Prospect Info: General Discussion of Prospects

[SundherDome]

Kulich never has and never will be projected as a first liner.

Wut

 

[SundherDome]

One of the problems with constantly drafting guys who are perceived to be undervalued is that they are in fact undervalued and if you go to trade them, well, they will continue to be undervalued.

I dunno about that logic. I think we do over value our own guys (I think every GM does this tbh). But if we were to go to market with a Helenius or Benson, the return would be nice. Rosen and Kulich both have nice value as well as they have produced well in both of their minor pro seasons. Savoie was lower on the list around the league and probably here as well in the front office, it was a good move to trade one for some immediate help in an area of need. I'm curious to see how Ostlund, Wahlberg and Kisakov/Neuchev progress this year as we value them fairly highly (3 ranked in top 10 in our pool).

 

[TageGod]

Interesting... what made you come to that conclusion?

He was taken at 28 and considered one of the more NHL ready players in the draft. Basically he was closer to his ceiling than most of the players, which is a reason he was a late pick. He is a mostly average skillset player with an elite shot. Still struggling to break into the NHL. He is most likely a third liner. You could argue an okay 2nd liner as ceiling.

 

[Doug Prishpreed]

Sabres pipeline ranked #10 (down from #3 last year) by the Athletic:

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5632713/2024/08/28/buffalo-sabres-nhl-prospect-pipeline-rankings-2024/

 

[Doug Prishpreed]

Sabres pipeline ranked #10 (down from #3 last year) by the Athletic:

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5632713/2024/08/28/buffalo-sabres-nhl-prospect-pipeline-rankings-2024/

He projects Zeev Buium to not only be better than Helenius, but also better than Power and anyone else on the Sabres besides Dahlin. And even better than the other Wild Dman, Faber!

It's going to be very frustrating to watch him blossom into an all-star, knowing we could've had him. He seems like a rare player.

 

[Zman5778]

He projects Zeev Buium to not only be better than Helenius, but also better than Power and anyone else on the Sabres besides Dahlin. And even better than the other Wild Dman, Faber!

It's going to be very frustrating to watch him blossom into an all-star, knowing we could've had him. He seems like a rare player.

Or Buium could bust and Helenius establishes himself as a legit #2C.

It's way too early to make any sort of definitive statement. Just because Pronman thinks Buium is that good doesn't mean that he WILL be that good.

 

[Doug Prishpreed]

Or Buium could bust and Helenius establishes himself as a legit #2C.

It's way too early to make any sort of definitive statement. Just because Pronman thinks Buium is that good doesn't mean that he WILL be that good.

Same could be said for literally ever Sabres prospect, and I don't see you pumping the breaks on every post who says "Benson is going to be great!" Or insert the name there.

Funny how you only urge caution for prospects on other teams, but not Buffalo.

 

[Zman5778]

Funny how you only urge caution for prospects on other teams, but not Buffalo.

Go ahead and go through my posts. I PROMISE you that not only do I urge caution for some Buffalo prospects......I also am unabashedly for prospects on other teams.

Weird attempt at some form of a "gotcha".

 

[CowbellConray]

Same could be said for literally ever Sabres prospect, and I don't see you pumping the breaks on every post who says "Benson is going to be great!" Or insert the name there.

Funny how you only urge caution for prospects on other teams, but not Buffalo.

I dont know that I see ZMan be as negatively definitive as you were with your statement of Zeev being a confirmed all star... I think he is simply saying let's see how things play out in real time instead of just saying a player WILL be better

 

[Zman5778]

I dont know that I see ZMan be as negatively definitive as you were with your statement of Zeev being a confirmed all star... I think he is simply saying let's see how things play out in real time instead of just saying a player WILL be better

Thank you. Exactly.

Could Buium be an All-Star? Absolutely, he has that talent. It's FAR too early in the process to say definitively that he will. Could Buium bust? Sure. It's FAR too early to say definitively that he will.

The more or less exact same could be said for Helenius. Or Dickinson. Or many 2024 draftees in that 10ish-20ish range.

