Habs Learning to Score at Practice

[Habs]

CC's shooting a career worse (any level) sh%... It's called a slump, happens to all players from time to time (see McDavid, Connor). But his overall game, imo, has looked as good as I've ever seen it...

I couldn't disagree more with your Suzuki assessment.

Are you really asking why the HC position in Montreal is extremely challenging lol

But beyond the external (fan/media) bipolar pressure, have you taken a look at our roster?
2 1B (at best) Goalies
1 active dman with more than 1 full NHL season on his resume
Not 1 veteran elite or even top line/top pairing caliber player (Monahan and Matheson the closest to that)
2nd youngest roster in the league
top 3 skater lost for season in game 2

And yet, team is ahead, even well ahead, of expected results

id say that's extremely challenging, not sure what you'd call it

you are talking about two different things though. Challenging , yes 100% from a teaching perspective, but I don't think MSL is under any pressure to deliver wins, none at all. Kent can deliver an awful product, and blame it all on the rebuild. This year , it's all getting blamed on 38pt Dach not being in the lineup, there are so many excuses to use. I bet he can take them bowling in Colorado and it would get a 5Star approval rating from the fans and media, because we have zero expectations and celebrate everything he does as just a masterful portrayal of coaching.

 

[admiralcadillac]

you are talking about two different things though. Challenging , yes 100% from a teaching perspective, but I don't think MSL is under any pressure to deliver wins, none at all. Kent can deliver an awful product, and blame it all on the rebuild. This year , it's all getting blamed on 38pt Dach not being in the lineup, there are so many excuses to use. I bet he can take them bowling in Colorado and it would get a 5Star approval rating from the fans and media, because we have zero expectations and celebrate everything he does as just a masterful portrayal of coaching.

I mean the team is legitimately going through a rebuild was there any expectation the team would even be .500 15 games into the season?

 

[Habs]

I mean the team is legitimately going through a rebuild was there any expectation the team would even be .500 15 games into the season?

no, I suspect far worse,

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

you are talking about two different things though. Challenging , yes 100% from a teaching perspective, but I don't think MSL is under any pressure to deliver wins, none at all. Kent can deliver an awful product, and blame it all on the rebuild. This year , it's all getting blamed on 38pt Dach not being in the lineup, there are so many excuses to use. I bet he can take them bowling in Colorado and it would get a 5Star approval rating from the fans and media, because we have zero expectations and celebrate everything he does as just a masterful portrayal of coaching.

Well… yeah. We’re not expected to win nor do we have a lineup capable of making the playoffs. MSL has been tasked with developing players. That’s what everyone wants. I don’t see a problem here.

Welcome to what rebuilding looks like.

 

[Miller Time]

you are talking about two different things though. Challenging , yes 100% from a teaching perspective, but I don't think MSL is under any pressure to deliver wins, none at all. Kent can deliver an awful product, and blame it all on the rebuild. This year , it's all getting blamed on 38pt Dach not being in the lineup, there are so many excuses to use. I bet he can take them bowling in Colorado and it would get a 5Star approval rating from the fans and media, because we have zero expectations and celebrate everything he does as just a masterful portrayal of coaching.

That's a poor bet.

Hockey is first and foremost an entertainment business, like it or not... A rebuild is no more a blanket job security than being the HC of a league leading team heading into the playoffs (just ask uncle Lou )

Do you remember Randy Cunneyworth? Hard to argue that he stepped into a role with high expectations... Yet not only did he get the boot at season end, his brief tenure at the helm of a sinking ship was so disastrous to his reputation that he never again sniffed a HC job (even though he had been considered an up and coming candidate before landing in Montreal.... I still think there must've been something more to that career implosion, but who knows???)

Anyways, point is that the HC chair in Montreal is a challenging one in the best of times... Trying to build the kind of player buy in and morale when players are dealing with the fan and media vitriol incessantly is no easier during a "rebuild". Having quality org leadership certainly helps as far as feeling some degree of relative job security, but that's not much help when it comes to leading the room as effectively as he has... That's quality leadership & communication. Attributes Gretzky failed at miserably in his brief stint in PHX, and that many ex-players who jump quickly into the HC chair often struggle with.

