Has the US underachieved or just had bad luck?

[Xokkeu]

It's pretty funny considering a lot of the Canadian shots were to the perimeter.


Sure we did control a lot of the game, but to say we dominated is pure homerism.

Canada's game in Sochi reminded me a lot of how Barcelona play in soccer. They controlled the puck and dominated possession. It didn't lead to a lot of goals or scoring chances, but it was an effective and efficient way to control the tournament. I'd love to give more praise to their efforts but everytime I do I find myself surrounded by Canadian fans who want to bellow loud and proud about how superhuman everybody wearing a Maple Leaf were.

 

[Canuck21t]

There we go with the "superiority" again. Do you expect anybody other than patriotic Canadians to buy off on the concept of Canadian hockey superiority? In a philosophic argument, "superiority" is a fixed and invariable concept. For example, you could argue that if God exists, and God created humanity, then God is superior to all humans who he created.

Let me use a syllogism to disprove the suggestion that Canadian hockey teams are superior to all other hockey teams. If a hockey team is superior, then it wins every game by a margin that reflects its superiority (e.g., in the range of 8-15 goals per game). To illustrate that concept, the late Dick Beddoes of the Toronto Globe and Mail promised prior to the 1972 Series that if Canada didn't win all 8 games by at least 10 goals, that he would eat his column in a bowl of borscht (see the Globe and Mail archives for photos of Beddoes eating newsprint and borscht).

The fact that Canada has not won a World Championship since 2007 proves that Canada is not a superior hockey nation. The fact that Canada hasn't won a World Junior Championship since 2009 proves that Canada is not a superior nation. If you look at the whole spectrum of international hockey, especially in the last 7 or 8 years, Canada actually loses more often than it wins. You can make a strong argument that, in light of the massive resources that Canada throws at hockey, dwarfing expenditures of the rest of the world combined, there is no valid excuse for failing to be superior, and winning every single game by at least 12-15 goals, but the fact is that they are not.

Canada is a superior nation because it has won the two last best-on-best tournament. The Olympics are the most important international hockey tournaments and every country put all their efforts and energy into the Olympics. So winning the Olympics makes you superior. If another team accomplishes the same by winning the Olympics PLUS winning the world championships, then that team could be considered even superior than Canada's, but so far no team has done it in recent years. So right now, Canada is the superior team.

Russia hasn't been good enough to compete for an Olympic medal since 1998, when
the last of the Soviet-era kids were still in their prime. The fact that Canadians still obsess on Russia as being their only real rival is testament to the impact that the Soviets made in the 70's and 80's.

And yes, motivation was a huge problem for Russia in Sochi. The Russians played a very spirited game against the United States, but the US is considered by Russians to be their main rival. Stop accepting the pre-packaged, lazy pablum that NA announcers feed you about the Russians (e.g., "the Russians are going to be really pumped to play in Russia"), because the so-called passion and hunger for a medal was never really there.

Of course, of equal importance was the fact that Russia didn't really have a good enough team to compete for a medal there. However, I would say that Russia would have quite likely been highly motivated to play Canada, because Canada was favored by everyone to win. Since anything can happen when emotion and passion is there, Canada may have caught a break by not having been scheduled to play Russia.

There is no rivalry at all for Russia with Finland, Slovakia, Slovenia and Norway, and in all of those games, Russia showed no intensity at all. Finland is very good at executing its defense-only strategy, but its really hard to get motivated to play the Finns when they just trap, trap, trap to slow the game down to a halt. The introduction of junior leagues and expanded pro leagues in Russia should help down the road, but for now, I'm the first to admit that Russia just isn't very good.

Wow, this is one of the most ridiculous posts I've read. Pretty much every point is wrong.

The fact that Canada is still obsessed with Russia is because of history yes, but also because of the big names like Ovechkin, Malkin, Datsyuk, Kovalchuk, Semin and Rudalov. But you're right, we overrated these Russian players. What were we thinking?

You play on your own soil at one of your most popular sports in your country at the Olympics, a tournament Russians consider the most important and you say your team was not motivated? You think we're dumb enough to believe you? You think we needed our media to believe that the Russians should be motivated?!? If the media said other wise, I would flat out call them crazy. Who doesn't get motivated in those exact circumstances? If you're not motivated winning the Olympic gold at home, then what else are you going to be motivated? I guess never. Then you're going to whine that we call Russian players not motivated for the playoffs?

Yeah, Canada may had caught a break by not having been scheduled to play Russia. Because we all know what happens when the motivated Russians face Canada, we all saw it in Vancouver 2010, scary.

Basically, Russia doesn't take smaller teams seriously and is often caught off guard. And then you're going to accuse Canadians of arrogance by thinking we dominated and are superior. Well at the very least, we won and have the medals to prove it.

 

[Canuck21t]

Fair point about Finland - even though its a tiny country in terms of population, they do produce more talent and depth than Russia, which is why they usually beat Russia. Finland beats Russia just as often as any other nation does.

Obviously, Sweden and Finland knows how to develop players and knows how to construct a team.

