German Football Part III

[Bon Esprit]

RB have something to play for. Dortmund don't.

How many of the not sky or whatever users would watch Dortmund and how many would watch RB? BvB is still the 2nd biggest club in Germany televisiom-wise.

Plus they are playing Real not Besiktas like RB.

 

[cgf]

I'd rather watch Leipzig.

 

[Deficient Mode]

How many of the not sky or whatever users would watch Dortmund and how many would watch RB? BvB is still the 2nd biggest club in Germany televisiom-wise.

Plus they are playing Real not Besiktas like RB.

How many Dortmund fans are so despondent they feel reluctant to watch their own team? That's how I feel.

Obviously they have way more fans than Leipzig but if I were a neutral I'd want to watch Leipzig probably.

 

[Savant]

How many Dortmund fans are so despondent they feel reluctant to watch their own team? That's how I feel.

Obviously they have way more fans than Leipzig but if I were a neutral I'd want to watch Leipzig probably.

Klopp still loves you.

 

[Deficient Mode]

Klopp still loves you.

I know you're unhappy with him, but I would take Klopp back in a heartbeat right now. Just what Dortmund could use.

 

[Savant]

I know you're unhappy with him, but I would take Klopp back in a heartbeat right now. Just what Dortmund could use.

I’m not unhappy, I am simply content. Which isn’t enough when half of the fan base wants to build statues of him. I wish he could put a trophy in the cabinet this season and/or make the CL back to back years (at least). Then we are cool.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Two players who can't keep up themselves are requesting their friend is put into the side? No.

 

[Deficient Mode]

Christ. Sahin and Schmelzer want the team to look like it did in 2010. I've defended their spots in the squad before but this is ridiculous. What a pair of whiners.

 

[NJ07102]

Leipzig is tied on points with Porto with their advancement to the knockouts in question.... how is their game of zero importance???

Because for Leipzig to get through, Porto would have to lose or tie Monaco, which was never going to happen. In addition to that it is a total waste of time to watch any german team internationally except Bayern, because none of the other teams is competitive in any way. Bundesliga is in deep, deep trouble with this one team dominance and the rest losing their best players year after year. I wonder when the attendance figures will start to drop like a stone. Why spend money for something that is as exciting as watching snow melt? The only thing that is interesting is relegation, even the international spots are not interesting because german teams drop out like flies anyway.

 

[Deficient Mode]

Because for Leipzig to get through, Porto would have to lose or tie Monaco, which was never going to happen. In addition to that it is a total waste of time to watch any german team internationally except Bayern, because none of the other teams is competitive in any way. Bundesliga is in deep, deep trouble with this one team dominance and the rest losing their best players year after year. I wonder when the attendance figures will start to drop like a stone. Why spend money for something that is as exciting as watching snow melt? The only thing that is interesting is relegation, even the international spots are not interesting because german teams drop out like flies anyway.

Bundesliga attendance figures are going to drop because the teams can't compete internationally? I mean, 10 years ago when German teams totally sucked and the Bundesliga had fallen behind Ligue 1 in coefficient, Bundesliga stadiums were filled to 85.6% capacity on average. In 2013/14, at the peak of the Bundesliga's international relevance, the stadiums were filled to 91% capacity on average. So far this year they're 91% filled to capacity. I don't expect a catastrophic fall in attendance at all; domestic attendance isn't really affected by international relevance.

The rest of your post is just unfounded panic and recency bias. If you really think Leipzig and Dortmund are in long-term trouble internationally and won't be able to make it out of their CL groups in the future, go ahead I guess. I'm not too worried. So far it looks like the top 6 next year will be bigger clubs with better recent international records. None of the likes of Hertha and Köln.

 

[NJ07102]

The rest of your post is just unfounded panic and recency bias.

Recency bias... I give you as much as at least we had two teams that were somehow competitive in the past. In the EL, Bundesliga has been a total disaster forever basically. You have to go back to 2010 to see somebody in the semis, when HSV lost to Fulham and Bremen lost the final before that. It makes no difference if we see Hertha or Schalke or Leverkusen or Hoffenheim in the EL next year. None of these clubs seem to be able to build a 3rd force for longer than a year. Hoffenheim didn't lose a home game in ages until mighty Braga came along.

I've been watching Bundesliga for ages and have been to hundreds of games. Maybe I am spoiled by the times of M'gladbach or Bremen or Lautern, when international games were still real highlights and teams were competitive even when playing good opponents. Now Bundesliga teams lose to anybody. It is time to realize that something is seriously wrong in this league. Bayern dominance is one thing, but the lousy work by everybody else is another. Heck yeah, so Tuchel wasn't nice and pissed people off. But at least he knew what he was doing.

 

[Deficient Mode]

Recency bias... I give you as much as at least we had two teams that were somehow competitive in the past. In the EL, Bundesliga has been a total disaster forever basically. You have to go back to 2010 to see somebody in the semis, when HSV lost to Fulham and Bremen lost the final before that. It makes no difference if we see Hertha or Schalke or Leverkusen or Hoffenheim in the EL next year. None of these clubs seem to be able to build a 3rd force for longer than a year. Hoffenheim didn't lose a home game in ages until mighty Braga came along.

