Proposal: Free agency edition Trade Rumours/Proposals [MOD - Stay on Topic] 5

[Sens Vader]

Depends on how high we are on Rutger, but next years first may be worth the gamble

Like 1st top 8 protected + JBD for Rutger + Stanley

 

[h2]

I'm making an argument against this idea that a team like Ottawa is "done" building. That continuing to replenish the organization with high end talent isn't going to be important going forward.

The core of the group would be done since they're all early/mid 20s. You don't need 1st rounders to augment the holes around that anymore. See Toronto/Tampa and other cup contenders that rarely have 1st rounders. For us after adding McGroarty/Yakemchuk, the only areas that would need addressing is the occasional 2nd liner and the bottom six. Both are simple UFA fixes, or fixed by prospects that could come internally from any round (ie. Ostapchuk/Donovan/Halliday).

Between trading a 1st for McGroarty, and losing a 1st to the NHL for the Daddy fiasco, I think it's something a core like that could sustain. I'd actually be pumped with that core.

 

[Ouroboros]

Depends on how high we are on Rutger, but next years first may be worth the gamble

Like 1st top 8 protected + JBD for Rutger + Stanley

The Sens can't put any protection on the pick. If we finished bottom-8 and kept the pick, then we'd owe them the 2026 pick but that pick has to be forfeited to the league.

 

[Sens Vader]

The Sens can't put any protection on the pick. If we finished bottom-8 and kept the pick, then we'd owe them the 2026 pick but that pick has to be forfeited to the league.

Good point, I guess it could defer to 2027 but Jets probably won’t like that

 

[Relapsing]

The core of the group would be done since they're all early/mid 20s. You don't need 1st rounders to augment the holes around that anymore. See Toronto/Tampa and other cup contenders that rarely have 1st rounders. For us after adding McGroarty/Yakemchuk, the only areas that would need addressing is the occasional 2nd liner and the bottom six. Both are simple UFA fixes, or fixed by prospects that could come internally from any round (ie. Ostapchuk/Donovan/Halliday).

Between trading a 1st for McGroarty, and losing a 1st to the NHL for the Daddy fiasco, I think it's something a core like that could sustain. I'd actually be pumped with that core.

For the market we are, they are absolutely important. We should by now have a steady rotation of cost controlled, elc talent coming onto the team. Some of those players would eventually replace fringe core players. We quite simply do not ever benefit from the kinds of discounts players might take with other notable franchises. We rather have to overpay, which means we need to be more savvy with rotating cost controlled talent into the lineup.

There is a clear model for how this team should be managing talent.

Now, I'm not opposed to trading the first for rutger, but to blanket statement say this core doesn't need first round talent coming in on the regular serioualy undervalues the kind of moneyball hockey this franchise should be adhering to.

 

[aragorn]

I'm becoming more concerned about acquiring American players, if McGroarty doesn't want to play for Winn why would he want to play for Ott? We just went through the Pinto wants out crap & Tkachuk gossip, while I like the player a lot I'm just not sure whether he would stay here long term.

I'm guessing there will be interest from a US team which is where he probably would rather play. If a 1st & JBD would do it, I would probably take that deal & hope for the best. He might like playing with Tkachuk & Sanderson.

 

[Senator Stanley]

The core of the group would be done since they're all early/mid 20s. You don't need 1st rounders to augment the holes around that anymore. See Toronto/Tampa and other cup contenders that rarely have 1st rounders. For us after adding McGroarty/Yakemchuk, the only areas that would need addressing is the occasional 2nd liner and the bottom six. Both are simple UFA fixes, or fixed by prospects that could come internally from any round (ie. Ostapchuk/Donovan/Halliday).

Between trading a 1st for McGroarty, and losing a 1st to the NHL for the Daddy fiasco, I think it's something a core like that could easily sustain.

Right now, I would prefer to get back to a more normal, healthy cycle of drafting and developing. Yes, we could trade 2025 for a more ready prospect, but that means we're not drafting in the first round again until 2027. And at some point, the bill comes due.

But hey, I'm not as high on McGroarty as others seem to be, so there's that. If it were our 2nd+Jarventie (which I could see us offering, easily) or maybe our 2nd+Ostapchuk (I'm less convinced they offer Ostapchuk), it becomes a different story.

