GDT: GAME 74 | Senators @ Wild | We're Going Streaking Edition | Tue Apr 2 2024, 8PM | TSN5, RDS2

[Sens of Anarchy]

No doubt he'll be good, and they have a lot of depth on the backend in their pool, but I'm not really sold on them yet. They've go a long way to go imo and while their pool has good depth I don't see anything that takes them to another level.

That's a different question , than I jumped in on. I was only commenting on Slaf.
I have not studied them in depth.
From a high level; I think they have the makings of a pretty strong backend. Goaltending seems ok. They can and will continue to build out up front. Dach will help that as well. I think they are well managed and haven't wasted draft capital. They are not ready to go to another level now; Are they supposed to be?

	ROUND 1	2	3	4	5	6	7
2024	2	1	2	1	2	1	3
2025	2	2	3	2	1	1	1
2026	1	1	1	1	1	1	1

 

[Xspyrit]

We’re getting another draft this year and next. End of the day an nhl roster only holds so many players. I don’t see them becoming a powerhouse anytime soon. They don’t have a single player or prospect better than stu or Sanderson at the moment.

I am not saying we are hopeless, we have Stutzle, Sanderson, Tkachuk, Pinto, Greig, Kleven and maybe a few more young guys plus some valuables (young-ish) vets like Chabot, Batherson, Joseph... and Chychrun who is a valuable asset

We need to have a very strong draft, we haven't had one since 2020 and we just can't afford another meh one for a 4th straight year.

Habs rebuild is definitely going well, but Slaf is such an underwhelming 1OA. Suzuki is a gem, but I'd be surprised to see Slaf hit 20g next year. Prospects having a hot streak in garbage time isn't too impressive unless they're putting up insane numbers.

You're underrating Slafkovsky, the kid is breaking out

Since December 21st : 43 games, 13 goals, 34 points

Since January 25th : 27 games, 9 goals, 24 points

He turned 20 y/o a few days ago... and he's not all defense, he plays in all zones. He's going to be an impact player, he's basically their Brady and as of now, he's tracking to become better, at least defensively. If he puts near PPG next season, get ready to see polls comparing the two on the main boards and Slafkovsky winning them handily.

Habs did something the Sens never did once in the entirety of their 7 year rebuild, and that's trade for a young cost controlled player with upside in Newhook, or solid vet signed like Matheson, and that's for a small price. He's a ~50 point guy this year, signed for a small price for the next few years, and looks quite good in a top 6 role at 22, and Matheson is a very solid top 4 D signed for another 4 years (when acquired) at 4.8.

Not once did the Sens add a young guy like that to come up with the team. Duclair could be considered, but he was let go.

Not once did the Sens trade their plethora of picks for a young player with term or RFA years. It's honestly quite absurd for an 8 year rebuild.

And instead of spending AAV/salary on players like Stepan, Gudbranson, Tierney, Zaitsev, etc, you wish we could have pulled off a Monahan or something like that.

This is what they got from taking on Monahan short term cap dump :

2025 1st round pick (CGY) ---> TBD
2024 1st round pick (WPG)
2027 3rd round pick (WPG) [Conditional if WPG wins the 2024 Cup]


I think the difference between their rebuild and ours is asset management. They didn't start with anywhere near the same assets capital as we did but here we are today. That's what happens when you have incompetent people managing your business for 7 years.

 

[Loach]

Picks and prospects are great. Not all of them will make it. Some will be very average to below average NHLers. Thats life.

I would trade Kubalik for a very average NHLer.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

I would trade Kubalik for a very average NHLer.

No team is giving you an average nhler for him tho lol

I am not saying we are hopeless, we have Stutzle, Sanderson, Tkachuk, Pinto, Greig, Kleven and maybe a few more young guys plus some valuables (young-ish) vets like Chabot, Batherson, Joseph... and Chychrun who is a valuable asset

We need to have a very strong draft, we haven't had one since 2020 and we just can't afford another meh one for a 4th straight year.



