Hockey Canada should be accountable

[Dr Pepper]

Those are called "away" fans. Great to see and certainly helping a little bit!

After a while it depends on the volume.

Like watching the Leafs play in Ottawa, the vast number of Torontonians who make the trip essentially turn a road game into a home game.

I won't say it happens EVERY time Canada plays in Europe, but there have been times where it feels like a home game for them.

 

[WeAre]

I've been watching twitter this day and there have been hundreds tweets on Ccm:s account where canadian people blames ccm for the lose.

 

[Urbanskog]

More kids play soccer in Canada and Boys hockey participation is down.

Affordability and the insane practice of playing the same sport year round are the reason hockey participation is down.

Think big picture.

I haven't seen an IIHF survey of players for this year but the previous editions have all indicated continuous growth in Canada. This is not a well-thought argument anyway as Canada and the US are so far ahead other countries regarding participation numbers.

 

[Pouchkine]

After a while it depends on the volume.

Like watching the Leafs play in Ottawa, the vast number of Torontonians who make the trip essentially turn a road game into a home game.

I won't say it happens EVERY time Canada plays in Europe, but there have been times where it feels like a home game for them.

It might happen in a Russia-Canada game in Sweden or Finland to some degree but not when playing the hosts.

 

[golfortennis]

To those saying you can't win every year, so deal with it: the issue isn't the fact of losing. Of course other teams can win it. The problem really comes down to the fact that Hockey Canada seems to almost actively not put their best foot forward. Be it choosing the coaches(there have been some real doozies), or the style of play desired(which I believe the coach is at least somewhat persuaded to follow), there seems to be an attitude, not of "we want to win", but more of "we want to win this way." Some years you have players to make it work, others you don't. I won't say as to whether or not the player selections are questionable, as I'm not up on enough players to know, but they certainly do not use the talents the players have. Can anyone say the players were put in the best position to succeed by Hunter?

 

[blindpass]

To those saying you can't win every year, so deal with it: the issue isn't the fact of losing. Of course other teams can win it. The problem really comes down to the fact that Hockey Canada seems to almost actively not put their best foot forward. Be it choosing the coaches(there have been some real doozies), or the style of play desired(which I believe the coach is at least somewhat persuaded to follow), there seems to be an attitude, not of "we want to win", but more of "we want to win this way." Some years you have players to make it work, others you don't. I won't say as to whether or not the player selections are questionable, as I'm not up on enough players to know, but they certainly do not use the talents the players have. Can anyone say the players were put in the best position to succeed by Hunter?

Note: each of the big five hockey countries feels this way when they lose.

You'd think we were blown out by Kazakhstan, not edged out on a bad bounce and unlucky break by a decent Finnish team with one of our more lacklustre rosters ever.

I didn't agree with every choice, some of them bothered me a lot, but there's way too much handwringing about it.

 

[Boonk]

Absolutely embarassing how weve been knocked out in the quarters twice in 4 years. This time on home soil. This organization needs to be restructured from the ground up. F***ing horrible.

 

[Pouchkine]

The defeats are one thing, but it's also how they happen. Too many times in the past 10 years we seemed to have teams lacking skill and especially guys without a good sense of team play, the coaching and the development is to blame. Also 60 Junior teams is the best way to go to dilute the talent. Here in the Quebec league 16/18 teams make the playoffs, how is that any good to help players improve? Too many guys playing against weak team and playing with average players. Hockey Canada only cares about $ not the quality of the national teams.

 

[Mehar]

Hockey Canada should be accountable for Tim Hunter. He has to be the worst coach that has ever coached Canada in this tournament. Cannot
believe that Frost saw no action in OT, and was not called upon for the Penalty Shot. At the end of the day, Finland was the better team overall
throughout the game. Canada scored 1 goal against Russia, and 1 goal last night. Bad breaks or not- you are not going to win many games when
you score one goal a game, your power play being trash, and the forwards not getting it done. Dipietro was the reason Finland did not win the game
in Regulation Time. Finland deserves full merit for outplaying Canada for most of the game. Not impressed with Canada in this tournament.

