OT: HFNYR OT Thread XII - Please read rules in the OP

[Glen Sathers Cigar]

Wow Silverfish, I literally feel the exact same way as you, right down to paying the same in rent (1700) for an apartment I don't like.

I recently watched Michael Moore's documentary "Where to Invade Next" where he goes to different European countries and tries to learn what they do better than America. The way work and jobs are treated in Italy was eye opening. 4 day work weeks, 2 hour lunches, unlimited vacation time, mandatory raises, complete benefits.

It really is hard to not get overly discouraged as a young person trying to make my way through work life. Then you add in the fact that I don't even like what I do and it makes it even worse.

Older generations look down on our generation and say we don't work hard and whatever, meanwhile we're getting paid less to work more and things are more expensive now.

I just wanna hit the powerball.

 

[silverfish]

I was in a very similar situation as you, silverfish, and I'm starting a new job with a new company on Monday. I knew I was underpaid based on the market. I knew I had a very specialized skill set that was vital to the success of the project I was working on. I knew the company didn't have anyone available who could replace what I brought to the table. I knew my bill-rate for clients, and thus I knew exactly how much money I generated for the company directly each year. I raised flags with my direct manager and he knew full well that everything I said was true, but he's also a friend and he said my concerns were falling on deaf ears.

A lot of companies don't feel the need to pay people appropriately until they're threatened in some way. Either the person says they're leaving, or they sense that the facade is fading around them and they need to appease them somehow. The company I am leaving is the same way. I told them for months we needed to hire up, and that it's hard to find developers who can do this kind of work; That we're competing with very large, established companies in town for talent. I told my boss, who told his bosses, that I was no longer ignoring daily calls from headhunters. I started to see just how sought-after I was in the space, and I knew that would make it even harder for them to replace me. I told them that. Nothing. Finally I came to them with an offer from my new company and they asked what it would take to keep me, and I told them not to bother. 5 months of "Hey, I'm going to quit and you guys are going to be screwed," and they never cared until I had an offer in hand.

The company I'm leaving has a lot of those "new era" workplace perks. Ping pong tables, beer in the fridge, company happy hours, etc. I wore shorts and flip-flops to work in the summer. They gave us "flex time" instead of vacation days, and it's a load of crap. All it does is save them money when people leave the company, and it makes people feel guilty about taking time off because they have no idea if other people are being as liberal with it as they are. It's not like Adobe's sabbatical program that lets you take 4 weeks off to do whatever you want after you've been there 5 years, but they try very hard to market it that way.

I'd test the market and see what's out there. You might find something that works for you. But honestly, I think you have to sit and have an honest look at what it is you want. Money is great, but if you're making more money and still miserable for 40 hours a week, it's just never going to fix things. I'm actually taking a step backward in responsibility at my new job, but I'm working in a new industry with a newer stack and far better compensation at a huge, well established company. So don't be afraid to pivot to get to where you want to be.

Great post, thanks. It's true at this place, as well. A lot of people I've seen get raises or promotions is because they come back to the agency and say: "Hey, I got this offer, match it or I'm leaving". And finally they wake up, and they match it.

I understand that's how the game is played, but I don't want to play it. Why does it have to be that way? Well. I guess that's just the way it is (things will never be the same).

Definitely time to look in the mirror and really figure it out.

Wow Silverfish, I literally feel the exact same way as you, right down to paying the same in rent (1700) for an apartment I don't like.

I recently watched Michael Moore's documentary "Where to Invade Next" where he goes to different European countries and tries to learn what they do better than America. The way work and jobs are treated in Italy was eye opening. 4 day work weeks, 2 hour lunches, unlimited vacation time, mandatory raises, complete benefits.

It really is hard to not get overly discouraged as a young person trying to make my way through work life. Then you add in the fact that I don't even like what I do and it makes it even worse.

Older generations look down on our generation and say we don't work hard and whatever, meanwhile we're getting paid less to work more and things are more expensive now.

I just wanna hit the powerball.

Where's your apartment? I'm in Alphabet City with two roommates. Wanna trade?

I feel ya. Any time somebody asks me what I want to do, I always say I want to be retired

I'd love nothing more than to run my own department and try some of this stuff out, and have the liberty to do that... but with what Megusta said, well, grass is always greener, I guess.

