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Have McDrai surpassed Peak Crolkin?

I think Draisaitl's draft position (even though he was high himself) is going to hold him back for a lot of people. Malkin was considered a top pick in almost any other year. That hype train does a lot to sway people's opinions. I think they're better than Crosby/Malkin ever were though.
 
Sky04 said:
Weird, maybe it's because they cover 40+minutes of ice time as separate, dominant players which helps their teams win more instead being glued together playing half of that. This probably wouldn't happen if both players were capable of being on seperate lines.
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You just said if either one of these guys went down the Penguins would be fine. To me that's pretty indicative of having wonderful depth no? If as you say, only 1 needs to play and the team is still able to push a playoff run I'd argue that has a lot more to do with team success right? That is definitely not a luxury the Oilers have right now. They might not even make the playoffs if McDavid and Drai finish the season as 1/2.

I didn't pick a bull in this fight. In fact I'd lean towards Sid/Malkin because they have proven much more to this point in their career if anything... But your argument points here are pretty clearly hypocritical.

Your previous quote for context:

Sky04 said:
The playoffs were never in question when Pittsburgh had at least 1 of those 2 in the lineup.
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Your current argument about the Oilers not having success because they are incapable of splitting these two is literally counter-pointed better than I could ever do by your own statement above. Well done.
 
Based on what though? Drai has no hardware yet. Mcdavid is there on an individual regular season level but no playoff success.

Crosby and Malkin are #1 and #2 among active players in regular season ppg, and also #1 and #2 in playoff ppg. Mcdavid and Draisaitl have to do that over a decade along with post season success for me to consider them on the same level as a duo.

Crosby/Malkin are arguably the best 1-2 punch of all time.
 
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Sky04 said:
Crosby and Malkin by Crosby's 4th season had already won a cup and been the finals twice, McDrai are in year 5 and trying to figure out how to make the playoffs. The playoffs were never in question when Pittsburgh had at least 1 of those 2 in the lineup.
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Here comes the cavalry led by Sky04. One of the biggest known McDrai haters on HF. Totally ignoring the fact that Pittsburgh was pretty stacked and had a much deeper team around those 2.
 
mattihp said:
I'd be willing to take this up for discussion once the Oil has won a cup. To be honest, Pittsburgh's cup winning teams weren't much more well-rounded than the teams the Oilers ice. But Sidney and Geno went for the W, Gordon Bombay style.
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If mcdavid and draisaitl went down, this oilers team wouldn't win a game. Pens would
 
Luigi Lemieux said:
Based on what though? Drai has no hardware yet. Mcdavid is there on an individual regular season level but no playoff success.

Crosby and Malkin are #1 and #2 among active players in regular season ppg, and also #1 and #2 in playoff ppg. Mcdavid and Draisaitl have to do that over a decade along with post season success for me to consider them on the same level as a duo.

Crosby/Malkin are arguably the best 1-2 punch of all time.
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Lemieux Jagr
 
illpucks said:
Lemieux Jagr
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Nah, in terms of all time placement sure, but they didn't play nearly enough games together. Their accolades for the most part don't overlap. Lemieux won 4 of his 6 art rosses before Jagr was an elite player, and Jagr won 4 of his 5 while Lemieux was retired. Only 95-96 and 96-97 could you say they were both near their primes together torching the league.
 
This is an unfair comparison since 1 pair are attacked at the hip. The other are 1st and 2nd line centers. So for me the 1st and 2nd line centers will always be more impressive then duo no matter how many points they put up together.
 
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McFlash97 said:
Here comes the cavalry led by Sky04. One of the biggest known McDrai haters on HF. Totally ignoring the fact that Pittsburgh was pretty stacked and had a much deeper team around those 2.
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I agree the '09 Pens were much deeper than this Oilers team. Almost every NHL team is. However I wouldn't call them "stacked" outside of Crosby/Malkin. Nobody else on the team scored 50 points aside from deadline addition Chris Kunitz.
 
mattihp said:
I'd be willing to take this up for discussion once the Oil has won a cup. To be honest, Pittsburgh's cup winning teams weren't much more well-rounded than the teams the Oilers ice. But Sidney and Geno went for the W, Gordon Bombay style.
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Baaaaaaaaaaaad take.
 
Sky04 said:
Crosby and Malkin by Crosby's 4th season had already won a cup and been the finals twice, McDrai are in year 5 and trying to figure out how to make the playoffs. The playoffs were never in question when Pittsburgh had at least 1 of those 2 in the lineup.
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How about I'll stay out of Kucherov threads and you stay out of McDrai threads and we can call it even? 'Mr. Kucherov is on the same level as McDavid'
 
Luigi Lemieux said:
Nah, in terms of all time placement sure, but they didn't play nearly enough games together. Their accolades for the most part don't overlap. Lemieux won 4 of his 6 art rosses before Jagr was an elite player, and Jagr won 4 of his 5 while Lemieux was retired. Only 95-96 and 96-97 could you say they were both near their primes together torching the league.
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00-01
Lemieux 76 in 43
Jagr Art Ross
 
The “strength of team” argument on HF is still the whiny cop-out it’s always been. It’ll be very interesting to see how stacking these two on the same line works for Edmonton. I don’t think we’ve ever seen this before in the playoffs...can an almost literal one line team do damage in the postseason?

But until that happens and I’m proven wrong I’ll keep the opinion that Crosby and Malkin’s playoff success will always keep them in a tier above McDavid and Draisaitl. Their regular season numbers are filthy and they’re torching the league right now, but they’ve got to translate it into playoff success to be better than Sid & Geno.
 
Nah. Look at how good Crosby and Malkin were in the 2009 playoff run. That wasn't a Stanley Cup caliber roster but those two dragged them to multiple Finals appearances and a Cup. And they did it on separate lines, playing with middle-six/bottom-six caliber players. Hell, the third and fourth leading scorers on that team were Ruslan Fedetenko and a 38 year old Bill Guerin.
 
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Draisaitl will beat Malkin sooner or later. Consistency and health were Malkin's downside
 
x Tame Impala said:
The “strength of team” argument on HF is still the whiny cop-out it’s always been. It’ll be very interesting to see how stacking these two on the same line works for Edmonton. I don’t think we’ve ever seen this before in the playoffs...can an almost literal one line team do damage in the postseason?

But until that happens and I’m proven wrong I’ll keep the opinion that Crosby and Malkin’s playoff success will always keep them in a tier above McDavid and Draisaitl. Their regular season numbers are filthy and they’re torching the league right now, but they’ve got to translate it into playoff success to be better than Sid & Geno.
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Colorado says hello. :p
 
Trap Jesus said:
I think Draisaitl's draft position (even though he was high himself) is going to hold him back for a lot of people. Malkin was considered a top pick in almost any other year. That hype train does a lot to sway people's opinions. I think they're better than Crosby/Malkin ever were though.
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It's not the "hype train" holding him back from Malkin it's actual results. Malkin in year 3 had a Conn Symthe and Art Ross to his name.
 
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