 

[dire wolf]

Sabres pipeline ranked #10 (down from #3 last year) by the Athletic:

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5632713/2024/08/28/buffalo-sabres-nhl-prospect-pipeline-rankings-2024/

It's pretty surprising to me. This is a list of U23 players, so it includes: Power, Levi, Peterka, Quinn and Benson, as well as all the prospects, like Kulich, Wahlberg, Helenius, Ostlund, Rosen, Komarov, Novikov, Neuchev, Kleber, Strbak, etc.

Are there really 9 teams with a better list of U23 players? Maybe some more elite talent (e.g. Bedard, Celebrini, etc.) but that's an insane amount of high quality depth and proven players.

 

[SundherDome]

Thank you. Exactly.

Could Buium be an All-Star? Absolutely, he has that talent. It's FAR too early in the process to say definitively that he will. Could Buium bust? Sure. It's FAR too early to say definitively that he will.

The more or less exact same could be said for Helenius. Or Dickinson. Or many 2024 draftees in that 10ish-20ish range.

Wait until they trot Buium out there with Bogosian ...

For real though, we have no idea how any of these guys will turn out and since development isn't linear on every team it's a bigger crapshoot, maybe he is an all star on Carolina but a bust in Minnesota, who knows.

 

[HOOats]

Or Buium could bust and Helenius establishes himself as a legit #2C.

It's way too early to make any sort of definitive statement. Just because Pronman thinks Buium is that good doesn't mean that he WILL be that good.

Pronman the infallible sage (who got beaten to an NHL job by a database website).

 

[Doug Prishpreed]

It's pretty surprising to me. This is a list of U23 players, so it includes: Power, Levi, Peterka, Quinn and Benson, as well as all the prospects, like Kulich, Wahlberg, Helenius, Ostlund, Rosen, Komarov, Novikov, Neuchev, Kleber, Strbak, etc.

Are there really 9 teams with a better list of U23 players? Maybe some more elite talent (e.g. Bedard, Celebrini, etc.) but that's an insane amount of high quality depth and proven players.

I just don't think Buffalo has any all-star level players in that group. Dahlin and Tage are the only stars and the reason Rebuild 4.0 isn't off to the smoothest of starts.

Pronman the infallible sage (who got beaten to an NHL job by a database website).

Here's well respected group of prospect evaluators that just ranked Buffalo 16th. Got some insults for them too?

EP Rinkside 2024 NHL Prospect Pool Rankings: No. 16-ranked Buffalo Sabres

David St-Louis takes you through the Buffalo Sabres' 16th-ranked prospect pool with scouting reports and tools grades on its 18 best prospects.

eprinkside.com

 

[dire wolf]

I just don't think Buffalo has any all-star level players in that group. Dahlin and Tage are the only stars and the reason Rebuild 4.0 isn't off to the smoothest of starts.


Here's well respected group of prospect evaluators that just ranked Buffalo 16th. Got some insults for them too?

EP Rinkside 2024 NHL Prospect Pool Rankings: No. 16-ranked Buffalo Sabres

David St-Louis takes you through the Buffalo Sabres' 16th-ranked prospect pool with scouting reports and tools grades on its 18 best prospects.

eprinkside.com

Maybe. Power and Levi have all-star potential. Quinn and Peterka could possibly get there, at least briefly. Jury is out on Helenius and some others. But even without elite talent, the high-end depth is impressive.

Your EP article link is different - it only ranks prospects, not U23, so it doesn't include Levi, Benson and Power.

Also, I didn't insult anyone. Not sure what you're talking about.

 

[Matt Ress]

Maybe. Power and Levi have all-star potential. Quinn and Peterka could possibly get there, at least briefly. Jury is out on Helenius and some others. But even without elite talent, the high-end depth is impressive.

Your EP article link is different - it only ranks prospects, not U23, so it doesn't include Levi, Benson and Power.

Also, I didn't insult anyone. Not sure what you're talking about.

I think he meant a different poster but I mean, I can insult just about anybody

 

[Doug Prishpreed]

Maybe. Power and Levi have all-star potential. Quinn and Peterka could possibly get there, at least briefly. Jury is out on Helenius and some others. But even without elite talent, the high-end depth is impressive.

Your EP article link is different - it only ranks prospects, not U23, so it doesn't include Levi, Benson and Power.