 

[The Gloaming]

I feel ya. Any time somebody asks me what I want to do, I always say I want to be retired

My man

 

[PlamsUnlimited]

Just finished tearing up a deck and blueprinting a new one. Send help

 

[SA16]

I've pretty often felt the exact same way as you. It's not as bad at my current job since I actually enjoy it but my time at my previous job was miserable. It felt like every day was the exact same thing and a complete waste of 10 hours a day. I was out of work for around 9 months between my previous and current job (long story) and honestly it was one of the best experiences of my life. No deadlines, time restraints, or working on someone else's schedule. I pretty much got to do what I wanted with my time every day and it was great. Obviously this won't be reasonable if you have a lot of expenses and minimal savings and no alternate sources of income.

However, in my case, I think my entire philosophy on the 9-5 has been pretty much ruined by my past and all the people I've hung out with. I was a semi-pro poker player in college and for a bit after. Still have a bunch of friends who play full time, invest and trade cryptos, or are daily fantasy sports high stakes players (myself included in several of those) and it really changes your thoughts on things. All of those are hard work and incredibly time consuming but it's so much more freeing knowing you can do them mostly at your own pace and when you want to.

So I guess the only thing I can suggest is are there any particular skills you have that you might be able to turn into a large source of income that can potentially get you out of what you're currently in? It can be something ranging from gambling (poker, dfs [not gambling :-|]),to investing where in stocks, real estates, cryptocurrencies, or starting your own business. None of them are necessarily an easy thing to do but if you can get into them and be successful you can eventually get yourself out of the constant 9-5 cycle. It's definitely not a quick process though to get to that level in anything.

Other than that the only other thing I could think of that would keep you in the 9-5 structure but not seem like it is - as you mention - a job in the NHL or with sports. The only problem is they are in extremely high demand and the lower level positions often start out incredibly low paying so it's not easy to get in and make a lot of money by any means. I've applied to several jobs in the sporting industry (Engineering degree though) and have had basically zero success with them.

 

[Trxjw]

Great post, thanks. It's true at this place, as well. A lot of people I've seen get raises or promotions is because they come back to the agency and say: "Hey, I got this offer, match it or I'm leaving". And finally they wake up, and they match it.

I understand that's how the game is played, but I don't want to play it. Why does it have to be that way? Well. I guess that's just the way it is (things will never be the same).

Definitely time to look in the mirror and really figure it out.

I forgot what the exact statistic is, but most people regret taking counter offers anyway. If they couldn't acknowledge the issue without you threatening them with your departure, then odds are when it comes time for another raise or a promotion, they'll be just as obtuse.

The recruiter that I eventually hooked up with for this new gig said to me that looking for a new job is a lot like buying a house. That you should set some guidelines for what you want and then expand them a little bit in either direction, and figure out what your "must haves" are versus what you can live with. You might find something a little outside of your comfort zone that works really well for you. I thought that was good advice.

 

[silverfish]

I forgot what the exact statistic is, but most people regret taking counter offers anyway. If they couldn't acknowledge the issue without you threatening them with your departure, then odds are when it comes time for another raise or a promotion, they'll be just as obtuse.

The recruiter that I eventually hooked up with for this new gig said to me that looking for a new job is a lot like buying a house. That you should set some guidelines for what you want and then expand them a little bit in either direction, and figure out what your "must haves" are versus what you can live with. You might find something a little outside of your comfort zone that works really well for you. I thought that was good advice.

Right, that's exactly why I don't want to play that game of get an offer so they can match the offer. If I'm out there fielding offers, I want to leave. If the only reason I get a raise is because I get an offer, I should leave.

That's awesome advice. Come this weekend, I'm gonna set aside some time to really punch this out, and figure out what I want.

Thanks!

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

I have been a bit quiet the last few days but I would like to inform you that I will be back as of today. Reason being, I applied for a management position in Austria and had the interviews at 9 AM on the mornings after the last 2 Ranger games. Quite inconvenient but it is what it is.

I had to sacrifice the Rangers and did not see them win 4-1 twice. Not sure if this means I shouldn't watch the Saturday game, but I will think about that.

Anyway, good news. I got the job. Now sorting out the logistics of the move from The Hague to Vienna! Woohoo. Big step up within the organization. Huge jump in salary (32k more annually) and some nice extras. Anyway, I am very excited. It means I'll be able to go to some more KHL games in Bratislava as well, which is 45 minutes away.

