Has Connor Bedard quietly became underrated ?

[Brookbank]

For Canadians

• Peter Forsberg, Sweden 42

• Robert Reichel, Czechoslovakia 40

• Pavel Bure, USSR 39

Were all better.



Again for Canadians

Peter Forsberg	Sweden	1993	7	24	31
Markus Naslund	Sweden	1993	13	11	24
Raimo Helminen	Finland	1984	11	13	24

Were all better.

Those guys all had great careers, just not generational. I think that Bedard will be an elite player but I don't see him as a generational talent.



It also isn't always guaranteed. He will get better, but I don't see the jump to generational that others see.

Bedard was playing on pace to beat Forsbergs record. But things tightened up in later rounds.

Peter Forsberg put up an unthinkable 31 points in seven games at the 1993 World Junior Championships. That’s an average of 4.43 points per game. Bedard was averaging 4.50 points per game. The Swedish defense was actually aware of the record and were playing to save it.

The Swedish defence was aimed squarely at preventing Bedard from adding to his tournament-leading six goals and they managed to do that. But Bedard simply pivoted to setting up his teammates, tallying four assists in a dominant 5-1 win.

I noticed you had nothing to say about the Jagr record

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

The Swedish defense was actually aware of the record and were playing to save it.

Hahahaha

 

[Darren McCord]

Hahahaha

Everyone is out to get poor generational Bedard. I heard all Nhl Swedish defensemen also make sure he doesn’t score too

 

[Crow]

Huh?

McDavid was third in ppg as a rookie and then led the league in scoring the next year.

They were more NHL ready because they were bigger guys, not necessarily because they were further ahead in physical maturity. I'm not fully convinced Crosby was any further ahead in his physical development at 18/19 than Bedard.

Crosby was 5'11 193
Bedard is 5'10 185

That's pretty much the same density. I'm not sure how much bigger you expect Bedard to get. Maybe he gets to 190 without losing any speed?

I expect to see improvements from him over the next 5 years, but I question how much those improvements will be a result of him reaching a new level of physical maturity.

Weight and strength are far different things. He could remain the same weight and gain massive amounts of strength. I’ve seen 170 lb guys squat their weight in their late teens and twice that later, as they matured and trained without gaining weight.

Adding mass might help anyway, or it might slow him down. Hard to say.

 

[Dicky113]

I think he’s quietly become a decent 1st overall but nowhere near the next McDavid or even Crosby. He’s too small to be on that level.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Marco Rossi > Connor BedardView attachment 931482View attachment 931483

AINEC

Bedard beat a Getzky and a Lindros record in junior. And beat Mcdavid in PPG in junior by a fairly big margin. On worse teams , in a harder league.

Behave yourself.

Bobby Smith had a better record in junior than Gretzky , maybe he’s more of a Bobby Smith type

 

[Chinaski89]

Overrated. Celebrini will be the better player.

 

[PainForShane]

Weight and strength are far different things. He could remain the same weight and gain massive amounts of strength. I’ve seen 170 lb guys squat their weight in their late teens and twice that later, as they matured and trained without gaining weight.

Adding mass might help anyway, or it might slow him down. Hard to say.

Yep. Also it matters where the weight / strength is actually located.

I'm an intermediate lifter living in Arizona. A few years ago, randomly bumped into Lawson Crouse who asked for a spot while I was lifting at an LA Fitness during some random offseason, he was doing 115 on the bench for reps (?!?!?) which is severely unimpressive for anyone who's spent any time doing strength training, let alone an actual athlete. To be clear, he may have been deloading, he may have been finishing out his chest after already crunching it in other exercises, I legitimately have no idea. But the weight he was moving with his upper body was not impressive at all, esp not for one of the better power forwards in the league (which he was at the time).

But like... he's a hockey player, same as Bedard. Pretty sure both of their squats and / or leg press would've crushed whatever it is most of us mortals do on the weekend. A quick check of someone like Tarasenko shows 6'0 , 209 pounds which is not that abnormal... but his teammates called him Tank because of how the guy was built.

***

If Bedard ends up putting on lower body and / or core strength -- which I'm fairly certain he'll decide to do during one of these offseasons over the next few years -- game on. As a neutral, I'll be excited to see what he can bring once he's able to consistently shoot from high danger areas. We'll see if he gets there but either way the kid's 19 years old rn, far too early to write him off. Everyone knows alcohol kills gainz, the guy can't even legally drink yet. Primed for growth

 

[ORRFForever]

As Halford and Burrough said ,if he's Patrick Kane with a Matthews shot, then he is generational.

I hope you are right. I would LOVE for him to be generational.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

.....IF he produces at the level of Kane and Matthews.

It really comes down to this....If he's "generational", then he will need to be the undisputed top 1 or 2 player in the NHL. If he doesn't outproduce McDavid, he needs to be right there within striking distance and obviously will require multiple Ross, Hart, Rocket or Lindsey awards (not all, but multiple of a few of them).