You're underrating Slafkovsky, the kid is breaking out

Since December 21st : 43 games, 13 goals, 34 points

Since January 25th : 27 games, 9 goals, 24 points

He turned 20 y/o a few days ago... and he's not all defense, he plays in all zones. He's going to be an impact player, he's basically their Brady and as of now, he's tracking to become better, at least defensively. If he puts near PPG next season, get ready to see polls comparing the two on the main boards and Slafkovsky winning them handily.



And instead of spending AAV/salary on players like Stepan, Gudbranson, Tierney, Zaitsev, etc, you wish we could have pulled off a Monahan or something like that.

This is what they got from taking on Monahan short term cap dump :

2025 1st round pick (CGY) ---> TBD
2024 1st round pick (WPG)
2027 3rd round pick (WPG) [Conditional if WPG wins the 2024 Cup]


I think the difference between their rebuild and ours is asset management. They didn't start with anywhere near the same assets capital as we did but here we are today. That's what happens when you have incompetent people managing your business for 7 years.

Well Dorion is and was atrocious. We know this. But I’m not drooling over them. They’re fine. And likely will be fine.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

The worst offseason this rebuild had was the murray stepan offseason

Dorion could have used the capital he had to get at least one decent young player in.

And also fired DJ for a decent coach.

Man a second for Murray. A second for stepan. Millions to dadanov. Gudbranson and josh brown brought it.

Like just a GHASTLY offseason

 

[JD1]

Habs did something the Sens never did once in the entirety of their 7 year rebuild, and that's trade for a young cost controlled player with upside in Newhook, or solid vet signed like Matheson, and that's for a small price. He's a ~50 point guy this year, signed for a small price for the next few years, and looks quite good in a top 6 role at 22, and Matheson is a very solid top 4 D signed for another 4 years (when acquired) at 4.8.

Not once did the Sens add a young guy like that to come up with the team. Duclair could be considered, but he was let go.

Not once did the Sens trade their plethora of picks for a young player with term or RFA years. It's honestly quite absurd for an 8 year rebuild.

Habs did something the Sens never once did in the entirety of their rebuild: they went about it without cash being the primary consideration in everything they did

 

[BondraTime]

Habs did something the Sens never once did in the entirety of their rebuild: they went about it without cash being the primary consideration in everything they did

Absolutely, that’s something that has an effect on the rebuild. But that wasn’t a costly deal, the player they brought in makes less than 3 million.

The Sens paid more money on Stepan, or Gudbranson, or Murray than the Habs did for that deal. They brought in a sub 3 million dollar player. The Sens did that a dozen times over the rebuild.

 

[JD1]

Absolutely, that’s something that has an effect on the rebuild. But that wasn’t a costly deal, the player they brought in makes less than 3 million.

The Sens paid more money on Stepan, or Gudbranson, or Murray than the Habs did for that deal. They brought in a sub 3 million dollar player. The Sens did that a dozen times over the rebuild.

Ya I understand that but it's kind of like the poor people that get screwed at the grocery store because they can't afford to buy whatever is on sale. If tuna is on for 1.50 a can, I'll buy 10 cans. The other day we bought 10 pounds of butter because it was on for 4.99.

In Ottawa's case, you're so tied up because of money, you can't really explore the art of the possible and you miss out on opportunities because you never stop thinking about everything from a financial perspective

 

[BondraTime]

Ya I understand that but it's kind of like the poor people that get screwed at the grocery store because they can't afford to buy whatever is on sale. If tuna is on for 1.50 a can, I'll buy 10 cans. The other day we bought 10 pounds of butter because it was on for 4.99.

In Ottawa's case, you're so tied up because of money, you can't really explore the art of the possible and you miss out on opportunities because you never stop thinking about everything from a financial perspective

I’d agree, and get the premise, but the Sens weren’t exactly saving money.

