GDT: GAME 13 | Zub Returns vs the Islanders | Thu Nov 7th 2024, 7PM | TSN5, RDSI

[Burrowsaurus]

And yet at this point in the season we have an identical record...we have "better" veterans, a "better" starting goalie, a "better" coach and coaching staff, a "better" defensive corps, a "better" GM, a "better" front office...so how the f*** do we have the same goddamn record we did last year after 13 games?

Our roster is supposed to be night and day from last year's, injury-laden, "improperly built" shitshow that had both goalies put in bottom 10 worst single-season goaltending performances in team history. Right? And yet we have the same f***ing record after 13 games...what does that tell you?

Well I have my answer. No one agrees. So I’ll stop beating that drum day after the game.

 

[Tuna99]

Isles fan here, I've seen this multiple times in here.

Pageau's cap hit is 5M per and his base salary is 4M this season and 3.5M next season.

Problem with losing to Pageau is you know Pageau won because he outworked you, at least that’s how it was when he was in Ottawa. So pretty hard to deny we just got beat by a team who played harder for longer all game

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Problem with losing to Pageau is you know Pageau won because he outworked you, at least that’s how it was when he was in Ottawa. So pretty hard to deny we just got beat by a team who played harder for longer all game

Where were they on the tkatchuk stutzle 2 on 1.

Chabot in along on goal TWICE.

Stutzle breakaway

Greig and Tkatchuk 2 on 1.

They didn’t work harder. The game was a boring stalemate. Their players found a way to beat our goalie more times than our players beat theirs. As this year has gone.

I

 

[Pierre from Orleans]

Yep He's under the impression that he's the main attraction. "The Sens are on the power play!" Woah, that's value added rink announcing right there.

"Senators goaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaal"

Pretty cringe.

 

[Blotto71]

I think this team looks nothing like DJs team. So much better. Last night was not some system issue or habits issue. Neither was the Montreal loss. Neither was the New Jersey loss or the Vegas loss or the rangers loloss.

Sloppy play/loss of focus cost them against Vegas. They looked unprepared against Montreal. By all accounts they were flat for much of the opening 50 minutes last night, and Buffalo was another example of not showing up ready. You don't think there are still some bad habits at work? The Rangers game they were great! The Utah game, versus the Blues, Florida, Tampa, Kings - not all the best games, but consistent effort and engagement. Losing is going to happen, but it's happening predominantly because they just don't show up prepared - that's going to take more than 13 games to correct.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Sloppy play/loss of focus cost them against Vegas. They looked unprepared against Montreal. By all accounts they were flat for much of the opening 50 minutes last night, and Buffalo was another example of not showing up ready. You don't think there are still some bad habits at work? The Rangers game they were great! The Utah game, versus the Blues, Florida, Tampa, Kings - not all the best games, but consistent effort and engagement. Losing is going to happen, but it's happening predominantly because they just don't show up prepared - that's going to take more than 13 games to correct.

No. If we have bad habits so does every other team. You think we scored on Vegas 5 times cuz they made no mistakes?
You think the rangers made no defensive errors? Those are some of the best teams in the league. They leaked chances to us.

in todays nhl the offense will always win out. Defense will give up chances.

Buffalo we had a bad game. Utah we bad game.

Last night we had a bad spell in the first. Islanders had some bad spells as well. They scored. We didn’t.

If our stars score on their chances before the islanders guess what? We’re talking about how we played hard and capitalized on chances.


Other than that? We’re laying good team hockey. Why would we be great defensively? How many teams in this league are actually great defensively?

What did they do wrong against the blues? The blues were not even present lol sens controlled.
Tampa the sens played great! Pro sports Is game where you’re playing another Uber competitive team. We went toe to toe. We made some mistakes they made some
mistakes. That reflects real life hockey.

Kings game?? We dominated. We gave them nearly nothing. Two of the worst goaltender performances we’ve ever seen In a single game from forsberg and Sogaard.

You’re expecting team play perfection which simply doesn’t exist.

You’d be impressed how many high danger chances we are giving up relative to the rest of the league. You want to somehow bring those numbers down even further??? How. Why.

Actually I think you’d be impressed by ALL our team stats.

Our finishing at 5v5 has not been good.

And our goaltending to start the year was not good either.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

Sanderson looks tired or hurt/playing through something. For a few games now he has been less than his usual brilliant self. I had mentioned a few games back not as clean. He is making more mistakes, he is not as strong on recoveries. Zub was pretty rusty last night.

Chabot and Jensen were our best pair again last night.

Every game vs the isles seems like a tough game for the Sens. That low slot area has been exposed a few times recently.. Worst place to leave someone open. Zub was a somewhat out of synch and to be expected. When the puck stays in our end we break down on reads and coverage.
Again last night we had the puck , couldn't exit and gave it away.. a few times the give aways were up the middle or in the middle of the ice.

We did outplay them most of the night .. but we broke down and they scored.. and we couldn't buy one ... We did come back to make it 3-2 and came close to tying it.

Sens have to respond to this play good enough to win but lose stuff and get some Ws.

 

[jbeck5]

I'm calling a spade a spade, there are games where we were actually really bad and deserve all the criticism, the game against Colorado for example, This game, not so much. We certainly could have been better, the first 10 were bad, and imo set the tone for all the criticisms we're seeing here, but the other 50 mins had a lot of strong play. Coach saw the same thing, talked about it in his post game. But reading this thread, you'd get a very different impression of the game. It's an emotional reaction rather than a rationale one.

I can agree it's emotional. It's also a matter of perspective too which plays a role.

