Management GM Pierre Dorion/Front Office Thread - Part VIII

[Tuna99]

I don't like Formenton on the second line. He's a third liner right now. That also pushes Paul to the 4th line where he belongs. That means we need 2 top 6 wingers. I've been saying that for a while.

I do think Grieg is ready to play #2LW next season so #2RW is needed. But agree about Formenton, perfect in a bottom 6 roll similar to Vermette when he was here - elite bottom 6 player who PK’s and provides offence with speed

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

I do think Grieg is ready to play #2LW next season so #2RW is needed. But agree about Formenton, perfect in a bottom 6 roll similar to Vermette when he was here - elite bottom 6 player who PK’s and provides offence with speed

Greig is at least an AHL season away. Let him dominate AHL first. Formenton is ahead of Greig next year. That's why I can see us signing Kuzmenko and giving him that role for a year and evaluating the year after.

Tkachuk-Norris-Batherson
Kuzmenko/Form-Stutzle-Giroux
Formenton/Kuz-Pinto-Brown

 

[Tuna99]

Greig is at least an AHL season away. Let him dominate AHL first. Formenton is ahead of Greig next year. That's why I can see us signing Kuzmenko and giving him that role for a year and evaluating the year after.

Tkachuk-Norris-Batherson
Kuzmenko/Form-Stutzle-Giroux
Formenton/Kuz-Pinto-Brown

I’d do this next season, good balanced lineup

Tkachuk - Norris - Batherson
Greig - Stuztle - C. Brown
Formenton - Pinto - White
Paul - Gambrell - Watson

 

[ReginKarlssonLehner]

I’d do this next season, good balanced lineup

Tkachuk - Norris - Batherson
Greig - Stuztle - C. Brown
Formenton - Pinto - White
Paul - Gambrell - Watson

I'm probably Greig's biggest fan on here. I said at the end of last year he'll be the best between he, Norris and Pinto.

But he's not going to be top 6 winger for us next year. Especially ahead of Formenton. It's not completely out of the question--we've seen guys like Mercer and Jarvis already play on their top 6 and Greig is doing just as well in CHL(in comparison years) with just as complete a game--but I think possible best case we see him with Pinto while Formenton keeps playing with Stutzle.

Preferably, Greig is dominating AHL and comes up trade deadline if he's really acclimating well.

 

[Tuna99]

I'm probably Greig's biggest fan on here. I said at the end of last year he'll be the best between he, Norris and Pinto.

But he's not going to be top 6 winger for us next year. Especially ahead of Formenton. It's not completely out of the question--we've seen guys like Mercer and Jarvis already play on their top 6 and Greig is doing just as well in CHL(in comparison years) with just as complete a game--but I think possible best case we see him with Pinto while Formenton keeps playing with Stutzle.

Preferably, Greig is dominating AHL and comes up trade deadline if he's really acclimating well.

Greig’s hockey sense and middle of the ice play makes me think he’s better suited in an page dove roll, over Formenton. And better do her for sure. Grieg is also a very good skater so I don’t think we’ll be losing any speed if it’s him over Formy

 

[Sens Vader]

I don't like Formenton on the second line. He's a third liner right now. That also pushes Paul to the 4th line where he belongs. That means we need 2 top 6 wingers. I've been saying that for a while.

Well I think in an ideal world be can also nab Kuzmenko on an ELC

We also have a top 5/10 pick so maybe we draft another top 6er.

If we fill that right spot I think we're a playoff/wild card team. We have time to figure out where guys like Formenton fit in when we're closer to contending

 

[GCK]

I don't like Formenton on the second line. He's a third liner right now. That also pushes Paul to the 4th line where he belongs. That means we need 2 top 6 wingers. I've been saying that for a while.

If Paul is a 4th liner going forward we should move him at the deadline.

 

[JD1]

If Paul is a 4th liner going forward we should move him at the deadline.

If Paul is a 4th liner, we're in really good shape.

 

[God Says No]

I’d do this next season, good balanced lineup

Tkachuk - Norris - Batherson
Greig - Stuztle - C. Brown
Formenton - Pinto - White
Paul - Gambrell - Watson

That's a bottom 10 team again. Not enough scoring.

 

[GCK]

If Paul is a 4th liner, we're in really good shape.

On the ice sure but not in relation to the cap.

 

[JD1]

On the ice sure but not in relation to the cap.

What concerns me about this team is managing within that cap. By the time Sanderson rolls off his ELC, things will be tight

 

[GCK]

What concerns me about this team is managing within that cap. By the time Sanderson rolls off his ELC, things will be tight

Exactly. I keep looking at 2024/25 when the cap is expected to be about 84M.

Brady, Stu, Norris, Chabot and Sanderson eating up 40M.

Batherson and Zub another 10M.

Having 4th liners and bottom pair D making 2M+ will be almost impossible.