I've been watching Bundesliga for ages and have been to hundreds of games. Maybe I am spoiled by the times of M'gladbach or Bremen or Lautern, when international games were still real highlights and teams were competitive even when playing good opponents. Now Bundesliga teams lose to anybody. It is time to realize that something is seriously wrong in this league. Bayern dominance is one thing, but the lousy work by everybody else is another. Heck yeah, so Tuchel wasn't nice and pissed people off. But at least he knew what he was doing.

Hoffenheim also lost at home against Liverpool.

I agree that the league lacks a stable top 6 like the EPL has, and you get years like this sometimes as a result. The smaller teams like Freiburg, Mainz, Köln that make the EL always fail hard, yeah. And aside from maybe 3 clubs, the rest will struggle to do well in Europe AND stay afloat in the league. I'm still confident Leipzig will be a third regular force. Their CL campaign was maybe a disappointment this year, but they did way better than Dortmund in their first year back in the competition. They can build up their coefficient in the EL in hopes of a better draw next year, too.

I don't think what you're talking about is exclusive to German teams, either. The gap between the best teams and the rest has grown tremendously even in the past 10 years. It makes it harder for secondary teams not to get embarrassed.

 

[NJ07102]

I don't think what you're talking about is exclusive to German teams, either. The gap between the best teams and the rest has grown tremendously even in the past 10 years. It makes it harder for secondary teams not to get embarrassed.

Many Spanish teams do well in the EL year after year, and many of those don't have the funds that some of the german teams have. Sevilla will never become Spanish champions though, not as long as Barcelona or Real leave the league. But nevertheless these teams are "best of the rest" so to say and are highly competitive in Europe. I believe there are clubs in Germany that have the potential to be as good, but they do not work as well as teams in Spain do. If you look at EL results you will find that even teams from Portugal have been way more successful than the Bundesliga teams. It is not "just" about money here, it is about working badly and trying to copy Klopp-Football with pressing and quick counter attacks.

I also do not see it as a strength for the league that year after year the teams between 3 and 15 interchange completely. I believe clubs like Schalke, Leverkusen, Hoffenheim and others would have the potential to be a solid 2nd tier club year after year, but they don't utilize it. Then you have these one year wonders that get a EL-Spot only to get relegated the year after. Like Köln: They let their one really good player go, get no one to replace him and consequently sink like a stone. That is simply unprofessional management.

 

[Albatros]

Interesting thoughts from Freiburg striker Nils Petersen regarding intelligence of footballers:

Petersen über geistiges Niveau im Fußball: Ich verblöde seit zehn Jahren

 

[cgf]

Gotta love the sky-is-falling folks. Surprised we didn't hear about how german youth football is in dire straits because we only won the Confed Cup & U21s.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

I don't think he's wrong. I'm sure most aren't naturally stupid people, they just dropped out of school early, some high level footballers probably didn't even attend school. And for those that did attend school, how much attention did they put into their school-work when they were in school? When you have a profession that is more about physical capabilities than mental capabilities, what do you expect? I can't imagine the schooling in some countries that produce a lot of good footballers is all that good either. You pretty much can't get regular schooling past like 18 and end up one of the best in the world at your position. Its like two full time jobs, not enough time to do both.

 

[cgf]

My comment was not in response to albatros. Footballers are really dumb & that's widely known.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

My comment was not in response to albatros. Footballers are really dumb & that's widely known.

I wasn't responding to you. I was responding under his post, and yours was 2 minutes before mine. It wasn't there when I started my response.

 

[Deficient Mode]

Many footballers are stupid in a way that goes way past their lack of education. Though Petersen does seem to be mostly talking about a lack of education.

 

[cgf]

Many footballers are stupid in a way that goes way past their lack of education. Though Petersen does seem to be mostly talking about a lack of education.

It's a big part of my love for Kramer. In a sport filled with dumb dumbs he's not just eloquent but insightful.

 

[Deficient Mode]

It's a big part of my love for Kramer. In a sport filled with dumb dumbs he's not just eloquent but insightful.

What about Max Kruse though? I guess you have to have some calculation power in your brain to be a successful poker player, but otherwise...

 

[Bon Esprit]

What about Max Kruse though? I guess you have to have some calculation power in your brain to be a successful poker player, but otherwise...

Poker has nothing to do with education. Poker is math. Pot odds and stuff. You don't need to know who Nietzsche was and what he wrote.

 

[Deficient Mode]

Poker has nothing to do with education. Poker is math. Pot odds and stuff. You don't need to know who Nietzsche was and what he wrote.

Well, I wasn't talking about education but intelligence, and I'm fully aware Kruse comes off as an idiot.

 

[YNWA14]

I wouldn't say footballers are dumb. Most are just uneducated. There's a big difference.

 

[cgf]

I wouldn't say footballers are dumb. Most are just uneducated. There's a big difference.

Most are dumb & not just uneducated. If dumb is too harsh a word for you we can call them simply instead; but in general if a footballer doesn't make you wanna start making jokes about Lennie, he's doing alright.