 

[alko]

Shouldn't they learn how to score in their junior years?

My idea is, if a player is in NHL, he should know everything from ice-hockey.

 

[OldCraig71]

Tons of players have their own rinks, so does Wendel Clark, should we call him too?

These guys have been scoring goals and running drills their entire life, MSL's hockey school isn't going to do anything at this point. if he's doing it for fun, lighten things up, ok. If he really thinks this is going to work, because he is teaching them moves from 'back in the day' he may as well play EA Sports NHL 2016 with them, and show them some moves from there too?

This team has no real structure in any zone, plus the entry is all over the map. It's not all his fault, this team isn't built around any real system but the have loved the dump and chase for the last 30 years, for some reason.

BTW Crosby isn't teaching other guys moves and drills, they are just practicing. He's an active player, one of the best in the world and generational talent, I'd listen to him as well, but he mostly works with the rookies and local players to stay in game shape.

Why are we pampering the coach so much anyways? A really good hockey player doesn't equate to being a good coach, we know this time and time again.

Tons of players have their own rinks, so does Wendel Clark, should we call him too?

These guys have been scoring goals and running drills their entire life, MSL's hockey school isn't going to do anything at this point. if he's doing it for fun, lighten things up, ok. If he really thinks this is going to work, because he is teaching them moves from 'back in the day' he may as well play EA Sports NHL 2016 with them, and show them some moves from there too?

This team has no real structure in any zone, plus the entry is all over the map. It's not all his fault, this team isn't built around any real system but the have loved the dump and chase for the last 30 years, for some reason.

BTW Crosby isn't teaching other guys moves and drills, they are just practicing. He's an active player, one of the best in the world and generational talent, I'd listen to him as well, but he mostly works with the rookies and local players to stay in game shape.

Why are we pampering the coach so much anyways? A really good hockey player doesn't equate to being a good coach, we know this time and time again.


he retired from coaching

This is year two of a rebuild with a mix of young players(second youngest team in the league) with some good vets and leftover scrap still remaining from Bergevin's tenure so we can't expect miracles right away. Most people are expecting a top 5 pick come next year's draft and that is still a real possibility, it's only November and some of the wins we have might have raised the expectation level for some but it's probably not sustainable. He had the players doing shooting drills during practice and for all we know, the players themselves might have requested it but it doesn't really matter anyway. Practicing fundamental aspects of hockey is good at all levels and there's nothing to see here I guess.

 

[morhilane]

Shouldn't they learn how to score in their junior years?

My idea is, if a player is in NHL, he should know everything from ice-hockey.

Knowing about something is quite different then executing something. Players do skill drills to keep their skills sharp and improve their effectiveness over their entire career. A lots of top players have their daily routines.

Also, yesterday practice wasn't entirely shooting drills, the goalies and defenders were doing other things on the other ice while the forwards were doing those and there was ozone 3v2 thigh space high speed drills afterwards.

 

[Rapala]

I'm genuinely surprised this isn't a regular thing lol
Whatever helps the boys imo

Shooting drills when I grew up were aways done on your own time. I spent countless hours Rolling a five pound weight tied with a skate lace to a mini dumbell up and down and firing pucks off a thin wooden wall panel (less friction) against targets placed on our garage wall. If dedicated enough the result is a killer wrist shot and backhand .These are the drills my Dad had all of us doing once we hit PeeWee mind you the weight was a 2 1/2 pounder at that age. This is why I always assume guys like Harris and others can improve their muffin shots.

 

[Rapala]

Hockey is not like the NFL with whistles after every play, there can only be so much strategy involved and with the speed of the game, the bouncing puck, the deflections etc, it's almost impossible to be an x's and o's strategist behind the bench. Matchups require input from a coach, pp strategy, and pk but how much else can he influence?

There were rumors that the players tuned out Ducharme during our COVID run and that Corey Perry, Carey Price and Shea Weber ran the bench and the room, heck, there have even been player coaches in lower-tier leagues of hockey. Most of the success involves the talent level on the ice and if the guys assembled together like each other enough to play for each other, just my opinion and others probably see it differently, which is fine.

