Has Peak/Prime McDavid surpassed Peak/Prime Crosby and Peak/Prime Jagr already?

MadLuke

Registered User
Jan 18, 2011
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When Howe scored 95, 45 points was enough to make the Top 10 and Maurice Richard was scoring 60-70

When Moore scored 95, you needed 60 something points to make the top 10.

The red wings had only 1.45 assists per goals, that 95 pts year, the league scoring changed quite a bit.
 
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Matsun

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Aug 15, 2010
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Orr had his breakout 120 point season in 69 and from 69-74 there were only 4 non Boston 100 points seasons from players, 2 105 point seasons and no 110 seasons. The 5 seasons after that 27 times non Boston players hit 100 points, 23 hit 105, 18 hit 110 and 10 120 point seasons from non Boston players. Like I said maybe generational talents lead to league wide scoring changes? Here is a seasonal breakdown over 130 point scorers.
Original 6:
45-70: 0
Orr, Wayne and Mario:
71: 2
72: 1
73: 1
74: 1
75: 1
77: 1
78: 1
79: 2
80: 2
81: 3
82: 4
83: 1
84: 1
85: 3
86: 4
87: 1
88: 3
89: 4
90: 1
91: 2
92: 1
93: 6
94: 1
95 (lockout): 0
96: 2

Dead puck era:
97-22: 0

McDavid era:
23: 1
24: 3
 

daver

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Apr 4, 2003
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While scoring obviously plays a part, I do think the major factor is McDavid, Mackinnon, and Kucherov are just that good.


The three post covid seasons. 7 times in 3 seasons someone has exceeded 115 points. McDavid x3. Kucherov, Mackinnon, Draisaitl, Panarin.

Of the top 13 scoring seasons in that time, McDavid, Kucherov, Mackinnon, and Draisaitl combine for 9 of them.

115ish is the highest we're seeing "the pack" score. But the top four continue to outscore the rest of the league.

Before 23/24, I think most had those two players in the mix for 2nd best player in the league with Draisaitl and Matthews (among forwards). By their late 20s, neither had hit a level that would have placed them on the same tier as Crosby, Malkin or Ovechkin (the post lockout era), or among others like Jagr, Forsberg, Lindros, Sakic, Yzerman, Lafleur etc.; players who had higher offensive peaks and/or higher all around peaks.

Last season certainly was unexpected by both; a bit moreso given their age and career stage. Kucherov seemed to have peaked in 18/19 and MacKinnon maybe had one Art Ross if he hadn't kept missing a few games every year but there wasn't an indication he had a really dominant season like 23/24 in him.

Since 17/18:


McDavid - 1.61
Kucherov - 1.46 (#4 in points)
MacKinnon - 1.42
Draisaitl - 1.35 (#2 in points)
Panarin 1.24

#10 - 1.17
#25 - 1.00

MacKinnon and Kucherov stand out as #2/#3 (arguably clearly if you think that Draisaitl's numbers are likely a bit inflated due to McDavid.) with a clear gap between them and the pack. Both have playoff numbers (points/PPG) befitting their regular season dominance.


From 06/07 to 13/14:

Crosby - 1.42
Malkin - 1.22 (#5 in points)
Ovechkin - 1.18 (#1 in points)
St. Louis - 1.07
Thornton 1.06

#10 - 1.01
#25 - 0.90

The clear #2/#3 are Malkin and Ovechkin, whose status is boosted with his GPG, with a clear gap between them and the pack. This time stretch includes Ovechkin's two "down years" and some injury-affected seasons for Malkin.


From 95/96 to 03/04


Jagr - 1.38
Forsberg - 1.30 (5th in scoring)
Sakic - 1.20
Kariya - 1.09 (7th in scoring)
Palffy - 1.08

#10 - 1.00
#20 - 0.94 (adjusted for league size)

Forsberg and Sakic stand out as the clear #2/#3 and they add impressive playoff numbers to boost their status (i.e. they are better playoff performers than MacKinnon and Kucherov, not clearly but enough to place them above IMO).


Comment

While they have made a statistical case, primarily, if not exclusively, on their 23/24 regular seasons, intuitively, it doesn't feel like MacKinnon and Kucherov have placed themselves in the discussion with players who are Top 30ish caliber all-time in terms of peak/prime.

There is certainly a question as to whether the increase in league scoring since 17/18 has opened the door for superstar talent to exploit, perhaps even more noticeably in the playoffs.

I think McDavid has separated himself over his career offensively on the same level as Crosby, Jagr (for 7 seasons), and Howe. Howe is a great comparable as one can argue that his 06 era peers- Beliveau, Hull, and Mikita, matched his 2nd, 3rd and 4th best seasons but only once. McDavid's immediate peers got close to his peak once while he has two other dominant seasons on his resume. The question is, are MacKinnon and Kucherov on the same level as Beliveau, Hull, and Mikita.
 
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The Panther

Registered User
Mar 25, 2014
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Tokyo, Japan
Great list (above)!

It also might be good, though, to consider games played when we're talking about exactly 130+ point seasons.

For most of the six-team period, the season was 70 games long (not that anyone was hitting 130 points). After expansion, there was a 74-game season, then two 76-game seasons, then four 78-game seasons. Then, 80-game seasons from 1974-75 through 1991-92. Two 84-game seasons in 1992-93 and 1993-94. Then, work stoppage 48-game season. Then, 82 game seasons....

Might make a bit of difference, esp. with 1992-93.
 

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