 

[golfortennis]

Note: each of the big five hockey countries feels this way when they lose.

You'd think we were blown out by Kazakhstan, not edged out on a bad bounce and unlucky break by a decent Finnish team with one of our more lacklustre rosters ever.

But there's the problem: a lackluster roster. OK, maybe that is out of HC's control. But why on earth is one of the leading scorers glued to the bench in OT in the quarterfinal?

The Finns were going to be a tough out no matter what. Anyone denying that has their head up their ass. But the brass were at least guilty of neutralizing themselves with the decision making. If the roster is so lacklsuter why are you riding 4 guys? Lackluster or not, the other guys are good, just like the opponents.

Again, this goes back to what I said earlier: a guy like Perry barely making the team because, skating, or Crosby being a late pick because, whatever, these are all symptomatic of when HC tries to, as someone posted some time before the tournament, be the smartest guys in the room, and end up hurting themselves rather than opponents. I'm ok with losing when the other team plays better. I'm ok when the team plays well and breaks go against them. But I'm not ok when management actively negates the talents on hand, and then wonders why they lost. He wanted the fastest team ever, and then plays a trap. WTF?

ETA: I may seem fired up about this, and I am, ever since Renney had the nerve to blame the players publicly for not winning a couple years ago.

 

[Pouchkine]

The trap on home ice with 17k fans behind you for 2 straight games!

 

[DoyleG]

Means nothing? Have you ever played any sport? It means nothing if Canada plays a prevent no attacking game, it would mean a lot if Canada would play to their strengths. Some of the comments here are laughing stock and complete ignorance for hockey and sports.

You keep crying "smaller ice, smaller ice" if that is supposed to be an important factor. It's not.

Compared to your rather poor knowledge about sports, I have played sports through my career and analyze how teams perform (something that you don't).

Having all the talent in the world means nothing if the coach is useless in bringing it together and controlling any egos or issues with the players.

Finland had more than enough players with the "small ice experience" to negate the so-called "advantage". The Juniors is nothing more than an international audition and preview for the NHL coaches and managers. Europeans have no problem coming over and adjusting to the different ice surfaces because that is part of the job.

Focus on real issues and stop trolling. Its becoming pathetic.

 

[Bounces R Way]

USA has lapped Canada in the last half decade for development.

They really have. The USNTDP is the best in the world for developing high end hockey talent. Hockey Canada needs to get back to being innovators and actually encouraging growth from it's pool of players rather than just (mis)managing it. Ask yourself if the training staff, facilities, coaching, and skill development would really be better as a 16-19 year old playing for a rinky dink Junior team out of Medicine Hat or for a federally funded program surrounded by peers of the highest skill level. There's no comparison. Canada will always have a strong base as the popularity of the game is very pronounced here, but for fostering the cream of that crop to take the steps needed in that earliest stages of development it lags behind.

 

[MessierII]

They had a great team. For whatever reason the power play didn’t click and they caught some ridiculously bad breaks late in the first elimination game. It’s hockey. It happens.

 

[golfortennis]

They had a great team. Thanks to Tim Hunter and his staff the power play didn’t click and they caught some ridiculously bad breaks late in the first elimination game. It’s hockey. It happens.

FTFY. Special teams especially are coaching problems, IMO.

Ferraro was talking about how they weren't making the Finns work. Why is that? It can't be laziness, the guys hustle their asses off the rest of the game.

 

[blindpass]

But there's the problem: a lackluster roster. OK, maybe that is out of HC's control. But why on earth is one of the leading scorers glued to the bench in OT in the quarterfinal?

The Finns were going to be a tough out no matter what. Anyone denying that has their head up their ass. But the brass were at least guilty of neutralizing themselves with the decision making. If the roster is so lacklsuter why are you riding 4 guys? Lackluster or not, the other guys are good, just like the opponents.

Again, this goes back to what I said earlier: a guy like Perry barely making the team because, skating, or Crosby being a late pick because, whatever, these are all symptomatic of when HC tries to, as someone posted some time before the tournament, be the smartest guys in the room, and end up hurting themselves rather than opponents. I'm ok with losing when the other team plays better. I'm ok when the team plays well and breaks go against them. But I'm not ok when management actively negates the talents on hand, and then wonders why they lost. He wanted the fastest team ever, and then plays a trap. WTF?