 

[h2]

For the market we are, they are absolutely important. We should by now have a steady rotation of cost controlled, elc talent coming onto the team. Some of those players would eventually replace fringe core players. We quite simply do not ever benefit from the kinds of discounts players might take with other notable franchises. We rather have to overpay, which means we need to be more savvy with rotating cost controlled talent into the lineup.

There is a clear model for how this team should be managing talent.

Now, I'm not opposed to trading the first for rutger, but to blanket statement say this core doesn't need first round talent coming in on the regular serioualy undervalues the kind of moneyball hockey this franchise should be adhering to.

I agree, but I still maintain that our current core with Yakemchuk + McGroarty should be able to get through the next two years without 1sts just fine, and looks like a contending core on top of that. After the two years of pain are over, go back to rotating cost controlled talent. The bulk of our core is locked in long-term. I really don't think the next two years would be a problem if we brought in McGroarty.

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

Greig for McGroarty makes sense if we think McGroarty can step in right away and be an impact player, and if they aren't going to take some soft package deal.

Greig is getting 3M+ next season and we have very little cap flexibility. McGroarty will be on his ELC for another 2 seasons after this one.

I highly doubt we would have to move Greig to get him. I could be wrong, but I think people are going to be shocked at how poor the return will be for him. College UFAs in there situations rarely get peak value. Philadelphia shopped Gauthier around at the draft prior to trading him and couldn't secure a top 10 pick. They got Drysdale back for him, but I don't think Drysdale was at the peak of his value with his injury issues and up and down first few seasons.

The fact that they didn't move him at the draft is telling. I think they end up with a solid B+ type prospect and a future 2nd. I don't think they end up with anything close to 13th overall in value. If it's just draft picks it will be two second round picks. Something like that.

 

[Agent Zub]

the guaranteed price to get him would probably be 1st + Ostapchuck.

and we should do it. easier to sign or draft a player like Ostapchuck.

Plus this team needs playmakers.

 

[aragorn]

I doubt they trade Ostapchuk he plays the game exactly the way they are teaching at development camp. I think there are a few others they could move instead like Jarventie, Petersson or JBD.

 

[Gil Gunderson]

Not sure if I would have rather found a way to re-sign Tank than Perron...

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

Watch him end up signing in Edmonton and finding a way to suck away McDrai's production

That team is so stacked at forward now he wouldn't have any hope of ever hitting the ice. He'd be about 14 or 15 on their depth chart after they cleaned up this offseason so far.

 

[h2]

I doubt they trade Ostapchuk he plays the game exactly the way they are teaching at development camp. I think there are a few others they could move instead like Jarventie, Petersson or JBD.

There's a reason why our fans are willing to trade those types of players and Winnipeg management knows why. Getting value like McGroarty for those guys is just wishful thinking.

 

[Sens Vader]

I’m not trading Ostapchuk, kid is exactly what we need in our bottom 6

 

[Senator Stanley]

Greig for McGroarty makes sense if we think McGroarty can step in right away and be an impact player, and if they aren't going to take some soft package deal.

Greig is getting 3M+ next season and we have very little cap flexibility. McGroarty will be on his ELC for another 2 seasons after this one.

I highly doubt we would have to move Greig to get him. I could be wrong, but I think people are going to be shocked at how poor the return will be for him. College UFAs in there situations rarely get peak value. Philadelphia shopped Gauthier around at the draft prior to trading him and couldn't secure a top 10 pick. They got Drysdale back for him, but I don't think Drysdale was at the peak of his value with his injury issues and up and down first few seasons.

The fact that they didn't move him at the draft is telling. I think they end up with a solid B+ type prospect and a future 2nd. I don't think they end up with anything close to 13th overall in value. If it's just draft picks it will be two second round picks. Something like that.

Gauthier is a better prospect than McGroarty and was traded at the peak of his value, post dominant WJC and before he'd publicly demanded a trade.

Adam Fox, coming off his junior season (so closer to UFA, and therefore with more leverage) as a Hobey Baker finalist might be closer to a comparable. He went for a second and conditional third that became a second based on Fox's games played (he played over 30 NHL games and it upgraded). Whether he was held in as high regard then as McGroarty is now, I'm not sure. He was a damn good prospect, though.

