you are looking corsi too much But i agree, he needs to clean some things up. I know i compared #29 and #55, but i only ment that they both loose pucks sometimes. Scheifs as a center should actully defend much more anyways than a high scoring winger. I think this is just new to him. Good to see him at the 3rd line and hope he will excel there.
He hasn´t been that bad consider how high the jets are I would understand this better if we were the blackhawks.

 

[Whileee]

Sorry for slow answer. Too much work and stress.

I think you are looking corsi too much But i agree, he needs to clean some things up. I know i compared #29 and #55, but i only ment that they both loose pucks sometimes. Scheifs as a center should actully defend much more anyways than a high scoring winger. I think this is just new to him. Good to see him at the 3rd line and hope he will excel there.
He hasn´t been that bad consider how high the jets are I would understand this better if we were the blackhawks.

Corsi, you say?

Not sure that's a metric in Scheifele's favour this season...

 

[Saidin]

Corsi, you say?

Not sure that's a metric in Scheifele's favour this season...

For the life of me, I can't understand these graphs. Is it good or bad?

 

[Whileee]

For the life of me, I can't understand these graphs. Is it good or bad?

The Jets have the lowest share of shot attempts when Matthias, Wheeler, Scheifele or Connor are on the ice. Laine isn't much better. f

They do best in terms of shot attempts when Perreault, Lowry, Roslovic, Poolman or Ehlers are on the ice. Upper right is good, lower left is bad.

 

[Treskov]

The Jets have the lowest share of shot attempts when Matthias, Wheeler, Scheifele or Connor are on the ice. Laine isn't much better. f

They do best in terms of shot attempts when Perreault, Lowry, Roslovic, Poolman or Ehlers are on the ice. Upper right is good, lower left is bad.

Okay, thanks for explaining it for me. I suck at these. They don´t tell you the whole truth thou. What about highscoring changes against? I think we let the teams shoot from near the boards and from the blueline, so we are shutting the center of the ice, so it means that only thing to do is put the puck to net and look for rebounds.

 

[10Ducky10]

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I have to stick up for Myers here, in that he does come up with some really "big goals" and he's one of our best offensive defenseman. He won us the game in overtime against the Caps, and has scored other big goals. He also is a great guy on the power play, and his shot "seldom" misses the net.
I'm not saying he's our best defenseman, but he's certainly an upper middle type of defenseman that a lot of teams would love to have.
He does make some mistakes in the defensive zone ( like vs the Caps) but you can always count on him to score goals when you need them. I believe he had 2 goals called back in the last 5 games-- and that was bad luck.
I think he's a great team player, and very valuable to the Jets -- and he'll end up winning us a lot of games, with his offensive scoring ability. When you have a guy that can score from the back end like Myers- "you have to keep him."

I hope Chevy trades Myers this summer. My arse could crack a walnut every time he handles the puck in his own zone.
5.5m caphit for our 3rd best RHD???
Getting rid of Myers and losing Enstrom's contract this summer could free up 11.25m of cap space.
He's great as a 3rd pairing D that can kill penalties and play 18 or so minutes a night but I wouldn't give him any more than 3m a year. Time to trade him and let Poolman become the 3RHD next season.

 

[GNP]

I hope Chevy trades Myers this summer. My arse could crack a walnut every time he handles the puck in his own zone.
5.5m caphit for our 3rd best RHD???
Getting rid of Myers and losing Enstrom's contract this summer could free up 11.25m of cap space.
He's great as a 3rd pairing D that can kill penalties and play 18 or so minutes a night but I wouldn't give him any more than 3m a year. Time to trade him and let Poolman become the 3RHD next season.

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And here I thought you were starting to like Myers-- Ducky ?? I guess not, but I haven't seen any of your posts lately, wanting to trade him off ?? Maybe you've been taking a break from the boards here ??

To be honest with you -- I'd be totally shocked if the Jet's traded him--especially with Trouba not yet signed. Chevy's not that stupid.

Myer's is getting a lot of good comments on these boards lately, and unfortunately you'll have to put up with his defensive zone play. He is getting better you know.

With Ehlers and Myers being 2 of my favorite Jets, I'd be very dis-heartened to see Myer's traded, and I just don't think we'll see it anytime soon. He's one of the reasons we shot up to 1st place, along with Helle of course.

Enjoy the playoffs Ducky, and everytime Myers scores-- he just may make it into your "goodbooks" Maybe he'll resign for $3.5 like you want, but I think not. I was hoping you'd soften your stance on Myers, with his great play lately- I guess not.

PS- I don't even think you'd want Myers traded, if we lose Trouba ?? we'd then be screwed Ducky. I'm in your camp on Enstrom -- so we do agree on something here. It's encouraging.

 

[10Ducky10]

After watching the Washington game how can you say he has improved. Look at his page and tell me how long you are going to wait for him to reach his potential.

 

[GNP]

After watching the Washington game how can you say he has improved. Look at his page and tell me how long you are going to wait for him to reach his potential.

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Everybody has a bad game my friend, but I think you should really look at the fact Myers will score 40-45 points this year, and that's why Maurice likes him. He may not be the best defensive type of defenseman, but he sure makes up for the odd mistake with his offensive play.

I know you don't like him because he's not tough enough, but he brings offense. Also Trouba and the guys make their fair share of mistakes as well.