You're giving way too much credit to Canada in saying "we saw what little difficulty (the Russians) gave us last time, it was a 7-3 whitewash." The fact is that this year's Canadian team wouldn't even dare dream about a 7-goal outburst. Yes, they did score 6 against Austria, but Austria is awaiting relegation to a level where they will be playing against teams from Luxembourg and Montenegro, not exactly hockey powers!
Canada scored 1 goal in regulation time against both the US and Finland, and only 2 goals against Latvia. Latvia was far more physical than Canada, and I honestly thought Latvia was going to win. The fact is that if Russia scored 3 goals against Canada in Sochi, as they did in 2010, they probably would have sent Canada home empty handed.

Your fact is an 'if'. Think about it.

The Olympics is usually a best of 1 tournament. You don't often get a chance, as in 2010, to play a team twice. Thinking of the 7-3 score that you reminded me of so graciously, that was the final score of Game 1 of the 1972 Series in Montreal. If the '72 series was just one game, then the Soviets could have claimed unchallenged world supremacy in hockey, and forced Canada to agree to a home-and-home series under IIHF regulations to have a shot at winning it back. The whole hockey world would have been completely different.

Yes of course. You could say that also to all the times Canada lost to Russia at the World Championships. But of course, when Russia wins, others should just shut up and accept it.

Realistically, Canada had an outstanding Olympics, especially defensively, but let's not blow it so far out of proportion in patriotic zeal that it starts to look a little whacky, such as when you said "see what countries like Canada are doing to be your superior." Not much humility there for sure, and it doesn't take into account other facts that rebut your claims of Canadian superiority. At the WJC, one level below the top pro leagues, Russia has beaten Canada in the medal round, when it really counts, the last 4 consecutive years. Brent Sutter, architect of the 2005 and 2006 Canadian WJC teams that are clearly the mainstays of the 2010 and 2014 Olympic teams, a guy who normally shows a lot of swagger, was hanging his head pretty low after steering the team to the 2nd consecutive performance without a medal. So I guess you should gloat and thump your chest now, because you may not be able to next time.

Anyone with eyes and an once of objectivity would see that Canada was dominating. There are different ways of dominating and having many more goals is one way, but controlling the game is also another way. We controlled the game and in no point was the US dictating. That is domination.

When Canada wins 5 years in a row at the WHJC, Europeans said that nobody cared about a junior tournament. But now you consider the WHJC as only a level below the top pro leagues, how convenient. Well before 2005, we were 7 years without gold. That didn't stop us from winning the most coveted tournament now didn't we?

 

[Alexdaman]

Has the US underachieved or just had bad luck?

Both statements kinda of mean the same thing.

No the USA hasnt underachieved, they simply faced the best hockey team in the world and the letdown made them vulnerable to a more hungry Finnish team. Hockey should not be decided over one single game though.

 

[SwedGrit]

Hockey should not be decided over one single game though.

It's just a different format I think Canada just showed a way to reduce factors like chance and momentum and to let quality decide more.

USA could do the same.

Time and wear on the players would't allow for big series anyway, and it's still interesting with these tournaments.

 

[OttawaRoughRiderFan*]

As per Steve Simmons in the Toronto Sun today (typed in by me / could not find a link)...

"Keep hearing that David Backes and his Olympic friends T.J. Oshie and Kevin Shattenkirk were not exactly enamored with Kessel and van Riemsdyk as Team USA teammates".

Maybe that played a role.

 

[Xokkeu]

As per Steve Simmons in the Toronto Sun today (typed in by me / could not find a link)...

"Keep hearing that David Backes and his Olympic friends T.J. Oshie and Kevin Shattenkirk were not exactly enamored with Kessel and van Riemsdyk as Team USA teammates".

Maybe that played a role.

Too vague to make any conclusions from me

 

[YMCMBYOLO]

As per Steve Simmons in the Toronto Sun today (typed in by me / could not find a link)...

"Keep hearing that David Backes and his Olympic friends T.J. Oshie and Kevin Shattenkirk were not exactly enamored with Kessel and van Riemsdyk as Team USA teammates".

Maybe that played a role.

Why is this?

Seems like one team doesn't like the other.

Kinda weird, though.

 

[OttawaRoughRiderFan*]

Why is this?

Seems like one team doesn't like the other.

Kinda weird, though.

No idea. It was on his Sunday "Simmon Says" page. I copied what he wrote verbatim.

 

[SanDogBrewin]

Yah I wouldn't like the two players that led my team in goals and points either. What a bunch of jerks LoL

Nah Canada just played better.

 

[1Gold Standard]

No idea. It was on his Sunday "Simmon Says" page. I copied what he wrote verbatim.

Maybe Bozy can get U.S. citizenship and suit up for the Red White and Blue. He lives permanently in Denver, has never played internationally for Canada at any level (as far as I know) so he'll be good to go as Phil's center and the bromance can continue. Phil dances to the rhythm of a different tune..

 

[OttawaRoughRiderFan*]

Phil dances to the rhythm of a different tune..

Yup. Seems this has been the a common theme for his whole career.