I remember that shortened season after the lockout. When the first games were played with barely any practice or coaching input (Therrien). Not only were the lads having fun they were scoring goals and playing a game style they enjoyed...

It didn't last long.

 

[SannywithoutCompy]

Shouldn't they learn how to score in their junior years?

My idea is, if a player is in NHL, he should know everything from ice-hockey.

GSP was still drilling double legs when he was champion. Always room for improvement.

 

[Habs]

This is year two of a rebuild with a mix of young players(second youngest team in the league) with some good vets and leftover scrap still remaining from Bergevin's tenure so we can't expect miracles right away. Most people are expecting a top 5 pick come next year's draft and that is still a real possibility, it's only November and some of the wins we have might have raised the expectation level for some but it's probably not sustainable. He had the players doing shooting drills during practice and for all we know, the players themselves might have requested it but it doesn't really matter anyway. Practicing fundamental aspects of hockey is good at all levels and there's nothing to see here I guess.

oh i don't care about the standings, but I do care about the young kids progressing. If we finish bottom 5 and Cole has 35+ goals, great. But if we finish bottom 5 and he's spinning around 22 goals I'll chalk it up to business as usual in Montreal. They let amazing young players rot through their years and do nothing with that skill. Markov, Price, Koivu to name a few... and now we have this nice young core and I'm still not sure what direction they are going in.

Again , these guys know how to score.. they lack a system and key players to really make a difference. If the shooting drill is to lighten the mood and have some fun, great.. but if MSL is teaching them some drills from 'back in the day' .. I mean.. lets be honest it isn't going to do much.

If you need to teach 'fundamentals of hockey' at the NHL level your franchise is doomed

 

[FerrisRox]

I don't think we are turning on the coach but there is something to be said for a guy who went from coaching young kids straight into coaching an NHL team. Many of the mistakes he is making are mistakes coaches make coaching a Junior team, or an AHL team but since Marty bypassed these Development steps we are seeing mistakes that shouldn't be made.

Please detail the mistakes that "shouldn't be made" that we are seeing Martin St. Louis make.

You said there are many of them, so it should be really easy to catalog these mistakes.

 

[rik schau]

Shouldn't they learn how to score in their junior years?

My idea is, if a player is in NHL, he should know everything from ice-hockey.

Yes.but there is always room for improvement.

 

[The Gr8 Dane]

You guys are laughing ,

we've been a bottom 3 on ice product entertainment wise in the entire league for more than 25 years and you guys are here laughing about our coach doing shooting drills.

Only reason this team has eyes on it and actual support from fans is from passing on the fandom from parent to child as a curse. The organisation hasn't done a single thing that warrants a 200$ ticket or even a casual viewing aside from drafting carey price in 2005.

MSL is a breath of fresh air.
God forbid he tries to teach these absolute scrubs how to score some goals.

Its funny how we are all high and mighty on MSL when we just went through Therrien Claude and Ducharme LOL

 

[Tyson]

Please detail the mistakes that "shouldn't be made" that we are seeing Martin St. Louis make.

You said there are many of them, so it should be really easy to catalog these mistakes.

I had a completely different response that I removed because I am trying to be nice.
Playing struggling players in critical situations to try and get them going is not something a seasoned coach would do.
He needs to take his own advice and "listen to what the game is telling you" instead of making no adjustments during a game.
How about playing your best offensive player (Caufield) with your true 4th line Center (Dvorak).

Your best Center this year has been Monahan, why isn't he playing with Caufield?

He talks about not skipping steps in developing players but I guess that doesn't apply to rookie coaches.

 

[Spearmint Rhino]

Anderson wearing #12 in practice today?

 

[morhilane]

You guys are laughing ,

we've been a bottom 3 on ice product entertainment wise in the entire league for more than 25 years and you guys are here laughing about our coach doing shooting drills.

Only reason this team has eyes on it and actual support from fans is from passing on the fandom from parent to child as a curse. The organisation hasn't done a single thing that warrants a 200$ ticket or even a casual viewing aside from drafting carey price in 2005.