They handed a top 5 goalie contract out, signed Dadanov for 15+ million, brought in guys like the aforementioned Stepan amd Gudbranson at 3+ million, 4 million to Hainsey, traded high picks for guys like DBC making 9 million or Chychrun.

100% agreement they had the tax man in Melnyk looking over them, but it’s not like they never spent a ton of money during the rebuild that could have been used elsewhere. Costs were cut, money had a hand in decisions. No way getting around that.

But, Dorion was spending money on the roster, we just never made any wise moves with the money he spent.

 

[jbeck5]

They've sucked the other 95% too,

We have our key spots mostly locked up with quality young players, the fact is that we are really only looking for a top 4 RHD, goaltending and depth pieces.

We'll add a top 10 pick this year along with the Bruins 1st, we very well could trade Chychrun or Chabot if we secure a Top 4 RHD via free agency, which could very quickly turn around our prospect pool with minimal impact to the roster.

There's work to be done but it's not all doom and gloom, our issue isn't a lack of prospects, it's being locked into our current goalies, and some balancing of the roster, resolve that and hire a permanent coach and we'll be fine.

I agree that one of the biggest issues is being locked into our goaltending.

I also think our skaters are fairly average, very inconsistent, and not well rounded.

But here's the kicker. How do we go about improving our goaltending without making our team worse?

Another thing is who do we have replacing Giroux as he starts to decline from a first line winger in the next year or two?

Though it is mostly depth pieces, we do need to replace Tarasenko and then some in our top 9. We can't count on Norris. So there's 2 top in the top 9.

We also need to almost replace our 4th line. They aren't good enough.

We need 2 new RD, one of them being a top 4 guy.

And we need to do that while not removing more from our roster to fix our goaltending.

And we need a whole new coaching staff.

 

[bicboi64]

I’d agree, and get the premise, but the Sens weren’t exactly saving money.

They handed a top 5 goalie contract out, signed Dadanov for 15+ million, brought in guys like the aforementioned Stepan amd Gudbranson at 3+ million, 4 million to Hainsey, traded high picks for guys like DBC making 9 million or Chychrun.

100% agreement they had the tax man in Melnyk looking over them, but it’s not like they never spent a ton of money during the rebuild that could have been used elsewhere. Costs were cut, money had a hand in decisions. No way getting around that.

But, Dorion was spending money on the roster, we just never made any wise moves with the money he spent.

This is my main issue with discourse around Dorion had limitations due to Melnyk.

Melnyk was cheap af, but let PD spend money on Murray, Gudbranson, Stepan, Dadanov, JBrown, Rielly, 5 years of Zaitsev etc...

We didn't have the most money, but what we did have, PD pissed away

 

[JD1]

I’d agree, and get the premise, but the Sens weren’t exactly saving money.

They handed a top 5 goalie contract out, signed Dadanov for 15+ million, brought in guys like the aforementioned Stepan amd Gudbranson at 3+ million, 4 million to Hainsey, traded high picks for guys like DBC making 9 million or Chychrun.

100% agreement they had the tax man in Melnyk looking over them, but it’s not like they never spent a ton of money during the rebuild that could have been used elsewhere. Costs were cut, money had a hand in decisions. No way getting around that.

But, Dorion was spending money on the roster, we just never made any wise moves with the money he spent.

Dorion wasn't exactly insulated by a strong hockey ops department that could have helped him spend that money more wisely. Why? Money. Too cheap to run the thing properly

Anyway, the Melnyk Dorion regime is done. We have some key pieces. Let's hope we can fill in the blanks quickly

I agree that one of the biggest issues is being locked into our goaltending.

I also think our skaters are fairly average, very inconsistent, and not well rounded.

But here's the kicker. How do we go about improving our goaltending without making our team worse?

Another thing is who do we have replacing Giroux as he starts to decline from a first line winger in the next year or two?

Though it is mostly depth pieces, we do need to replace Tarasenko and then some in our top 9. We can't count on Norris. So there's 2 top in the top 9.

