I googled him and I have zero recollection of this dude playing for us lol
Proposal: Free agency edition Trade Rumours/Proposals [MOD - Stay on Topic] 5
- Thread starter AchtzehnBaby
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HoweHullOrr
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- Oct 3, 2013
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I’ve been lurking in this thread for a bit without commenting, but I’m not sure a move like that (adding a $13 m forward) would work from a cap perspective if the cap ceiling is the currently projected $92.5 m.
There was a spreadsheet in here before that seemed pretty reasonable that illustrated that. It was at best a “maybe" if you assumed Grieg would get a pretty or significantly low RFA contract, newly added wingers came in at low, bargain prices and the Giroux contract was a $3.5 m cap hit. I’d guess the likelihood of all of those (3+) things happening is not high.
Marner or Rantanen...? Really? What world are you guys living in? I can't believe what I'm reading!
There is zero chance either of those players would even take a meeting with Staios to discuss playing in Ottawa. Let's be real here.
If we're going the UFA route, we'll be dipping our toes in the Palmieri/Nyquist/Mangiapane/Kerfoot pool, and even then, we'd likely need to overpay to get those players' attention.
That's the trouble with trading Norris for cap space. We won't be able to spend it effectively. We had to pay David Perron $4M to come here.
What would you rather? Josh Norris, even if overpaid, or two David Perron's?
If there's a hockey trade available, absolutely consider it. But to clear cap for UFAs? No way.
There is zero chance either of those players would even take a meeting with Staios to discuss playing in Ottawa. Let's be real here.
If we're going the UFA route, we'll be dipping our toes in the Palmieri/Nyquist/Mangiapane/Kerfoot pool, and even then, we'd likely need to overpay to get those players' attention.
That's the trouble with trading Norris for cap space. We won't be able to spend it effectively. We had to pay David Perron $4M to come here.
What would you rather? Josh Norris, even if overpaid, or two David Perron's?
If there's a hockey trade available, absolutely consider it. But to clear cap for UFAs? No way.
Golden_Jet
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- Sep 21, 2005
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He’s played in Russia, ECHL and the AHL last 2 years, and doesn’t play much,
might as well go with Leevi and Forsberg., unless the teams sees something we don’t.
frightenedinmatenum2
Registered User
My fake sources came in clutch again. I made the critically acclaimed Norris+Forsberg for Gibson+Dumoulin trade proposal yesterday. Just doing my job as an assistant captain of this subforum to keep the discussion rolling, and now Dumoulin is apparently available in real life.
Golden_Jet
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- Sep 21, 2005
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frightenedinmatenum2
Registered User
He has a lot of ties to Ottawa. He was part of the return Vegas got for Methot during the original expansion. Then he ended up in Ottawa and had one massive game here when all our goalies were hurt.
He is a tweener who is a good pro everywhere else but isn't an NHLer. Claiming him would be pointless because he likely gets reclaimed when we go to send him down. He is a solid AHL goalie to have but doesn't help us in the NHL.
Look, I just report what I fake hear. My dream is to one day work for HockeyBuzz.
Thanks. I appreciate the encyclopedic memories some of you have.
Either he LTIRetires or we move a pick with Perron. I rather move a pick with Perron first then see where our cap situation is then trade norris without another center coming back
BondraTime
Registered User
Perron really isn’t effecting the cap all that much, aside from not being that good. Moving him doesn’t open up salary cap opportunities for the team. He’s got a year left at 4 million, and he’d be replaced by a player making 2+ million at the absolute least, in all likelihood would be within 500k, and a pretty similar guy.
Moving a pick for a guy making 4 million for a season would be absolute buffoonery from the Sens.
If Perron can't play in the top 6 which I don't think he can then yes his 4mill can def be used to get a better player for the top 6
BondraTime
Registered User
He isn’t playing in the top 6, he’s playing in the bottom 6, with guys like Amadio (2.6) and Pinto (3.75) making similar money.
If you’re trying to get a guy for the top 6 with 4 million you’re going to be liking to sign guys like:
Viktor Arvidsson - 4aav 2 years 8 total -24gp 11p
David Perron - 4aav 2 years 8 total - 9gp 0p
Anthony Duclair - 3.5aav 4 years 14 total - 12gp 6p
Yakov Trenin - 3.5aav 4 years 14 total - 35gp 6p
Warren Foegel - 3.5aav 3 years 10.5 total - 38gp 23p
Jeff Skinner - 3aav 1 year 3 total - 38gp 14 points
Those are all the guys who changed teams through UFA from 3-4 million.
