How did Vegas get the reputation of being the establishment?

[Cyclones Rock]

Say what you will about the rules for Vegas, but they've been an ultra competitive team from the start and it looks like they will continue to be for the foreseeable future. They hit a home run with their expansion conditions. Most would not have.

McCrimmon, McPhee and Foley are/were simply top notch. They eschewed the traditional thinking that a team will perform at a peak level for 7-8 years or so and then "rebuild". Rebuild is simply a euphemism organizations use to justify having had an awful core long term strategy.

These guys learned from Chicago and LA who gave aging core players long term "reward" contracts when the reasonably expected performance of these core players would have been to decline from their peak levels. Pittsburgh evidently had blinders on as they've followed the same sorry path.

If I were to run an NHL franchise, I'd heavily borrow from the Vegas and Tampa models. Any model which sustains high performance for a decade in a cap environment should be applauded and not dismissed as a fluke of expansion rules.

Give credit where credit is due.

 

[snag]

Most NHL cities won't draw when the team sucks. BOS/NYR//CHI/DET/COL/CAR have had empty arenas in the periods when their teams have been bad. Its not like the NFL where unless its JAX/MIA the place will be totally full even if the team is 3-14.

Then let's see what happens in the dessert.

 

[snag]

It's all cyclical, so they will have the bottom-out years. And it'll be fine. So who cares

Hasn't happened yet. Some of us wanna see it

 

[snag]

Seattle hasn't been competitive outside of one fluke PDO year, and they got the same rules.

True. Thing is, Vegas got different rules from those before and teams were navigating new waters. With Seattle, after what happened with Vegas, the rest of the league said "f*** that!" and clamped down weren't so willing to pitch softballs.

Seattle is the norm...Vegas has benefited as the exception.

 

[hangman005]

Hasn't happened yet. Some of us wanna see it

and then everyone will get mad when we win the draft lottery year after year

 

[G50]

They haven't felt pain yet and people believe that is by design. I don't think it is necessarily. They have done a great job in their short time frame.

Pain will come one day though.

They did learn what karma was when SJ made sure they missed the playoffs to allow the Avs who they were disgusting towards the previous season to end their Cup drought. Best.playoffs.ever.

 

[Summer Rose]

and then everyone will get mad when we win the draft lottery year after year

The year is 2056. The Vegas Golden Knights manage to win the Stanley Cup and the first overall draft pick in the same year.

They use the first overall pick to select a player already on their team.

 

[TaLoN]

I feel like the hate this team gets is unwarranted.

 

[SannywithoutCompy]

It's a real mystery lmao

 

[Three On Zero]

This man :

 

[Three On Zero]

I like Vegas but that’s dirty as f***.

 

[Dr Pepper]

Hasn't happened yet. Some of us wanna see it

Well, there was that one season where their skaters went something like 0 for 12 over a series of shootout losses down the stretch, and it cost them a playoff spot.

That was a fun one.

And yeah, as mentioned earlier, Mark Stone is probably directly responsible for at least half of the vitriol aimed at Vegas, either from the repeated LTIR shenanigans, from questionable and dangerous plays on the ice (Heiskanen is at least close to returning), and just being an unlikeable guy in general.

 

[hangman005]

Well, there was that one season where their skaters went something like 0 for 12 over a series of shootout losses down the stretch, and it cost them a playoff spot.

That was a fun one.

And yeah, as mentioned earlier, Mark Stone is probably directly responsible for at least half of the vitriol aimed at Vegas, either from the repeated LTIR shenanigans, from questionable and dangerous plays on the ice (Heiskanen is at least close to returning), and just being an unlikeable guy in general.

0 for 19

 

[Dr Pepper]

0 for 19

Oof.......whoever was in net for those games (Thompson I think?) must've been cursing the team after each one.

I remember the Dallas one pretty vividly and I know it stretched for a bit but couldn't remember the others.

 

[Salsero1]

True. Thing is, Vegas got different rules from those before and teams were navigating new waters. With Seattle, after what happened with Vegas, the rest of the league said "f*** that!" and clamped down weren't so willing to pitch softballs.

Seattle is the norm...Vegas has benefited as the exception.

Edmonton won a cup less than 10 years into their NHL tenure. Immediate success is bad, right?