 

[h2]

Right now, I would prefer to get back to a more normal, healthy cycle of drafting and developing. Yes, we could trade 2025 for a more ready prospect, but that means we're not drafting in the first round again until 2027. And at some point, the bill comes due.

But hey, I'm not as high on McGroarty as others seem to be, so there's that. If it were our 2nd+Jarventie (which I could see us offering, easily) or maybe our 2nd+Ostapchuk (I'm less convinced they offer Ostapchuk), it becomes a different story.

Yeah, that's the thing. In regards to your first paragraph, I think inserting a more ready prospect of McGroarty's stature benefits our core more than waiting 4 years for next summer's pick to join the core.

If you're not high on McGroarty, then the whole thing is moot. I think very highly of the player. I'd also be very down for any of those proposals. I doubt Winnipeg would, but I'll take it if they went for it.

 

[DrEasy]

Guy Boucher's pet winger whose name I genuinely forget.

How dare you forget MVP Tom Pyatt?

 

[PlayOn]

Gauthier is a better prospect than McGroarty and was traded at the peak of his value, post dominant WJC and before he'd publicly demanded a trade.

Adam Fox, coming off his junior season (so closer to UFA, and therefore with more leverage) as a Hobey Baker finalist might be closer to a comparable. He went for a second and conditional third that became a second based on Fox's games played (he played over 30 NHL games and it upgraded). Whether he was held in as high regard then as McGroarty is now, I'm not sure. He was a damn good prospect, though.

Didn’t Fox only want to play for the Rangers though? As far as we know McGroarty just wants NHL minutes so there’s a wider range of teams that can trade for him, which should mean his value is higher than Fox’s would have been.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

Tarasenko to the Wings for not a lot more than Perron. Let the rage ensue!

 

[SensFactor]

To get McGroarty, we would need to send one of Greig or Ostapchuk IMO plus a pick. McGroarty, is highly valued and likely turns into a top 6 with good development.

Tarasenko to the Wings for not a lot more than Perron. Let the rage ensue!

Meh, wasnt impressed with his game especially with Florida in the playoffs

 

[Gil Gunderson]

Tarasenko to the Wings for not a lot more than Perron. Let the rage ensue!

Meh, probably close in value at this point. Perron's skating is an issue but he's much better defensively than Tarasenko.

 

[Senator Stanley]

Didn’t Fox only want to play for the Rangers though? As far as we know McGroarty just wants NHL minutes so there’s a wider range of teams that can trade for him, which should mean his value is higher than Fox’s would have been.

There's what their value as prospects was (i.e. who was a better player), absent everything else. That's one discussion.

Then there's their circumstances. Fox had more leverage because he could play out his final year of college and sign wherever he wanted. Going into his junior year, McGroarty isn't in that position yet. Of course, Fox was traded after his sophomore season for signability reasons, and then traded again after his junior year. So I'm sure teams have that in the back of their heads with McGroarty, too - will he sign with us even if we trade for him?

Winnipeg is in a tricky situation, because as more time passes McGroarty's leverage increases and his trade value likely goes down. So they're motivated to trade him sooner rather than later, but all the other teams also know that. It's a dynamic we've seen in Ottawa with our soon-to-be free agents. Generally, unless you're trading with Pierre Dorion, waiting only makes things worse.

To get McGroarty, we would need to send one of Greig or Ostapchuk IMO plus a pick. McGroarty, is highly valued and likely turns into a top 6 with good development.


Meh, wasnt impressed with his game especially with Florida in the playoffs

Those are very different assets.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

Meh, wasnt impressed with his game especially with Florida in the playoffs

Meh, probably close in value at this point. Perron's skating is an issue but he's much better defensively than Tarasenko.

Lol, deja vu. But I agree, he was okay on the run, but nothing special. I'm happy to with Perron.

 

[Relapsing]

I agree, but I still maintain that our current core with Yakemchuk + McGroarty should be able to get through the next two years without 1sts just fine, and looks like a contending core on top of that. After the two years of pain are over, go back to rotating cost controlled talent. The bulk of our core is locked in long-term. I really don't think the next two years would be a problem if we brought in McGroarty.

You're missing the part where we need to assume 1-3 years of development for that talent to come in. Missing the next 2 years leaves us with another gap in the rotation we would need to otherwise fill through trades