We also need to almost replace our 4th line. They aren't good enough.

We need 2 new RD, one of them being a top 4 guy.

And we need to do that while not removing more from our roster to fix our goaltending.

And we need a whole new coaching staff.

The Giroux situation likely takes care of itself if you're spending money.

 

[Micklebot]

I agree that one of the biggest issues is being locked into our goaltending.

I also think our skaters are fairly average, very inconsistent, and not well rounded.

But here's the kicker. How do we go about improving our goaltending without making our team worse?

Another thing is who do we have replacing Giroux as he starts to decline from a first line winger in the next year or two?

Though it is mostly depth pieces, we do need to replace Tarasenko and then some in our top 9. We can't count on Norris. So there's 2 top in the top 9.

We also need to almost replace our 4th line. They aren't good enough.

We need 2 new RD, one of them being a top 4 guy.

And we need to do that while not removing more from our roster to fix our goaltending.

And we need a whole new coaching staff.

Well, when the time comes, replacing Giroux comes with 6 mil in cap space to make it happen.

improving the goaltending will be a challenge, I think Chychrun could be the piece to move to make it happen, it would be amazing to send Chych and Forberg for Ulmark or Saros, for example.

We essentially replaced Tarasenko with Pinto, though now Norris is out. And Greig will presumably continue to develop. I think we need more of a Joseph than a tank tbh, that's a piece that should be easier to find (hoping Ostapchuk can become that but unlikely that happens by next year)

I don't think we need two RD, if we pick up a DeMelo or equivalent we pretty good, JBD has been pretty solid down the stretch and is still developing, imo he's good as a 6 and can play in short stunts up the lineup, but adding a bottom pair D isn't typically too difficult to do.

Our 4th line has been great since Kachouk joined, Kelly has really blossomed under Martin imo, and Kastelic seems to have found his footing between those two. MacEwen is a decent 13/14,

The team needs a shakeup to balance the lines, it doesn't need a complete overhaul imo. A defensive minded RHD that can kill penalties makes a word of difference to the balance of the vackend. An energy 3rd liner that can play a shutdown role would be nice to have, and a goalie will go a long way, obviously. We had players that had to play outside their role, Kubalik is useless when not on a scoring line, Tarasenko was good but redundant when what we really needed was someone to get hard on the forcheck, Brannstrom only looks good when one of Chabot or Chychrun is out and he can play in the top four. I think Kleven will be a much better fit, though they seem alright as a pair in a pinch. If we had replacements that better suited the roles we need to fit, it will make a big difference.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

This is my main issue with discourse around Dorion had limitations due to Melnyk.

Melnyk was cheap af, but let PD spend money on Murray, Gudbranson, Stepan, Dadanov, JBrown, Rielly, 5 years of Zaitsev etc...

We didn't have the most money, but what we did have, PD pissed away

Dorion legit thought those players could play. Thats the scary part

I think eh though they were “solid defensively” and would help the young offensive players. And they were all to a man f***ing horrific.

That year we could have been half ass

 

[JungleBeat]

Dorion has been making stupid decisions since 2016. All time terrible GM.

MTL has overtaken us with their rebuild. The Sens need Macklin bad.

 

[SpezDispenser]

The worst offseason this rebuild had was the murray stepan offseason

Dorion could have used the capital he had to get at least one decent young player in.

And also fired DJ for a decent coach.

Man a second for Murray. A second for stepan. Millions to dadanov. Gudbranson and josh brown brought it.

Like just a GHASTLY offseason

f*** me, a 2nd for Stepan was so bad it actually physically hurts. No retention, no nothing. Here toilet, take a 2nd round pick.

Dorion has been making stupid decisions since 2016. All time terrible GM.

MTL has overtaken us with their rebuild. The Sens need Macklin bad.