That’s really what you’re looking at getting for guys who are “top 6” possible players in the 3-4 million range during UFA. If you’re looking for a guy to ply in the top 6, you need to be fishing with more than 4 million.
And then you’re in cap trouble again immediately with very little change, which is why getting out of an 8 million dollar contract is incredibly valuable for the Sens.
The Devilish Buffoon
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- Dec 24, 2018
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Not sure how we would make the cap work but Macelli is an intriguing buy-low winger option. Dont think the asset cost would be high and I think he could play off of Stutzle or even Norris, so long as the other winger has some skill.
I'm sold, keep Norris. Can't risk a situation with two Perron's lol
Could be a good buy low candidate. He's a great playmaking winger who's having a bad year. I wonder what it would take considering they've been screwed by injuries on the back end and also need scoring.
I'd move Greig for him but Macelli is kinda small and I feel like Staios and co might want to go after a larger framed guy like Crouse who'd cost a lot more.
frightenedinmatenum2
Registered User
It is disingenuous to only point out the acquisitions that didn't work out as a way to argue that gaining cap flexibility is a bad move because Staios is a bad pro scout.
Who did we add this season with the cap flexibility that Staios gained by moving out Chychrun, Korpisalo, Joseph, etc?
Ullmark, Jensen, Amadio, Perron, Gregor, Gaudette, and Cousins. Is that a perfect pro scouting track record? No. But Ullmark was far and away our MVP prior to getting injured, Jensen has enabled Chabot to have his best season in years, Gaudette, Gregor, and Cousins have all been fine relative to their cap hits and expectations. Amadio is not playing at the level he did in Vegas, but it's also not a terrible signing.
The only disaster has been Perron. While I doubt that Perron would have lived up to that contract at his age, and I think there is a good chance the second year would have been difficult, his entire personal situation also should be accounted for when considering how much of a disaster this season has been.
When you consider the context of the situation, where Staios took over a team with very little to no assets and very little to no cap flexibility, he made a lot of positive moves this offseason. He was dealing from a position of extreme weakness and still found a way to significantly improve the team.
It's a small sample size with it being one offseason. But I think people need to take into account just how bungled the team was from Dorion getting an offseason where he was allowed to make further panic moves to try and save his job (multi-year offers to Korpisalo+Tarasenko, acquiring Chychrun at the previous TDL for a first and three seconds *one to dump Nikita Smith, etc).
The other factor is that if they move Norris and get back two David Perron type veterans that are unremarkable but fill roster spots, it's not just about what those two veterans bring for the next 1-3 seasons that they are signed. It's about the long-term cap flexibility that getting out of a massive 6 year contract for an injury prone player brings. So if it's something silly like two over the hill veterans who make us worse in the short term, saying we were better with Norris isn't the entire story of the trade (if it happens).
Who did we add this season with the cap flexibility that Staios gained by moving out Chychrun, Korpisalo, Joseph, etc?
Ullmark, Jensen, Amadio, Perron, Gregor, Gaudette, and Cousins. Is that a perfect pro scouting track record? No. But Ullmark was far and away our MVP prior to getting injured, Jensen has enabled Chabot to have his best season in years, Gaudette, Gregor, and Cousins have all been fine relative to their cap hits and expectations. Amadio is not playing at the level he did in Vegas, but it's also not a terrible signing.
The only disaster has been Perron. While I doubt that Perron would have lived up to that contract at his age, and I think there is a good chance the second year would have been difficult, his entire personal situation also should be accounted for when considering how much of a disaster this season has been.
When you consider the context of the situation, where Staios took over a team with very little to no assets and very little to no cap flexibility, he made a lot of positive moves this offseason. He was dealing from a position of extreme weakness and still found a way to significantly improve the team.
It's a small sample size with it being one offseason. But I think people need to take into account just how bungled the team was from Dorion getting an offseason where he was allowed to make further panic moves to try and save his job (multi-year offers to Korpisalo+Tarasenko, acquiring Chychrun at the previous TDL for a first and three seconds *one to dump Nikita Smith, etc).
The other factor is that if they move Norris and get back two David Perron type veterans that are unremarkable but fill roster spots, it's not just about what those two veterans bring for the next 1-3 seasons that they are signed. It's about the long-term cap flexibility that getting out of a massive 6 year contract for an injury prone player brings. So if it's something silly like two over the hill veterans who make us worse in the short term, saying we were better with Norris isn't the entire story of the trade (if it happens).