ETA: I may seem fired up about this, and I am, ever since Renney had the nerve to blame the players publicly for not winning a couple years ago.

What leading scorer? One of the ones that put up almost all their points getting overplayed in a 14-0 drubbing of Denmark? They should have been testing and preparing their lineup that game rather than worrying about goal differential. So we agree there were mistakes, just not what they were... Because this isn't science and nobody gets it right all of the time.

I know this, I'd still take Hockey Canada and Tim Hunter's choices over the hfboards consensus opinion, overall. I'm pretty confident that there will be plenty of reflection on the outcome and that everyone involved wants to win more than anything else. This is all more about unrealistic expectations, some magical thinking that the best team always wins (but not saying we were that this time), and hindsight bias -- because without one bad bounce they might have won gold and the conversation would be completely different...

...And maybe a bit of poor sportsmanship, it isn't our tournament or our sport. Not every loss needs to spark an inquisition.

 

[MessierII]

FTFY. Special teams especially are coaching problems, IMO.

Ferraro was talking about how they weren't making the Finns work. Why is that? It can't be laziness, the guys hustle their asses off the rest of the game.

I agree. They never seemed to utilize the big point shot from their D for whatever reason. You have guys like Bouchard and Ty Smith on the team you need to utilize that weapon. They always tried to work it down low or walk in from the half wall. Super predictable.

 

[Passionis]

Canadian fans just want to preserve being the best, which is super difficult. Especially when other nations (US and Russia) are dumping resources which would be difficult to match by Canada. Then you throw on top the socio economic and demographic issues and Canada would be hard pressed to keep up. It's already very prohibitive to play hockey in Canada due to costs involved and getting difficult every year, while non traditional demographics of Canada are expanding at insane rate.

I think with incredible efforts Canada will continue to be the best but at a lesser level. The power gap created after collapse of ussr and eastern europe is over (which was thoroughly enjoyed in 2000's) and they have to get very creative.

 

[DoyleG]

I haven't seen an IIHF survey of players for this year but the previous editions have all indicated continuous growth in Canada. This is not a well-thought argument anyway as Canada and the US are so far ahead other countries regarding participation numbers.

This has been a drum beat that's been going on for decades.

Soccer only outnumbers hockey when we talk about the lower age groups. When we get to the older age brackets, its been shown that hockey come out on top.

Hockey still does a good job of retaining players the older they get compared to other sports.

 

[1909]

I am Canadian, and it's about times that we wake up and admit that other countries have great players and great hockey programs. Some of the best, top NHL players are NOT Canadian. The last Stanley Cup won by a Canadian based team was in 1993 !!!!

 

[Rob]

They really have. The USNTDP is the best in the world for developing high end hockey talent. Hockey Canada needs to get back to being innovators and actually encouraging growth from it's pool of players rather than just (mis)managing it. Ask yourself if the training staff, facilities, coaching, and skill development would really be better as a 16-19 year old playing for a rinky dink Junior team out of Medicine Hat or for a federally funded program surrounded by peers of the highest skill level. There's no comparison. Canada will always have a strong base as the popularity of the game is very pronounced here, but for fostering the cream of that crop to take the steps needed in that earliest stages of development it lags behind.

Unfortunately the CHL would be against it.

 

[Rob]

The last Stanley Cup won by a Canadian based team was in 1993 !!!!

Um those are club teams. Nothing to do with what we are talking about here.

 

[1909]

Um those are club teams. Nothing to do with what we are talking about here.

Owned totally by Canadian businessmen and covered by major broadcasting companies.... who are also covering the Stanley Cup series whatever a Canadian team is part of it or not.

 

[Rob]

Owned totally by Canadian businessmen and covered by major broadcasting companies.... who are also covering the Stanley Cup series whatever a Canadian team is part of it or not.

........which has nothing to do with the success or failure of Hockey Canada.

 

[1909]

........which has nothing to do with the success or failure of Hockey Canada.

Have you read the first part of my original post ?