 

[silverfish]

I've pretty often felt the exact same way as you. It's not as bad at my current job since I actually enjoy it but my time at my previous job was miserable. It felt like every day was the exact same thing and a complete waste of 10 hours a day. I was out of work for around 9 months between my previous and current job (long story) and honestly it was one of the best experiences of my life. No deadlines, time restraints, or working on someone else's schedule. I pretty much got to do what I wanted with my time every day and it was great. Obviously this won't be reasonable if you have a lot of expenses and minimal savings and no alternate sources of income.

However, in my case, I think my entire philosophy on the 9-5 has been pretty much ruined by my past and all the people I've hung out with. I was a semi-pro poker player in college and for a bit after. Still have a bunch of friends who play full time, invest and trade cryptos, or are daily fantasy sports high stakes players (myself included in several of those) and it really changes your thoughts on things. All of those are hard work and incredibly time consuming but it's so much more freeing knowing you can do them mostly at your own pace and when you want to.

So I guess the only thing I can suggest is are there any particular skills you have that you might be able to turn into a large source of income that can potentially get you out of what you're currently in? It can be something ranging from gambling (poker, dfs [not gambling :-|]),to investing where in stocks, real estates, cryptocurrencies, or starting your own business. None of them are necessarily an easy thing to do but if you can get into them and be successful you can eventually get yourself out of the constant 9-5 cycle. It's definitely not a quick process though to get to that level in anything.

Other than that the only other thing I could think of that would keep you in the 9-5 structure but not seem like it is - as you mention - a job in the NHL or with sports. The only problem is they are in extremely high demand and the lower level positions often start out incredibly low paying so it's not easy to get in and make a lot of money by any means. I've applied to several jobs in the sporting industry (Engineering degree though) and have had basically zero success with them.

Sorry, SA, just seeing this now. Thanks for the post, and all of this makes a ton of sense. I'm heavily interested in DFS. Played hockey almost every night. Moderate to no success, though.

One thing I'd love to do, especially with baseball and all the metrics they have, would be to really dive in there and see if I can find any sort of market inefficiencies and sort of hack the game. Obviously, I'm interested in data and this would be a fun project. I just don't really have the time to devote to something like that. It's likely a matter of grinding it out on the weekends, but it's tough to set that time aside.

Right now what I'm doing in baseball is scraping the barrel for cheap strikeout pitchers, and trying to maximize HRs with my batters. I have no idea if this is a good strategy or not. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. It's very dependent (obviously) on how my pitchers perform.

But it makes a ton of sense, right? It's hard to go back to the 9-5 structured grind where you have to be in the office 9-5 when you're used to pacing yourself as you deem fit. And it's interesting, really. A lot of people's most productive hours aren't 9-5. I know mine aren't. I get to work at 830 most days, and I spend like two hours warming up to the task of actually being at work. Finally, it's 1030, and I open my first Excel file or launch Adobe Analytics for the first time and actually start working on things. Wouldn't my company and I be better off if I could take that warmup time at home, do what I want to do (maybe get a workout in, chill out for a bit, warmup to the day). And then come in to work when I'm actually ready to work? And then be able to leave when my work is done?

Grass is always greener, right?

 

[Fugazy]

I have been a bit quiet the last few days but I would like to inform you that I will be back as of today. Reason being, I applied for a management position in Austria and had the interviews at 9 AM on the mornings after the last 2 Ranger games. Quite inconvenient but it is what it is.

I had to sacrifice the Rangers and did not see them win 4-1 twice. Not sure if this means I shouldn't watch the Saturday game, but I will think about that.

Anyway, good news. I got the job. Now sorting out the logistics of the move from The Hague to Vienna! Woohoo. Big step up within the organization. Huge jump in salary (32k more annually) and some nice extras. Anyway, I am very excited. It means I'll be able to go to some more KHL games in Bratislava as well, which is 45 minutes away.

Congrats! That's a huge jump in salary

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Congrats! That's a huge jump in salary

Thanks. It's a huge step, not just salary-wise. But also for my career.

 

[Megustaelhockey]

New HFBoards forum alert: THE GARAGE

Your one stop shop to discuss all your transportation needs and interests. From car repair to how to read a train schedule.

 

[PlamsUnlimited]

I wish I knew how to read.

 

[Gardner McKay]

Wow Silverfish, I literally feel the exact same way as you, right down to paying the same in rent (1700) for an apartment I don't like.

