GDT: GDT #14 New York Islanders @ Ottawa Senators | November 7th | 7:00 PM | F/W 4-2
- Thread starter PK Cronin
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Rehabguy
In ROY I trust
- Oct 2, 2011
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Barzal’s not the problem. The problem was that the rest of the team needed to pick up their game rather than being spectators waiting for Barzal to do something. Take Barzal out of the equation and the rest of the team realizes they can actually contribute in scoring goals. The beginning of the season it looked like only Barzal’s line was producing when they were winning games. So every team just focused on his line while the rest of the team just moped about. Forced to actually play offense with Barzal out they had to produce. The team is on a little high right now scoring a few goals here and there but make no mistake about it, without Barzal here for the long term the team’s offensive threat is pretty sad. Hope they learn something from this. You win games by driving to the net and shooting. And yes Barzal needs to recognize this too.
Barzal out the rest of the team was forced to wake the hell up!
Barzal out the rest of the team was forced to wake the hell up!
No, it's that this team needs to not be a perimeter team and needs to be aggressive crashing the net.
Trying to get it done with just finesse is not gonna cut it with players that have a hard time finishing...
leeroggy
Registered User
- Jan 3, 2010
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It also opens up the possibility of a hockey trade, not a futures trade. What would this team look like (and it's not about whether NTC's or reality is making this possible) if this happened?
Barzal, Cizikas and a prospect for Boeser and Garland? All forwards, but a very different chemistry and more scoring depth. It's salary cap neutral.
Lee - Horvat - Boeser
Tsyp - Nelson - Palms
Duclair - Pageau - Garland
Holmstrom - Maclean - Wally/etc.
Again, don't take this completely literally as a possibility, it's about how a hockey trade could look.
Osakahaus
Chillin' on Fuji
- May 28, 2021
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which is very bad
HOWEVER
I think this opens up the door to trade Barzal. Yeah the guy who is pro-barzy is also open for trading him.
Frankly Barzal never fit the roster he was surrounded by. Round peg in a square hole. People around here always bristled at anyone who would say Barzal wasn't a good fit here because the Isles never had much in the way of high end skill players. Barzal's unique skills still haven't translated to enough team or individual success. Certainly not at the price Lou paid him.
Do you remember when Steve Phillips called Alex Rodriguez a 1 and 24 player?
What the Isles get in return in a trade of Mat Barzal could solve several of the team's problems.
Rehabguy
In ROY I trust
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So having Barzal in the line up is a liability. Is that the new take?
Quite possibly our top points getter and a pivotal player come any playoff season when this team had some success in the playoffs and we want to trade the guy.
You want to know why we never have any good players? Because we frigging trade them!
Leddy, Eberle, Toews, now you want to trade Barzal?
What the F is wrong with everybody?
An unleashed Barzal gets 80 points last season +30 points playing hockey the right way and we want to let him go? The problem for Barzal was the systems he was required to play under the past 6 years not his ability. Under Roy him and the rest of the team will be fine performing up to their full potential.
Quite possibly our top points getter and a pivotal player come any playoff season when this team had some success in the playoffs and we want to trade the guy.
You want to know why we never have any good players? Because we frigging trade them!
Leddy, Eberle, Toews, now you want to trade Barzal?
What the F is wrong with everybody?
An unleashed Barzal gets 80 points last season +30 points playing hockey the right way and we want to let him go? The problem for Barzal was the systems he was required to play under the past 6 years not his ability. Under Roy him and the rest of the team will be fine performing up to their full potential.
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Tahoeblue
Registered User
Absolutely agree with your lines. I would like Wally with Barzal and Duclair on line 3 and ride it for a while. While all 3 players have flaws, teams do have to defend them and game plan for a team that has some serious depth. That should create favorable match ups. Lastly, I would prefer Foudy on the 4th line with Cizikas and Fasching shot to the moon.
Rehabguy
In ROY I trust
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Understood. Trading comparable output for comparable output is never a bad idea but is it necessary? Barzal is one of a kind.
Rehabguy
In ROY I trust
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Agree. With Lee and Pageau finding their game alongside Horvat I would also continue with that line. Give Wally more time on that 4th line. Duclair + Barzy is about a sure a scoring threat as anything out there. Could be our top line as well. Would love to see Tsyplakov take Horvat's place on the line with Barzal centering. If he can play the other wing.
leeroggy
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So was Lafontaine, the best comparable in style to Mat. That trade worked out very well.
Buffalo Sabres acquire | Date | New York Islanders acquire | ||
| October 25, 1991 |
Don't get me wrong, I love Mat as much as anyone. Just being realistic about the possibilities. And no, it isn't necessary.
Throttle
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- Sep 22, 2020
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Barzal and the TEAM achieved more under Barry’s systems, when Barzal was just of one of the forwards.