 

[Golden_Jet]

There definitely are buyout timelines in play but it's honestly so overblown. The difference between buying him out this offseason vs. the one after adds about $2 million to the total buyout. Is that a lot of money in NHL terms? Not really. You could make the argument that Melnyk would rather save that $2 million but I'm wagering they would rather roll the dice and give him a full year to show where he's at rather than buy him out and watch him go somewhere else and potentially thrive. At the cost of $2 million extra, is it worth the potential negativity over a player assessment gone wrong? He's only 25, he's not doing growing his game and improving. I mean shit, he hasn't even played yet this year.

Once he turns 26, it’s 2/3 of remaining contract, before 1/3

 

[Tuna99]

That's a bottom 10 team again. Not enough scoring.

did you see the D - tons of offence from the D

Chabot - Zub
Sanderson - Holden
Brannstrom - Zaitsev

 

[God Says No]

did you see the D - tons of offence from the D

Chabot - Zub
Sanderson - Holden
Brannstrom - Zaitsev

Tons? I see maybe 30 goals there. Just for reference, the Avs have 40 goals mid way through this season from the D.

 

[GCK]

Tons? I see maybe 30 goals there. Just for reference, the Avs have 40 goals mid way through this season from the D.

Tampa 20 G from the D, Florida 21G, Ottawa 12. The D corps @Tuna99 posted is more on par with other high end scoring teams. You took the outlier.

 

[God Says No]

Tampa 20 G from the D, Florida 21G, Ottawa 12. The D corps @Tuna99 posted is more on par with other high end scoring teams. You took the outlier.

Yeah but the forwards for all those teams score waaaay more than the lineup posted. That's the point. The D needs to be an outlier to be competitive.

 

[GCK]

Yeah but the forwards for all those teams score waaaay more than the lineup posted. That's the point. The D needs to be an outlier to be competitive.

We need about 250-260 goals to be competitive.
I figure the way our team is being built we will need about 165 from our top 2 lines

 

[God Says No]

We need about 250-260 goals to be competitive.
I figure the way our team is being built we will need about 165 from our top 2 lines

Actually more than 260. I posted this before:

Yeah, that's not enough. Top scoring team a couple years ago (since it was a full 82 game season) was TBL (NHL Stats) with 319 goals. I figure you need to be top 10 to be competitive. So that's 260+. Now let's try to think of a possible lineup next year:

Tkatchuk (25) - Norris (35) - Bath (30)
Formenton (20) - Stut (30) - Brown (20)
Paul (15) - Pinto (15) - White (15)
Soko (10)- Gambrell (5)- Watson (5)

Let's say we get another 20 from the D.

I think I was realistic for the most part, and a bit generous in certain players. That's 245. That would take us to about 15th in all scoring. I still maintain we need a sniper on the second line. Perhaps 2.

As you can see I was a bit generous in certain situations (i.e. Brown scoring 20, or Stutzle scoring 30 next season, or that White stays healthy and scores 15), but the point still stands.

 

[GCK]

Actually more than 260. I posted this before:



As you can see I was a bit generous in certain situations (i.e. Brown scoring 20, or Stutzle scoring 30 next season, or that White stays healthy and scores 15), but the point still stands.

260 goals is plenty for a team not being built as a high scoring team. We are building a team that will be more in the mild of the Boston, LA and StL Cup teams.

 

[God Says No]

260 goals is plenty for a team not being built as a high scoring team. We are building a team that will be more in the mild of the Boston, LA and StL Cup teams.

We shall see. I still maintain we should score more than that whether it be from F or D. 260 should be the absolute minimum to be competitive. My lineup scores only 245. Not enough.

 

[BankStreetParade]

Once he turns 26, it’s 2/3 of remaining contract, before 1/3

Like I said in the post it's an extra $2 million over the lifetime of the buyout. I'd rather the team "throw away" $2 million than throw away a 25 year old center who still potentially has lots of room to grow and improve.

 

[GCK]

We shall see. I still maintain we should score more than that whether it be from F or D. 260 should be the absolute minimum to be competitive. My lineup scores only 245. Not enough.

Just to finish up. Washington and Calgary are both on pace for 260 goals this year which ties them for 11th in Goals per game.

 

[God Says No]

Just to finish up. Washington and Calgary are both on pace for 260 goals this year which ties them for 11th in Goals per game.

That's great, that's what I already said. You need at least 260 to be competitive. With the current roster (without additions of someone like Laine) we score about 245. Not good enough.

 

[Tuna99]

Actually more than 260. I posted this before:



As you can see I was a bit generous in certain situations (i.e. Brown scoring 20, or Stutzle scoring 30 next season, or that White stays healthy and scores 15), but the point still stands.

Could see next years D Corp scoring 30

Chabot - 7
Zub - 5 (All Game Winners)
Sanderson - 5
Brannstrom - 5
Holden - 3
Thomson - 3
Zaitsev - 1
JBD - 1