I recently watched Michael Moore's documentary "Where to Invade Next" where he goes to different European countries and tries to learn what they do better than America. The way work and jobs are treated in Italy was eye opening. 4 day work weeks, 2 hour lunches, unlimited vacation time, mandatory raises, complete benefits.

It really is hard to not get overly discouraged as a young person trying to make my way through work life. Then you add in the fact that I don't even like what I do and it makes it even worse.

Older generations look down on our generation and say we don't work hard and whatever, meanwhile we're getting paid less to work more and things are more expensive now.

I just wanna hit the powerball.

Regarding the bold, he has the credibility of homeless man who thinks the government is reading his thoughts through the use of radio waves or something.

Without going down the wrong road here, using the Italians as an example is lunacy. Their banking system is on the verge of bankruptcy. The government can't bail them out. Germany is literally the only thing holding up a crumbling EU that is continuing to write checks that they can't cash.

I am not of an older generation who says people don't work hard. I am an under 30 who says that (some) young people are ridiculously lazy. If success and making money was easy, everyone would have tons of it. If you don't want to work at a job that doesn't offer work from home, don't take the job. If you need the job, then take it and don't complain. From the time I was 23 until I was 27, I was working nearly 75 hours a week (if not more) at a job that I hated. This resulted in enormous success for me. My friends who worked their 40 hours and went home, always said how lucky I was, "I wish I could do what you are doing". "It must be nice". Yeah well, they didn't see the hard work I put in order to make it happen. As someone who has a extremely irrational fear of flying, I had to get on a plane every week. It was miserable. Gusta, Auf, Officer Friendly, Killem, they could all tell you how bad it was. Gusta being as nice as he is would actually text me during each flight to keep me calm. Same with Officer Friendly and Auf. I don't know what I would have done without imessage and southwest wifi. But... I did what I had to do to get where I wanted to be financially.

And then? After all that work? I resigned. I realized how miserable I was. I took a 50% paycut at first to not have to travel and I have never been happier.

We all pay for things we don't like. Drive cars we don't love. Would like newer, nicer ****. I just sold my townhouse that was fairly close to my office as well as my wife's office in order to build our own much larger custom home where we can have everything we need. I had to add almost 60 minutes on to my commute in order to do this since property was much cheaper up north. Its called a trade-off and I feel like it is a lost concept to young people.

/rant.

 

[Vinny DeAngelo]

Does anyone have experience moving across the country to somewhere you dont have any friends or anything? im interviewing with a company up in new jersey.

if this goes well id have to consider moving to New Jersey when all my roots are in Florida.

 

[Ail]

Regarding the bold, he has the credibility of homeless man who thinks the government is reading his thoughts through the use of radio waves or something.

Without going down the wrong road here, using the Italians as an example is lunacy. Their banking system is on the verge of bankruptcy. The government can't bail them out. Germany is literally the only thing holding up a crumbling EU that is continuing to write checks that they can't cash.

I am not of an older generation who says people don't work hard. I am an under 30 who says that (some) young people are ridiculously lazy. If success and making money was easy, everyone would have tons of it. If you don't want to work at a job that doesn't offer work from home, don't take the job. If you need the job, then take it and don't complain. From the time I was 23 until I was 27, I was working nearly 75 hours a week (if not more) at a job that I hated. This resulted in enormous success for me. My friends who worked their 40 hours and went home, always said how lucky I was, "I wish I could do what you are doing". "It must be nice". Yeah well, they didn't see the hard work I put in order to make it happen. As someone who has a extremely irrational fear of flying, I had to get on a plane every week. It was miserable. Gusta, Auf, Officer Friendly, Killem, they could all tell you how bad it was. Gusta being as nice as he is would actually text me during each flight to keep me calm. Same with Officer Friendly and Auf. I don't know what I would have done without imessage and southwest wifi. But... I did what I had to do to get where I wanted to be financially.

And then? After all that work? I resigned. I realized how miserable I was. I took a 50% paycut at first to not have to travel and I have never been happier.

We all pay for things we don't like. Drive cars we don't love. Would like newer, nicer ****. I just sold my townhouse that was fairly close to my office as well as my wife's office in order to build our own much larger custom home where we can have everything we need. I had to add almost 60 minutes on to my commute in order to do this since property was much cheaper up north. Its called a trade-off and I feel like it is a lost concept to young people.

/rant.