If we are still here in a year or two arguing if he's generational, then he ain't.

Yzerman, Lafleur, Mackinnon… it took them a little while to get going. I wouldn’t worry about this at all.

Bedard’s on a horrible team. No support at all. Of course he’s going to struggle.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

I hope you are right. I would LOVE for him to be generational.

At a minimum I think he’s going to be a superstar. I’d give up a boatload for him.

 

[Acallabeth]

Bedard was playing on pace to beat Forsbergs record. But things tightened up in later rounds.

It was not 'pace', he just padded his stats against the worst team in the tournament that wouldn't even be allowed to play if the WJC was best-on-best. It's not the NHL when you can count pace expecting more or less comparable competition all season.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

It was not 'pace', he just padded his stats against the worst team in the tournament that wouldn't even be allowed to play if the WJC was best-on-best. It's not the NHL when you can count pace expecting more or less comparable competition all season.

What Bedard did in the WJCs was phenomenally impressive, full stop. He was money for Canada, scoring huge goals vs USA and obviously Slovakia. His clutch play in those first two elimination games were far more impressive than his 23 points IMO. He had a historic tournament.

That said, his WJC point totals were inarguably inflated by playing in a diluted tournament, an impact that was further magnified by the fact that his skill set is tailor made for running up the score against teams like Latvia and Germany, which is why he was able to take them apart for 13 points in those 2 games.

Bedard's skill set is so incredibly dangerous against opponents that give more time and space. He's probably the most dangerous prospect I've ever seen when given space in the offensive zone, even more dangerous than 87 and 97. This is because he's a threat to score from distance, while also having the vision and deception to setup teammates for wide open looks and the quickness and puck skills to dangle defenders trying to step up on him in the high slot (which they are forced to do because of his ability to score from the outside). This is the same skill set that makes Kucherov such an elite scorer.

But in tighter checking games, Bedard can quickly become a non-factor without a linemate to draw attention and create space for him, whereas 87 and 97 could create space with their skating and power. This is one of the reasons I'm still bullish on his upside as a 50+ goal 110+ point guy - give Bedard a running mate that can be Point to his Kucherov and he'll light it up. It's also why I think moving to wing for a few years makes more sense for him.

Going back to his WJC, he was much less effective at 5v5 in the medal rounds vs the bigger, stronger defensive cores (like Czechia, who held him to only 1 point in 2 games).

His 5 points in 3 medal round games was still impressive, but he didn't really separate himself from his teammates like he did in the round robin:

Bedard 3g 5p
Roy 2g 5p
Guenther 3g 4p
Clarke 1g 4p

This isn't to take anything away from Bedard's historic, clutch performance. But the context is helpful in understanding why his statistical dominance in the WJC wasn't enough to propel him into the Crosby/McDavid tier.

 

[bossram]

Obviously you expect more production out of Bedard, but he has dramatically improved his two-way play compared to last season. His defensive metrics improved.

I don't get what the CHI coaching staff is doing with him. They yo-yo his linemates every game. And they went out and paid pretty big money to Teravainen and Bertuzzi to ostensibly boost their offense and give Bedard some higher-talent players to play with and...they've literally not even attempted to play those three together as a unit.

Now their brilliant plan is line him up with Joey Anderson and Jason Dickinson.

 

[Tie Domi Esquire]

I can't name a single one of his teammates but I'm pretty sure that's how the owners want it.

 

[Offtheboard412]

But in tighter checking games, Bedard can quickly become a non-factor without a linemate to draw attention and create space for him, whereas 87 and 97 could create space with their skating and power. This is one of the reasons I'm still bullish on his upside as a 50+ goal 110+ point guy - give Bedard a running mate that can be Point to his Kucherov and he'll light it up. It's also why I think moving to wing for a few years makes more sense for him.

This is why I really wanted the Hawks to take Demidov. His skating and puck skills would have opened up so much space for Bedard. I think they would have been dynamite together. I hope Levshunov works out for them or else I think they're going to be kicking themselves for passing on him for the next 10-15 years.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

This is why I really wanted the Hawks to take Demidov. His skating and puck skills would have opened up so much space for Bedard. I think they would have been dynamite together. I hope Levshunov works out for them or else I think they're going to be kicking themselves for passing on him for the next 10-15 years.

I do think they would have likely worked quite well together. Levshunov should be no worse than a top 4 dman.

Nazar could be a good compliment for Bedard as well. He's a really strong puck carrying center who can distribute well off the rush. Boisvert is another potential option down the line.

Right now, I think the best thing for Bedard is to play on Dickinson or Donato's wing.

 

[yzerman]

For now the title should say

Has Connor Bedard quietly became Overrated?​

 

[surixon]

He's a young player in a big slump. Most every young player goes through this and has to learn to work their way out of it.

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

He's no Crosby/Ovi/McDavid , which is ok