Except they have no game breakers at all. Caufield maybe, Slaf maybe, but nothing too exciting going on there. We'll see how it shakes out

 

[bert]

Dorion wasn't exactly insulated by a strong hockey ops department that could have helped him spend that money more wisely. Why? Money. Too cheap to run the thing properly

Anyway, the Melnyk Dorion regime is done. We have some key pieces. Let's hope we can fill in the blanks quickly


The Giroux situation likely takes care of itself if you're spending money.

Money.... No insecurity yes. He couldnt work with anyone. He refused to do it. Hence the horrid results. Look what he did with Mcguire and the Manns. Had a skeleton staff and couldnt work with anyone.

f*** me, a 2nd for Stepan was so bad it actually physically hurts. No retention, no nothing. Here toilet, take a 2nd round pick.


Except they have no game breakers at all. Caufield maybe, Slaf maybe, but nothing too exciting going on there. We'll see how it shakes out

There is extreme denial in the sens/leafs fanbase's about Slaf. Or maybe its wishful thinking, I am not sure but this guy is a beast. Always projected as a beast and he is just scratching the surface of what he is capable of.

Suzuki is also really good, they have tons of prospects and they are getting another elite prospect this year. They have smart hockey minds and every competitive advantage outside of weather and taxes. Theyre gonna be good eventually.

 

[Wallet Inspector]

The worst offseason this rebuild had was the murray stepan offseason

Dorion could have used the capital he had to get at least one decent young player in.

And also fired DJ for a decent coach.

Man a second for Murray. A second for stepan. Millions to dadanov. Gudbranson and josh brown brought it.

Like just a GHASTLY offseason

Reminder that in the same season that Dorion traded two 2nds for Stepan and Murray, Colorado traded two 2nds for Devon Toews.

 

[SpezDispenser]

Money.... No insecurity yes. He couldnt work with anyone. He refused to do it. Hence the horrid results. Look what he did with Mcguire and the Manns. Had a skeleton staff and couldnt work with anyone.


There is extreme denial in the sens/leafs fanbase's about Slaf. Or maybe its wishful thinking, I am not sure but this guy is a beast. Always projected as a beast and he is just scratching the surface of what he is capable of.

Suzuki is also really good, they have tons of prospects and they are getting another elite prospect this year. They have smart hockey minds and every competitive advantage outside of weather and taxes. Theyre gonna be good eventually.

They have good prospects, but again, no game breakers. Maybe Slaf, maybe not

 

[bert]

They have good prospects, but again, no game breakers. Maybe Slaf, maybe not

Slaf is absolutely going to be a game breaker. He already almost is, he is playing in his 19 year old season. Big player longer development curve, its coming. Suzuki is a legit first line elite level player too. They really arent far off of what Ottawa has and have a ton of prospect depth and resources.

 

[SpezDispenser]

Slaf is absolutely going to be a game breaker. He already almost is, he is playing in his 19 year old season. Big player longer development curve, its coming. Suzuki is a legit first line elite level player too. They really arent far off of what Ottawa has and have a ton of prospect depth and resources.

That's probably where you and I differ. I don't see a Sanderson, i don't see a Tkachuk, i don't see a Stutzle. I don't see it at all really. Maybe if all their prospects pan out perfectly they'll be something special, but I wouldn't count on it.

The good thing in Ottawa is the foundation is solid, we just need someone who doesn't suck to build it properly (as well as not toss picks out the window).

 

[bert]

That's probably where you and I differ. I don't see a Sanderson, i don't see a Tkachuk, i don't see a Stutzle. I don't see it at all really. Maybe if all their prospects pan out perfectly they'll be something special, but I wouldn't count on it.

The good thing in Ottawa is the foundation is solid, we just need someone who doesn't suck to build it properly (as well as not toss picks out the window).

Slafkovsky is pacing to similar 19 year old season as Tkachuk. Stutzle had a better year but I think he hits his peak alot faster than Slaf based on body type. So I think Slaf has a very elite package that is raw and the sky is the limit. Similar to Byfield.

