Proposal: Free agency edition Trade Rumours/Proposals [MOD - Stay on Topic] 5

[aragorn]

You keep talking about savings but the money in and the money out are roughly the same.

I think they can get better for the two best players on the block.

They also got three players while losing two covering three positions, their goaltending got cheaper by a million bucks, their forwards got cheaper by a couple of million dollars which went towards the top 4 LD Chychrun. It's all perspective my friend.

 

[Nac Mac Feegle]

I definitely want to see Norris healthy again before thinking about trading him, especially at a loss.

Definitely. I have a bad feeling he's going to be very gun shy from now on with so much time off and surgeries and all that, but....dude is still a strong sniper. If that surgeon is legit and the kid is 100%, we'd be taking yet another massive loss on a young player. One we can't afford to do.

 

[Golden_Jet]

Is Arvidsson eligible for a performance bonus this offseason? Seems to me like he is.

Doubt he would choose to come here but I would love to add him as a middle 6 scorer on a low cap hit

No, performance bonus, is only for ELC or 35+ players.

 

[Micklebot]

No, performance bonus, is only for ELC or 35+ players.

there's a version available for players that missed significant time the prior season, see Connor Browns current deal with Edm

Here's the criteria from cap Friendly's faq

"The player has signed a one-year contract after returning from a long-term injury (has played 400 or more games, and spent 100 or more days on the Injured Reserve in the last year of their most recent contract)".

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

No, performance bonus, is only for ELC or 35+ players.

See Mickel’s post above

I believe Arvidsson was on IR from October 15 to Feb 15 (123 days). I think he went back on at some point, too.

 

[Golden_Jet]

there's a version available for players that missed significant time the prior season, see Connor Browns current deal with Edm

Here's the criteria from cap Friendly's faq

"The player has signed a one-year contract after returning from a long-term injury (has played 400 or more games, and spent 100 or more days on the Injured Reserve in the last year of their most recent contract)".

That’s true, didn’t realize he was injured last year.
Probably need some guys with more size than him, for a bottom 6 role.

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

Roll the dice and grab Spencer Knight from Florida.

That is not a bad idea for a team that either already has a strong starter or is earlier in a rebuild with room for failure.

We don't have a lot of cap space and we need a starting goalie. We aren't in a position to spend 4M or whatever on a reclamation project.

 

[Boud]

I think people underestimate how much parity there is in this league, so I rarely see playoffs as "impossible"


You mention needing to replace Tarasenko, we 25-31-3 with him and 12-9-1 after trading him. I'm not saying he wasn't a good player for us, but we clearly managed without him.

You mention Norris as a question mark, and while I agree that there is some question wrt his shoulder, what we do know is it wasn't right all season anyways, and our record after shutting him down for the season didn't really suffer

Goalies are certainly a question mark, though I'm skeptical that they could be worse (particularly if Staios addresses the position).

Batherson being hot an cold, sure? But it's not like he's the difference between good or not.

Giroux could slow down, but Stu could (and likely should) be better given he played the season with a wrist issue from game 4 that clearly impacted his shot. two seasons ago he was a 90 pts player, and he;s still developing.

I think having Pinto from game 1 will be huge. We paced at 90 pts from the day he returned. That's with Tank traded halfway through and Norris shut down for the final 25,

I think a good defensive minded RHD in Chychrun's place is a good starting point, if we can get a top goalie like Ulmark that would be great, if not, a middle six forward and top four RHD should make a massive improvement.

Just an example:

Tkachuk-Stutzle-Giroux
Greig-Pinto-Batherson
C.Smith-Norris-Joseph
Kelly-Kastelic-Ostapchuk

Sanderson-Zub
Chabot-Tanev
Kleven-JBD

Markstrom
Korpisalo

Extra: Hamonic, MacEwen

That's a cap compliant roster using UFA projected contracts from AFP Analytics. Pinto at 5.25, Smith at 1.1, Tanev at 4.5, Kelly at 1.25. Forsberg and Chychrun traded out to get Markstrom.


Alternatively, instead of trading for Markstrom, we could go after a UFA goalie like Stolarz, Samsonov or Ritich for somewhere around 2.5 mil, and with the extra 3.5 upgrade Smith to D.Joshua (3.25), and Tanev to Roy (5.8). Alternatively, keep Tanev and upgrade JBD to Hakanpaa (1.5)

Tkachuk-Stutzle-Giroux
Greig-Pinto-Batherson
D.Joshua-Norris-Joseph
Kelly-Kastelic-Ostapchuk

Sanderson-Zub
Chabot-Tanev
Kleven-Hakanpaa

Stolarz/Samsonov?
Korpisalo

Extra: Hamonic, MacEwen

I wish I was as optimistic to be honest with you. I just don't see it.

This team has been ending the year strong for 3 years in a row. I wouldn't use that as a prediction for anything. This team lacks leadership. They could not handle the pressure but when they are eliminated then they step on the gas.

Your argument goes in the sense that this team was better after we lost Tarasenko and Norris. Tarasenko was one of the most consistent players on this team in terms of production and effort level. It's undoubtable that the team is better with both Tarasenko and Norris in the lineup and a late season stretch doesn't change that.