They made the playoffs under Lambert only after they acquired Horvat and Barzal missed the rest of the season. Maybe look up their record without Barzal in the lineup.
And back to current day, the team had a wonky start, then, all of a sudden Barzal is removed from the lineup the team plays against the same crappy opponents (except one) and the net result is WAY different.
That’s called a pattern.
So, it’s either when Barzal is out of then lineup the team wakes up or the team plays a simpler, more effective game, which leads to better results.
Rehabguy
In ROY I trust
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This is called cutting off one's nose to spite one's face. This is exactly the situation this expression describes.
And THIS is called player hugging and not being able to see the forest for the trees.
IT’S NOT BARZY, IT’S EVERYBODY ELSE!!!
Team sports doesn’t work this way.
crashthenet
Registered User
The style of play is much different and Horvat more dominant 5v5 without him. Small sample but impossible not to notice that JGP is playing his best hockey in two years and Lee looks like he did in the Carolina series. I wouldn't mess with this line or Nelson's line when he and Duclair are back.
The Isles came out ready to play last night. They had stretches where they struggled but I liked a lot of the game. Mayfield engaged physically early. Martin over Fasching all day. Even at this stage, he is a better hockey player. There is almost nothing Fasching can do offensively that makes up for his mediocre overall play. George skates very well. Hoping he can develop and these games are helping for sure. Support from the staff seems to be there. Hutton looks like a good 7th defenseman for us.
Czikas line has been consistently strong in the ozone working the puck low. We'll see if that continues.
Duclair- Barzal - MacLean so he can take faceoffs and do the responsibly defense thing.
Zeke-Holmstrom -Engvall is working just fine.
Now fix the PP up seafoam.
Rehabguy
In ROY I trust
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Patterns? You want to talk about patterns. How about blown 3rd period leads. How about sitting back on 1 goal leads only to end up with games in the loss column whilst Barzal is shackled and a shell of his former self. That's the pattern I remember before Roy took over.
When this team is healthy they have shown they can put on an exciting game to watch that is just as defensively responsible as the previous defensive minded systems.
Yes the team has to wake up. But HOW THE HELL IS THAT BARZAL'S FAULT?
Under Roy the team plays a better "team" game. I shudder to think how this team would have done playing with 4 defensemen a game or their entire L defense replaced by AHL players. Under the old system with our D collapsing around Sorokin this team would be losing by double digits. The best defense is keeping the puck out of the defensive zone and the only way to do that is to play offense. Roy knows this, baldy not so much.
This team plays better under Roy. We should have had him 6 years ago. My god what a lost opportunity. The problem was not Barzal. It was the systems he was playing under that hurt his game. I thought we resolved this myth last year?
Rehabguy
In ROY I trust
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Eh? Team sports then is indeed about one player?
You are essentially saying the opposite of what i'm saying, It's not everybody else, it's Barzy.
I'm all about team sports. That's why we win as a team and lose as a team. You never blame one player and only a fool would point fingers at their most talented forward.
The NBA is about one player. The NHL is about 20 players, and the Islanders even more because of their inability to supplement Barzal with the types of players you want. Our own constraints (salary cap, desirability to UFAs, a GM who keeps going for it rather than retooling) in a hard cap league will likely never get Barzal those type of players around him while he’s in his prime.
And I’m not blaming Barzal. Pointing out that he doesn’t fit and we shouldn’t try to force a fit isn’t blame. But you’re so super-sensitive about Barzal that it makes a conversation about him nearly impossible.
mm11
Registered User
as
the late great Mr Hand would say: Is everyone on Dope?
Rehabguy
In ROY I trust
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Oh c’mon I’m not in love with Barzal. I’m just sick of mentalities that defy common sense.
Barry territory is currently last place in the entire league. Pathetic. I wonder if they are playing the game the “right way”. I think the Preds need a new voice.
doublechili
For all intensive purposes, your nuts
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If the Lee-Horvat-JGP line continues doing well, then I think they should put Barzal at the 3C. It kind of makes more sense with the roster anyway. If you don't have elite forwards, then try to wear the other team down with three scoring lines.
It certainly seems like the new first line is playing well, so might as well keep them together. But to use their temporary three-game success against weak opponents to suggest the team is better without Barzal is bizarre. The Oilers have won a few games without McDavid, Kings without Doughty, and the Leafs without Matthews, I guess that means those teams are better without their best players too?
If there's a Barzal trade that makes the team better, who wouldn't be for it, but trying to force a trade because people think the team is better without him is a poor way to build a strong team.
Assuming the first line continues to find success, it makes sense to try Barzal centering Duclair as a line 3 to see how it works out.
If there's a Barzal trade that makes the team better, who wouldn't be for it, but trying to force a trade because people think the team is better without him is a poor way to build a strong team.
Assuming the first line continues to find success, it makes sense to try Barzal centering Duclair as a line 3 to see how it works out.