Also, I didn't insult anyone. Not sure what you're talking about.

I thought it was clear that part was a response to HOOats post.

Anyway, high end depth of prospects rarely turns into high end depth in the NHL, since they’re mostly lottery tickets. But with more lottery tickets, we do have greater chance for one or more of them to turn into stars though.

 

[HOOats]

Pronman is really stepping up the click bait (no offense to his friends and family, of course). NYT must be pressing The Athletic for more engagement.

Silayev 8 spots above Power! Solberg over Benson! His assessments of Sabres are so bad, I have to imagine it's like that for every team. Ostlund the average skater!

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5713250/2024/09/03/nhl-players-prospects-under-23-bedard-stutzle-celebrini

Sabres very strong group
19 Power
36 Quinn
57 Peterka
58 Helenius
62 Benson
102 Kulich
104 Ostlund
117 Wahlberg
141 Kleber

 

[sabremike]

Pronman is really stepping up the click bait (no offense to his friends and family, of course). NYT must be pressing The Athletic for more engagement.

Silayev 8 spots above Power! Solberg over Benson! His assessments of Sabres are so bad, I have to imagine it's like that for every team. Ostlund the average skater!

https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5713250/2024/09/03/nhl-players-prospects-under-23-bedard-stutzle-celebrini

Sabres very strong group
19 Power
36 Quinn
57 Peterka
58 Helenius
62 Benson
102 Kulich
104 Ostlund
117 Wahlberg
141 Kleber

Benson was so good he literally forced his way onto the roster for a full season and was among our better forwards as an 18 year old. How in the hell is he ranked so low, that's insane.

 

[Chainshot]

Benson was so good he literally forced his way onto the roster for a full season and was among our better forwards as an 18 year old. How in the hell is he ranked so low, that's insane.

Pronman likes 'em big.

 

[HOOats]

Benson was so good he literally forced his way onto the roster for a full season and was among our better forwards as an 18 year old. How in the hell is he ranked so low, that's insane.

Sabre fatigue isn't just present on this board. Everyone is underrating our guys this summer because "well if it hasn't worked in 13 years, why would it work now herr derr derr." We'll see...

Pronman likes 'em big.

It's so funny because iirc 5+ years ago, he liked 'em smol. Something must have flipped in his myopic "system."

 

[Zman5778]

Pronman likes 'em big.

I'm not even sure that Pronman knows what he likes anymore.

Just look at his evaluation of Power.

Power was a big minutes player for Buffalo last season and put up good offensive numbers despite playing on the same team as Rasmus Dahlin. Power is a super intelligent defenseman. He sees the ice and has the skills of a 5-foot-10 defenseman while being 6-6. He can hit seams at a high rate and has the hands, patience and vision to run a power play and create off the blue line. Power is quite mobile for a big man, and although he's not that physical, he projects to shut down top forwards due to that reach and mobility. He has the potential to be a premier matchup defenseman who can provide decent offense, although he may never be an elite scorer.

Yet, ranks his puck skills as "NHL Average".....and says what he says. I also hate the whole "Power is mobile for a big man".....no, he's mobile PERIOD.


And with Benson -- Pronman rates him ABOVE AVERAGE in puck skills, hockey sense, shot and HIGH-END for compete......and ranks him 62nd.

He's so inconsistent within himself.

 

[sabremike]

Pronman likes 'em big.

I mean he's not wrong:

 

[DANOZ28]

hey guys not sure where to post, do you have a list of prospects with the invite tryout players? the reason i ask is i was traveling and in line next to me was a young man ryan with a hockey bag that said #33 buffalo sabres. just like to know more / anything about him. thx in adv.

 

[Zman5778]

hey guys not sure where to post, do you have a list of prospects with the invite tryout players? the reason i ask is i was traveling and in line next to me was a young man ryan with a hockey bag that said #33 buffalo sabres. just like to know more / anything about him. thx in adv.

That isn't an invite tryout player.

You just had a brush with #33 of the Buffalo Sabres....Ryan Johnson. He'll likely be competing for our 3rd pairing LHD spot and if he doesn't get it, he'll be ticketed as the #1 Dman in Rochester.

SUPER smooth skater who makes sound decisions and is solid positionally.