I just don't see it. That's also assuming all these changes are made, which I don't expect. I certainly don't expect Tanev to sign here and a guy like Joshua either. This forward group has no depth and in general too many injury prone players (Chabot, Zub, Norris) and many injuries that come every year as we've seen with Batherson, Joseph, Sanderson, Pinto.

New system, new coach, new players. We've seen how that goes. It takes time to adapt and you're banking on us acquiring all the right pieces, no injuries coming into the equation and young guys like Greig/Kleven/Ostapchuk stepping in and owning their roles and the team quickly adapting to a new coach and teammates. I think it's just a lot to ask for and I don't believe it will play out the way you are assuming.

 

[Wallet Inspector]

Let's say we offer sheet Braden Schneider for 4.2 million(so we only give up a 2nd). Do you guys think the Rangers will match?

 

[Salva Mea]

Necas- bostons first and Jakob Chychun

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

Let's say we offer sheet Braden Schneider for 4.2 million(so we only give up a 2nd). Do you guys think the Rangers will match?

Pretty sure he's not eligible for one.

 

[Boud]

Necas- bostons first and Jakob Chychun

We don't have a lot of assets to trade and we need to acquire a top 4 RHD and a goalie. This would be addressing none of our needs.

Realistically Chychrun and that Boston 1rst are our best trade chips - and we don't and many others.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

3 Mistakes Made By Divisional Rivals The Canadiens Should Avoid

The Montreal Canadiens are at a crucial point in their rebuild, and they could learn from the mistakes of their rivals on what to avoid this summer. Between the Buffalo Sabres, Toronto Maple Leafs, Detroit Red Wings and Ottawa Senators and, up until recently, the Florida Panthers, the Atlantic...

montrealhockeynow.com

Lol They were kind. I guess they had to keep the article short

 

[Micklebot]

That’s true, didn’t realize he was injured last year.
Probably need some guys with more size than him, for a bottom 6 role.

Well he'd be a top 6 player... If we're looking for bottom 6 guys we can do that too.

I like the idea of Dakota Joshua as a middle 6 target.

I wish I was as optimistic to be honest with you. I just don't see it.

This team has been ending the year strong for 3 years in a row. I wouldn't use that as a prediction for anything. This team lacks leadership. They could not handle the pressure but when they are eliminated then they step on the gas.

Your argument goes in the sense that this team was better after we lost Tarasenko and Norris. Tarasenko was one of the most consistent players on this team in terms of production and effort level. It's undoubtable that the team is better with both Tarasenko and Norris in the lineup and a late season stretch doesn't change that.

I just don't see it. That's also assuming all these changes are made, which I don't expect. I certainly don't expect Tanev to sign here and a guy like Joshua either. This forward group has no depth and in general too many injury prone players (Chabot, Zub, Norris) and many injuries that come every year as we've seen with Batherson, Joseph, Sanderson, Pinto.

New system, new coach, new players. We've seen how that goes. It takes time to adapt and you're banking on us acquiring all the right pieces, no injuries coming into the equation and young guys like Greig/Kleven/Ostapchuk stepping in and owning their roles and the team quickly adapting to a new coach and teammates. I think it's just a lot to ask for and I don't believe it will play out the way you are assuming.

What we were doing with Norris and Tank in the lineup wasn't working, the mbers reflect that. We changed what we were doing, and despite losing both, did better. It's because the roster wasn't the biggest issue.

My point is worse rosters on paper are better than we were, the roster wasn't the primary deficiency. There's elements that need to be addressed to effectively play the way we need to, like a RHD, but there are also elements that are fine the way they are.

Teams do better than people expect every year, last year NJD wildly outperformed expectations, this season it was Vancouver who was expected to miss, only to win their division. The reality is small changes can have bigg impacts under the right conditions.

I don't think we are by any means guaranteed to make the playoffs, I just recognize that the difference between an 80 pt team and a 100 pts team is often as little as a mix of goaltending health and small tweaks, particularly with younger teams that are still gaining experience.

 

[Golden_Jet]

Well he'd be a top 6 player... If we're looking for bottom 6 guys we can do that too.

I like the idea of Dakota Joshua as a middle 6 target.

What we were doing with Norris and Tank in the lineup wasn't working, the mbers reflect that. We changed what we were doing, and despite losing both, did better. It's because the roster wasn't the biggest issue.

My point is worse rosters on paper are better than we were, the roster wasn't the primary deficiency. There's elements that need to be addressed to effectively play the way we need to, like a RHD, but there are also elements that are fine the way they are.

Teams do better than people expect every year, last year NJD wildly outperformed expectations, this season it was Vancouver who was expected to miss, only to win their division. The reality is small changes can have bigg impacts under the right conditions.

I don't think we are by any means guaranteed to make the playoffs, I just recognize that the difference between an 80 pt team and a 100 pts team is often as little as a mix of goaltending health and small tweaks, particularly with younger teams that are still gaining experience.

I think the Sens should concentrate on signing Pinto and a RD, then see what money is left.