 

[tarheelhockey]

Say what you will about the rules for Vegas, but they've been an ultra competitive team from the start and it looks like they will continue to be for the foreseeable future. They hit a home run with their expansion conditions. Most would not have.

McCrimmon, McPhee and Foley are/were simply top notch. They eschewed the traditional thinking that a team will perform at a peak level for 7-8 years or so and then "rebuild". Rebuild is simply a euphemism organizations use to justify having had an awful core long term strategy.

These guys learned from Chicago and LA who gave aging core players long term "reward" contracts when the reasonably expected performance of these core players would have been to decline from their peak levels. Pittsburgh evidently had blinders on as they've followed the same sorry path.

If I were to run an NHL franchise, I'd heavily borrow from the Vegas and Tampa models. Any model which sustains high performance for a decade in a cap environment should be applauded and not dismissed as a fluke of expansion rules.

Give credit where credit is due.

Well said.

The expansion draft was in 2017 for god’s sake! And they got a bunch of castoffs that people thought would make them a bottom-dweller for years. They only have a couple of guys left from that year. Continuing to chalk their success up to the expansion draft is just irrational behavior.

Since that draft, Vegas has made a TON of moves that drew criticism in the moment, but turned up aces for them in the long run. They win because they have a clear plan and follow it aggressively.

Also, they’re one of the teams that wears the black hat and owns it. Boston has had a ton of success with that approach, as have a few other teams that can be easily named because they won Stanley Cups that way.

An identity and a plan. It sounds simple, but it’s the difference between mediocrity and success in all walks of life.

 

[hangman005]

Oof.......whoever was in net for those games (Thompson I think?) must've been cursing the team after each one.

I remember the Dallas one pretty vividly and I know it stretched for a bit but couldn't remember the others.

Yep Thompson, it seemed like it was just he and Dadanov who felt the need to show up to games. LT deserved so much better so often but I'm still pissed we sent him to Washington

 

[kerrabria]

I feel like the hate this team gets is unwarranted.

Idk what you mean by "the establishment," but they're disliked for many obvious reasons.

• Most favorable expansion conditions in NHL history and took advantage of it masterfully
• Especially callous and disposable treatment of fan favorite players
• Abusing the LTIR loophole
• Several core players (Eichel, Stone, Hanifin, Pietrangelo etc.) left their teams on bad terms, and/or have generally unfavorable reputations around the league
• Mercenary approach to roster-building and don't build from within, which makes the franchise feel soulless to outsiders

 

[Washed Up 29YearOld]

People say it was the favorable expansion draft rules that irks them but truly it was the inept gm’s who made idiotic trades that put Vegas over the top

 

[Big Trout]

To this day I've never seen biased reffing against the Habs like Vegas got in their wcf series a couple years ago, only time in my life it really ever felt like they were playing against the refs.

Even tho my team won that series it left such an unpleasant taste.

 

[1989]

This man :

It's 2025 and this was a championship win in 2023, how the f*** did you find a photo with so many artifacts it looks like it was taken in 1995??

 

[NoName]

Really good team right off the bat, sustained success, including a Cup, abrasive, heavy, somewhat dirty style of play and a skilled management team that is pretty good at exploiting loopholes and technicalities to field a team above the cap while on paper squeeze them under.

 

[alvinia]

dirty players, biased reffing, embellishments

I think Cassidy is a great coach and Stone is a great player, but the two of them have something to do with this

 

[Curufinwe]

True. Thing is, Vegas got different rules from those before and teams were navigating new waters. With Seattle, after what happened with Vegas, the rest of the league said "f*** that!" and clamped down weren't so willing to pitch softballs.

Seattle is the norm...Vegas has benefited as the exception.

Seattle might not have got as good offers as Vegas, but they almost made terrible picks. Like Carsen Twarynski from the Flyers.

 

[M88K]

Most NHL cities won't draw when the team sucks. BOS/NYR//CHI/DET/COL/CAR have had empty arenas in the periods when their teams have been bad. Its not like the NFL where unless its JAX/MIA the place will be totally full even if the team is 3-14.

The NFL doesn't really apply, they play 1 day a week, and a fraction of the games. If they played an 82 game season, arenas for bad teams would be half full too.