GDT: Hawks @ Oilers 9pm ChSn 10/13/24

[CallMeShaft]

There are 32 teams in the league, so there are 32 1Ds every season.

It's debatable whether you want to include Jones and Vlasic into that group. Think if Vlasic has a good season, he'd be there. Jones too, but he's always been super inconsistent, so I'm not counting on it.

Don't think either guy is among the best 20 or so defenders even with a good year. But that's why we drafted Levshunov and Korchinski so high. If Vlasic is a low end 1D, he'd still have a Hammer/Seabs level impact for this team; which is a huge asset if that's not even the best defeseman on your roster.

 

[statswatcher]

There are 32 teams in the league, so there are 32 1Ds every season.

i still don't agree with this supposition. the amount of teams in the league does not tell you how many players could be accurately described as a 1D. there's no reason to suppose that every team has one, and there's no reason to suppose that any given team can only have one, being as how it doesn't mean the same thing as "best defenseman on his team". the term falls into arbitrary meaninglessness if tomorrow the league expands and now there are suddenly 34 1D's in the league.

it's akin to saying "there are 64 first line wingers in the nhl". it might be correct in the most superficial sense, i.e. something like 64 players occupy a first line wing depth chart position in the nhl at any given time, but if you watched last year's blackhawks you should know that a depth chart position being filled doesn't mean it was filled by a first line caliber winger.

 

[belfour30]

i still don't agree with this supposition. the amount of teams in the league does not tell you how many players could be accurately described as a 1D. there's no reason to suppose that every team has one, and there's no reason to suppose that any given team can only have one, being as how it doesn't mean the same thing as "best defenseman on his team". the term falls into arbitrary meaninglessness if tomorrow the league expands and now there are suddenly 34 1D's in the league.

it's akin to saying "there are 64 first line wingers in the nhl". it might be correct in the most superficial sense, i.e. something like 64 players occupy a first line wing depth chart position in the nhl at any given time, but if you watched last year's blackhawks you should know that a depth chart position being filled doesn't mean it was filled by a first line caliber winger.

I believe Jones is a top 20 D in the league.

He has been horribly underrated because he has played half the game on horrid teams for a half decade. Look at what he did before that.

A lot of people complain about his offense but his first year with the Hawks he put up 50+ pts.

The last two years were affected by the fact that nobody could score outside of Kane/Bedard.

 

[statswatcher]

I believe Jones is a top 20 D in the league.

He has been horribly underrated because he has played half the game on horrid teams for a half decade. Look at what he did before that.

believe as you will, he has to show me. if he keeps up what he showed in this game he will have proven me wrong to doubt.

 

[belfour30]

believe as you will, he has to show me. if he keeps up what he showed in this game he will have proven me wrong to doubt.

The year before he got traded to the Hawks he had a terrible analytical season, where he lost his reputation as a top D. He had a bad year on a bad team. He bounced back immediately with the Hawks, and has been what they traded for. Is he overpaid by 1.5M? Yeah. You'd take the extra money too.

Read my moniker, I am not arguing that Jones is a top 10 D or anything like that, but I do think he's a top 20 D.

He eats minutes and plays well at both ends of the ice, and can play the PP and PK.

 

[statswatcher]

The year before he got traded to the Hawks he had a terrible analytical season, where he lost his reputation as a top D. He had a bad year on a bad team. He bounced back immediately with the Hawks, and has been what they traded for. Is he overpaid by 1.5M? Yeah. You'd take the extra money too.

he's had one good year in chicago. since then he hasn't done anything which would indicate he's anything more than a good second pair guy who tops out as a passaenger to a legitimate 1D but got all the minutes on chicago teams with no other options. nevermind 8 mil, he's barely been worth 7, much less 9.5.

 

[CallMeShaft]

i still don't agree with this supposition. the amount of teams in the league does not tell you how many players could be accurately described as a 1D. there's no reason to suppose that every team has one, and there's no reason to suppose that any given team can only have one, being as how it doesn't mean the same thing as "best defenseman on his team". the term falls into arbitrary meaninglessness if tomorrow the league expands and now there are suddenly 34 1D's in the league.

it's akin to saying "there are 64 first line wingers in the nhl". it might be correct in the most superficial sense, i.e. something like 64 players occupy a first line wing depth chart position in the nhl at any given time, but if you watched last year's blackhawks you should know that a depth chart position being filled doesn't mean it was filled by a first line caliber winger.

There are 32 #1Ds just like there are 64 top line wingers. Some teams won't have any 1Ds, others will have a couple. It's basically if you were to equally spread the best defenders amongst all 32 teams, each of those players would be considered a #1 defenseman. Same would go for top line wingers; spread the 64 best wingers equally, those would be the guys you'd consider to be top line wingers in the NHL.

 

[statswatcher]

There are 32 #1Ds just like there are 64 top line wingers. Some teams won't have any 1Ds, others will have a couple. It's basically if you were to equally spread the best defenders amongst all 32 teams, each of those players would be considered a #1 defenseman. Same would go for top line wingers; spread the 64 best wingers equally, those would be the guys you'd consider to be top line wingers in the NHL.

why would you just assume that it would even out if they were evenly spread? just because it makes the numbers nice and round bouncing around in the old noggin?

 

[CallMeShaft]

why would you just assume that it would even out if they were evenly spread? just because it makes the numbers nice and round bouncing around in the old noggin?

What counter do you have to my point?

I think most fans of hockey would agree that there are 32 1Ds currently in the NHL. I think most would also agree that some teams are unfortunate enough not to have any, while others are fortunate enough to have multiple.

 

[RememberTheRoar]

What's a 1D?

Curious to see this defined by those having this debate