 

[Micklebot]

I think the Sens should concentrate on signing Pinto and a RD, then see what money is left.

Oh, I agree, those are priorities 1 and 2. These are absolute must do.

A goalie is probably priority 3, and then a middle 6 winger, then a bottom pair D.

I don't think we'll have money for anything after the goalie, but we'll see I guess.

 

[Hale The Villain]

Literally none of those players have suited up for an NHL game.

This kind of thinking leads to teams like the sens.

You need someone who has proven he can score points and match up against other good players.

I’m not even sure Norris is that guy anymore but it would be crazy for SJ to turn their noses up at him because of prospects.

Celebrini and Smith are two of the best prospects in the game and are extremely likely to be above average centers.

Bystedt and Edstrom are both 1st round drafted prospects that are projecting well.

Even if Bystedt and Edstrom bust or are switched to the wing, why would they want to pay Norris almost 8M a year to play as their 3rd line center?

The Sharks have no reason to take on Norris' contract. They aren't trying to win now and are stacked long-term at his position.

This is just common sense. Shocking that people would think otherwise.

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

Oh, I agree, those are priorities 1 and 2. These are absolute must do.

A goalie is probably priority 3, and then a middle 6 winger, then a bottom pair D.

I don't think we'll have money for anything after the goalie, but we'll see I guess.

I agree, which is why Arvidsson is a potentially interesting option. 750k this year, 3.75m next year type of deal. Would depend on a lot of factors but I think it could be workable

 

[Micklebot]

I agree, which is why Arvidsson is a potentially interesting option. 750k this year, 3.75m next year type of deal. Would depend on a lot of factors but I think it could be workable

It just pushes to issue to next year since he'd likely get significant performance bonuses. I think Brown had something like 3 mil for playing 10 games.

I don't think this season is the one we want to create cap overage penalties in,

 

[aragorn]

I think the Sens should concentrate on signing Pinto and a RD, then see what money is left.

With my proposal for DeBrusk & Ullmark it filled two holes & paid for Pinto & because I also want Yakemchuk in this yr's draft he would be the future top 4 RD who could be here after next season since he is one of the older prospects in this yr's draft & he already has NHL size, speed & the offence.

 

[Blotto71]

San Jose already has too many centers (Celebrini, Smith, Bystedt and Edstrom) coming through the pipeline.

They wouldn't be a good fit for Norris.

Staois said Norris will be ready for training camp. Even with his cap hit we shouldn't give up on him yet.

Sorry, already have. He needs to move to LW to be effective with the Sens.
BT - Stu - Giroux
Norris - Pinto - Batherson
Joseph - Greig - xxx
Xxx - xxx - xxx

 

[Golden_Jet]

With my proposal for DeBrusk & Ullmark it filled two holes & paid for Pinto & because I also want Yakemchuk in this yr's draft he would be the future top 4 RD who could be here after next season since he is one of the older prospects in this yr's draft & he already has NHL size, speed & the offence.

Ya I think Yak is a good fit.

 

[Golden_Jet]

I don't think this season is the one we want to create cap overage penalties in,

Speaking of overages, I think Sandy earned 4 x 250k last year, in performance bonuses.

Don’t t think we had a million to cover that, but don’t see it listed as next years overage, but not sure if capfriendly shows overages though.

 

[Bileur]

Celebrini and Smith are two of the best prospects in the game and are extremely likely to be above average centers.

Bystedt and Edstrom are both 1st round drafted prospects that are projecting well.

Even if Bystedt and Edstrom bust or are switched to the wing, why would they want to pay Norris almost 8M a year to play as their 3rd line center?

The Sharks have no reason to take on Norris' contract. They aren't trying to win now and are stacked long-term at his position.

This is just common sense. Shocking that people would think otherwise.

I know who all these prospects are. That doesn’t guarantee individual or team success at the NHL level.

I also know sens fans made similar comments about their defensive prospect depth in 2010-2011 when they had Rundblad, the best defenseman outside the NHL, Cowen a top 10 pick who looked like a lock to be a top shutdown option and Wiercioch who looked like a decent two way top 4 guy.

I also know the sens, the team we both spend hours discussing on this message board, have faced significant difficulty in their rebuild relying only on young, unproven centres. It’s been a major talking point all year. Look no further than any pre/post game show with Jamie Baker and he talks about young centermen hurting the team.

Rebuilding teams can’t rely only on prospects. They need to mix in veterans. Like I said, I’m not sure Norris is the right guy, but arguing they shouldn’t be interested in someone who has proven to be a legit top 6 C because they have excellent centre prospects is a recipe for a 10 year rebuild.

Blows my mind someone who watches the sens of all teams doesn’t understand this.

 

[Micklebot]

San Jose already has too many centers (Celebrini, Smith, Bystedt and Edstrom) coming through the pipeline.

They wouldn't be a good fit for Norris.

I don't see SJ being interested in Norris, but we could have said something similar when we had L.Brown, C.White Chlapik and Dahlen.

Obviously Celebrini is on another level, but the point is beyond him I wouldn't count your chickens before they hatch.