Suzuki is having a better year than any Ottawa player right now and is the same age at Tkachuk. He is a very good player.

So I dunno I dont see a big different in that regard. Id probably take Stutzle and Tkachuk over those two players but there isnt nearly the difference I thought before going into this season.

They dont have a Sanderson, that I agree with but they have 5 other really good D men coming otherwise. Will be interesting to see Hutson and Reinbacher's potential to see where they get to.

 

[SpezDispenser]

Slafkovsky is pacing to similar 19 year old season as Tkachuk. Stutzle had a better year but I think he hits his peak alot faster than Slaf based on body type. So I think Slaf has a very elite package that is raw and the sky is the limit. Similar to Byfield.

Suzuki is having a better year than any Ottawa player right now and is the same age at Tkachuk. He is a very good player.

So I dunno I dont see a big different in that regard. Id probably take Stutzle and Tkachuk over those two players but there isnt nearly the difference I thought before going into this season.

They dont have a Sanderson, that I agree with but they have 5 other really good D men coming otherwise. Will be interesting to see Hutson and Reinbacher's potential to see where they get to.

There's a separation imo. Stutzle isn't done progressing either. He needs to do certain things to reach them, like make his core Alfie-like.

Ottawa has a prime player in Pinto and another excellent young player in Greig, not to mention a big bodied d man to go with sanderson, zub and one of chabot/Chychrun in Kleven.

We'll see how it all shakes out, but I still think there's a pretty big separation between the two teams, especially with, hopefully, a solid GM and a good coach coming in.

 

[Oscar The Grouch]

Slafkovsky is pacing to similar 19 year old season as Tkachuk. Stutzle had a better year but I think he hits his peak alot faster than Slaf based on body type. So I think Slaf has a very elite package that is raw and the sky is the limit. Similar to Byfield.

Suzuki is having a better year than any Ottawa player right now and is the same age at Tkachuk. He is a very good player.

So I dunno I dont see a big different in that regard. Id probably take Stutzle and Tkachuk over those two players but there isnt nearly the difference I thought before going into this season.

They dont have a Sanderson, that I agree with but they have 5 other really good D men coming otherwise. Will be interesting to see Hutson and Reinbacher's potential to see where they get to.

Don't forget that you'd take Josh Anderson over all of them

 

[Ice-Tray]

The games against us are like 5% of their season. Means nothing.


Hated rival? We haven't had an important game or hate filled game against them in years. I don't feel we have much of a rivalry with anyone. It's kind of hard to build rivalries when you always suck and miss the playoffs.

The fact we have no prospects ready to improve this team drastically while being 26th in the league is frightening. It should be a much bigger concern of yours. I don't know why anyone would brush this off.

Dude, that may mean nothing to you, and that’s cool, but to me? I tend to judge other teams by the way they play against my team, because that’s when I watch them.

I’m not going to be impressed by another team just because some fan of their teams comes in here and says they’re great. I think I speak for a lot of fans who don’t watch a ton of other teams play. Its not perfect, but it’s what you go on.

You may not hate them, and to be honest, judging by your posts about our team you don’t feel much but anger and disappointment so I’m not surprised. I personally hate the leafs, and the habs, and the red wings, and Buffalo. Always Anaheim, and then I generally dislike a ton of other teams. We don’t play meaningful games against Detroit either but we all hate them just the same.

I am absolutely not interested in hearing about how some dude likes the have better and thinks they are better on the Sens board. Could just me me though…

Thanks for worrying about my concerns, but we have some decent prospects that look to be able to fill bottom roles on the team, and no room for prospects up top at all for the moment so why would I be concerned? In fact the team is actively looking for veterans right now and we have another wack of good picks this year to add long term prospects.

We have one of the youngest rosters in the NHL, prospects isn’t a focus for me at all, regardless of how nice it is to have them. I could suggest that you do less worrying about the prospect pool and start paying attention to the young NHL roster in front of you.