Being lazy has nothing to do with age, or what generation you are born into. I work with a bunch of 50 somethings in a power plant who are the most SPOILED, LAZY, ENTITLED, and god damn WHINY group of people I have ever had the displeasure of working with. They also have the audacity to walk around talking about "millennials" being lazy and stupid. What a joke. I work 10 times harder than the majority of them for less than half of the pay and many of them still talk **** about me because I look at my cellphone during downtime or sit at a computer occasionally to browse the Internet. Meanwhile the same guys spend hours a day sitting down hidden in the heat/AC, sleep on night shifts, and spend large portions of mornings & afternoons cooking food for each other, and then sitting around eating it.

Laziness and entitlement has been around forever, it just has different forms.

 

[PlamsUnlimited]

Does anyone have experience moving across the country to somewhere you dont have any friends or anything? im interviewing with a company up in new jersey.

if this goes well id have to consider moving to New Jersey when all my roots are in Florida.

I did from NY to Texas. It's not for everyone unless you can survive on barebones budget for a while and gradually go out to make friends and through work without separation anxiety.

 

[Gardner McKay]

Being lazy has nothing to do with age, or what generation you are born into. I work with a bunch of 50 somethings in a power plant who are the most SPOILED, LAZY, ENTITLED, and god damn WHINY group of people I have ever had the displeasure of working with. They also have the audacity to walk around talking about "millennials" being lazy and stupid. What a joke. I work 10 times harder than the majority of them for less than half of the pay and many of them still talk **** about me because I look at my cellphone during downtime or sit at a computer occasionally to browse the Internet. Meanwhile the same guys spend hours a day sitting down hidden in the heat/AC, sleep on night shifts, and spend large portions of mornings & afternoons cooking food for each other, and then sitting around eating it.

Laziness and entitlement has been around forever, it just has different forms.

I agree and disagree. Laziness & entitlement appears across all of the age groups. It is my opinion though that it is most prevalent in the under 30 group.

 

[Hunter Gathers]

Hopefully everyone is OK after the Times Square incident.

 

[Gardner McKay]

Does anyone have experience moving across the country to somewhere you dont have any friends or anything? im interviewing with a company up in new jersey.

if this goes well id have to consider moving to New Jersey when all my roots are in Florida.

Yeah. I "moved" from Atlanta up to Virginia for a short while. I put it in quotes because I was supposed to make that area my permanent residence but I couldn't do it. I couldn't stand to be away from my family and friends so I begun heading up there Morning and coming home sometime between Thursday and Saturday. Some people have no problem packing up and moving 1000 miles away. Others can't.

I did from NY to Texas. It's not for everyone unless you can survive on barebones budget for a while and gradually go out to make friends and through work without separation anxiety.

Agree 100%.

Hopefully everyone is OK after the Times Square incident.

Just saw that. They are saying 1 person has been killed.

 

[Fugazy]

Hopefully everyone is OK after the Times Square incident.

Looks like it was some idiot drunk driver

 

[PlamsUnlimited]

I too came back to NY. I didn't like being so far out from a whole life I already built. It wasn't for me


Edit: Chief some people are saying they think it was a suicide attempt

 

[Kaapo Cabana]

Does anyone have experience moving across the country to somewhere you dont have any friends or anything? im interviewing with a company up in new jersey.

if this goes well id have to consider moving to New Jersey when all my roots are in Florida.

I didn't quite go across country, and Philadelphia is really not that far from NY, but I don't have any relatives within 100 miles of me so I have a vague understanding of the situation. I moved to the area with very few friends around, so I had to make new ones if I didn't want to be super lonely.

If you have a good work situation with your colleagues it will be relatively easy to form a base of friends. If you don't, like me, just put yourself out there. Join a mens league, take an exercise class, get a fun laid back side job, volunteer, get involved with the local alumni chapter from your university. Try to do something social that relates to a hobby you have. That way you will undoubtedly meet people that will share at least some of your interests.

(not that the people I work with aren't good people, they're just 15-20 yrs older than me and we have nothing in common)

People always say its really hard to meet new people. Whats actually hard is putting yourself out there. Once you do that, meeting people is pretty easy.

 

[The Lunatic Fridge]

Looks like it was some idiot drunk driver

Pretty much the complete opposite.

I won't post it here for obvious reasons but this dbag was on a road rampage trying to kill people in several places all caught on camera.

 

[The Gloaming]

I agree and disagree. Laziness & entitlement appears across all of the age groups. It is my opinion though that it is most prevalent in the under 30 group.

This generation is working more than the generations before them for less pay. So very lazy.