 

[jbeck5]

Ok, so how is this leading to more offense, because that's your premise, we score more because of our lack of focus on Defense. It doesn't show up in any stats,

Usually it's a bad read, we don't play a strict man on man system, but again, that doesn't lead to more pts here, just goals against. so, the initial claim of 60pts here is 50 elsewhere is unsupported.



If we don't know how to do this, why are we 13th in HDCA/60 8th in FA/60 and 7th in xGA/60? Every team makes mistakes, we do make some catastrophic ones though, but a propensity for catastrophic mistakes while otherwise playing alright doesn't lead to the claim you made of we get more offense than we would in different environments.

What stat would even show that offense is up a bit and defense down a bit from skipping assignments?

Obviously leaving your man to be a pass option will help create offense, and if the puck is turned over, would leave their guy wide open for a good chance.

What stat would you even look to show this and why?

This is more of an eye test debate then a stat thing.

Stats show the end result, but don't exactly tell you why the team is achieving those stats.

 

[OttawaSenators11]

Sens are 4-2 with Pinto in the lineup hurry up and return lol

 

[Micklebot]

What stat would even show that offense is up a bit and defense down a bit from skipping assignments?

How bout we go about it this way, instead of you asking me to prove your unsubstantiated claim wrong, you actually show something, anything, that suggests it's true, because I've shown the stats that show we aren't a high offense team in the league. Beyond that, if you put us on a team that actually is creating more chances than average, you'd likely see an increase in pts, not the decrease you're suggesting.

Obviously leaving your man to be a pass option will help create offense, and if the puck is turned over, would leave their guy wide open for a good chance.

leaving your man to be a pass when we don't have possession (hence him being your man instead of you being his man) means the opposition can create more offense since you aren't defending. It might lead to a better chance if you gain possession and can stretch out their defense, but presumably that would show up in the teams overall numbers, both on the offense and defensive sides, but as I've shown, we aren't a high event team, there's no evidence that this is happening.

What stat would you even look to show this and why?

This is more of an eye test debate then a stat thing.

Stats show the end result, but don't exactly tell you why the team is achieving those stats.

No, it's not an eye test thing, it's a completely unsubstantiated claim thing, and when challenged on it, you just argue well actually there is no metric by which to test the hypothesis so it's by default correct. Doesn't work that way.



Here's some more evidence,

Last year, Tank put up 41pts in 57 with us, and 14 in 19 with the panthers, the exact same pace,

Joseph put up 35 in 72 last year and now has 4 in 9, the pretty much the same pace

Chychrun put up 41 in 82 games, now has 4 in 8, the exact same pace.

 

[Cosmix]

Because you're not looking at the right stats.

There are no stats that show if the reason that we allowed a shot on net was due to our player not knowing who to cover vs leaving his man early.

I visually see players covering their man, only to not be covering them a second later when they get the puck for a chance against.

Our players obviously knew to get their man initially, so why did they just leave their man? Almost every time I rewind to see why they left their man, it's because a puck on the boards or something looks like it gets loose so they get excited and stop focusing on staying on their man. Call it puck watching. Call it getting excited for offense. Either way, it seems to be the potential of the puck turning over that makes them forget about the man they were just covering.

We can all disagree on the reason they leave their man, and there are no stats that will give us the reason..I'm just giving my opinion based on often rewinding plays several times to dissect them that the most often reason seems to be the potential for a puck to get loose or go the other way causes them to forget about their man. Whether you call it puck watching or offensive excitement, it's basically the same thing.

We don't know how to stay square to our man and play the body and not allow them to get into a scoring area when there is chaos of the puck switching possession back and forth quickly. We seem to get confused of if we should be staying squared up or trying to get the puck up ice when there are scrambles. We don't take care of our own end first.

I see our players in our D zone watching the puck when they should be marking and watching their man. And like you, I see some of our players who are near their man not being properly positioned to check that man when a pass is made to them; they are late to respond.

The players are not playing right; the coaching staff does not seem to be teaching them how to play D in our own zone. I seldom see our coaching staff talking to the players about it when they come to the bench. Maybe they do talk about it during intermission or practice but the same mistakes continue to be made.

I don't want to hear anymore BS from the Head Coach like DJ Smith used to provide. I want to hear some truth from Green about the mistakes being made and naming the players who made them. There was too much coddling in the past.

We need a tough coach like Torts to whip this team into shape and play a better game without the puck in all 3 zones but particularly in our D zone.

 

[Gil Gunderson]

Hamonic playing over JBD on the road tomorrow, this shit is exausting.

 

[DrEasy]

Sanderson looks tired or hurt/playing through something. For a few games now he has been less than his usual brilliant self. I had mentioned a few games back not as clean. He is making more mistakes, he is not as strong on recoveries. Zub was pretty rusty last night.

Chabot and Jensen were our best pair again last night.

Every game vs the isles seems like a tough game for the Sens. That low slot area has been exposed a few times recently.. Worst place to leave someone open. Zub was a somewhat out of synch and to be expected. When the puck stays in our end we break down on reads and coverage.
Again last night we had the puck , couldn't exit and gave it away.. a few times the give aways were up the middle or in the middle of the ice.

We did outplay them most of the night .. but we broke down and they scored.. and we couldn't buy one ... We did come back to make it 3-2 and came close to tying it.

Sens have to respond to this play good enough to win but lose stuff and get some Ws.

Was happy to see that Chabot-Jensen were given a couple more minutes of ice time than Sanderson and Zub respectively.

Chabot-Jensen should be considered the top pairing until proven otherwise, maybe as soon as Zub shakes off the rust and Sanderson realizes he can trust this new-old partner. A bit of healthy competition between Chabot and Sanderson can only be a good thing.

 

[SensFanInMTL]

I know it's early but this season will end as poorly as it did in the 7 years before. Someone come and tell me I'm wrong. Because this is just poor at this point.