MSL is a breath of fresh air.
God forbid he tries to teach these absolute scrubs how to score some goals.

Its funny how we are all high and mighty on MSL when we just went through Therrien Claude and Ducharme LOL

Some posters were clearly fans of Therrien and Claude going for punitive practices after loses...

 

[WeThreeKings]

Well they scored 4, so it worked.

 

[JianYang]

oh i don't care about the standings, but I do care about the young kids progressing. If we finish bottom 5 and Cole has 35+ goals, great. But if we finish bottom 5 and he's spinning around 22 goals I'll chalk it up to business as usual in Montreal. They let amazing young players rot through their years and do nothing with that skill. Markov, Price, Koivu to name a few... and now we have this nice young core and I'm still not sure what direction they are going in.

Again , these guys know how to score.. they lack a system and key players to really make a difference. If the shooting drill is to lighten the mood and have some fun, great.. but if MSL is teaching them some drills from 'back in the day' .. I mean.. lets be honest it isn't going to do much.

If you need to teach 'fundamentals of hockey' at the NHL level your franchise is doomed

What I like about hiring msl is that presents a psychological shift in the organization for the first time since.... Maybe ever? Whether he's the man for the job, we shall see, but it's not time yet to be putting him under the bus.

Development of players is the name of the game right now, and it's often not transparent on the television, because it's not necessarily a linear path.

This what makes the kirby dach injury sting so much. To lose a really young player that you are trying to build up as a key piece during a development season feels really wasteful.

Seasons like this one are dedicated to invest in guys like Dach for dividends in the future, and to lose him after one game is not only a setback for him... It's a setback to the entire development cycle of the team.

 

[Habs]

What I like about hiring msl is that presents a psychological shift in the organization for the first time since.... Maybe ever? Whether he's the man for the job, we shall see, but it's not time yet to be putting him under the bus.

Development of players is the name of the game right now, and it's often not transparent on the television, because it's not necessarily a linear path.

This what makes the kirby dach injury sting so much. To lose a really young player that you are trying to build up as a key piece during a development season feels really wasteful.

Seasons like this one are dedicated to invest in guys like Dach for dividends in the future, and to lose him after one game is not only a setback for him... It's a setback to the entire development cycle of the team.

MSL is fine because this team has no expectations and the media love him. Kent Hughes is terrific because the press love him, he has no faults. Just wait for another 2 years of busted top draft picks and let's see how the relationship ends lol

Dach is an injury prone 38 pt C, he hasn't shown anything more to this point. He's shown promise, but just hasn't delivered. 2 years in a row he's been injured and they should probably get used to it at this point. Losing Cole or Nick would collapse this team, Dach's injury can be bandaid'd until later. We have lots of hope for Dach, but maybe he's just an injury prone 40pt guy at the end of the day. Would be great if he was a 55pt player, kid had lots of promise since his days in the W.

Sometimes teams have to accept what we have, instead of what we hope a player can be.

 

[Favster]

This thread is hilarious. Surprised it took people this long to start turning on MSL, some idiotic takes in here over a drill. Unreal

 

[JianYang]

MSL is fine because this team has no expectations and the media love him. Kent Hughes is terrific because the press love him, he has no faults. Just wait for another 2 years of busted top draft picks and let's see how the relationship ends lol

Dach is an injury prone 38 pt C, he hasn't shown anything more to this point. He's shown promise, but just hasn't delivered. 2 years in a row he's been injured and they should probably get used to it at this point. Losing Cole or Nick would collapse this team, Dach's injury can be bandaid'd until later. We have lots of hope for Dach, but maybe he's just an injury prone 40pt guy at the end of the day. Would be great if he was a 55pt player, kid had lots of promise since his days in the W.

Sometimes teams have to accept what we have, instead of what we hope a player can be.

The 38 points was in 50 some games as a 21 year old. What I saw last year that made me excited was his ability to play in tight areas where he can make room for himself. You want those kinds of guys in the playoffs when real estate becomes restricted.

I think he's got alot to offer but the injuries are definitely concerning, and hopefully it isn't a permanent set back the way it turned out to be for koivu, who was still good, but he did lose some explosiveness.