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GDT: Four Nations

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raideralex99 said:
Seriously I'm so sick of hearing about stats. I don't need stats to prove to me player A is better than player B ... my. eyes tell me. I can always tell which poster watched the game and who didn't just by their comments or if they are bias.
Here's a question if player A scores 30 goals but 25 of them are against bottom feeders and against good teams he disappears ... is that a good player or bad player?
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In the same sense that stats guys are sick of a few posters creating straw men about models - i am actually more of an eye test guy but am not so bullheaded to ignore stats

You cant blindly follow either side... i mean watching a game in person or on tv doesnt give us the full picture either...

To ignore the models ratings of what players are good together and whos actually making the pairings better seems bizarre. Its valuable...

Ignoring stats is how you get stuck with shot blockers like beaulieu...
 
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Jets 31 said:
I have been very surprised by the play in this tournament, thought the players would really try not to get injured. It's been good hockey to watch, waaaaaaaaaaay better than the allstar games. Now having said that if one of our Jets gets hurt i will be surper pissed that we lose one of our best players during this incredible Jets season we are having for this little tournament.
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The whole injury thing is one of the arguments for hosting these "tournaments" in September or the summer in case of the Olympics, If a player gets hurt in the summer or Sept, then it can still hurt your team , but the player has all season to recover, Better to have a player miss the start of the season VS during a playoff push or the playoffs, is the argument.
 
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BobTheSolarsystem said:
In the same sense that stats guys are sick of a few posters creating straw men about models - i am actually more of an eye test guy but am not so bullheaded to ignore stats

You cant blindly follow either side... i mean watching a game in person or on tv doesnt give us the full picture either...

To ignore the models ratings of what players are good together and whos actually making the pairings better seems bizarre. Its valuable...

Ignoring stats is how you get stuck with shot blockers like beaulieu...
Click to expand...
I understand that perfectly ... if you don't watch certain teams how do you known who is good?
You have to go by stats.
I would bet the smart GMs look at bad stats and scout that player ... if he is good but has unfavourable stats that's where you can lowball a dumb GM.
Did I let out Chevy's secret?:laugh:
 
raideralex99 said:
I agree the NTC/NMC is BS but I thought the Rangers proved how to get around it. Trouba was told you either accept the trade or you go on waivers.
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Yeah but that doesn't help the Canadian or smaller markets or the Jets... it just makes the player waive it for a smaller set of franchises probably in warmer or glitzier locations.

NTC/NMC were one thing when the cap was $70million but now these players are getting a $120million, NTC/NMCs are completely unacceptable when they are getting a life changing amount of money partly on the backs of Canaian/Smaller markets and the Canada tv deal. I really hope the owners put the screws to the players when it comes to trade protection come the next CBA.
 
raideralex99 said:
I understand that perfectly ... if you don't watch certain teams how do you known who is good?
You have to go by stats.
I would bet the smart GMs look at bad stats and scout that player ... if he is good but has unfavourable stats that's where you can lowball a dumb GM.
Did I let out Chevy's secret?:laugh:
Click to expand...
And conversely if you ignore stats and go with your gut/eye test... you end up with Seth Jones at 9m forever
 
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My workplace had a rally today in support of Team Canada...

1000008198.jpg
 
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BobTheSolarsystem said:
In the same sense that stats guys are sick of a few posters creating straw men about models - i am actually more of an eye test guy but am not so bullheaded to ignore stats

You cant blindly follow either side... i mean watching a game in person or on tv doesnt give us the full picture either...

To ignore the models ratings of what players are good together and whos actually making the pairings better seems bizarre. Its valuable...

Ignoring stats is how you get stuck with shot blockers like beaulieu...
Click to expand...

There's a flip side too though. I remind anyone out there to read the initial reaction of the Trouba trade and Pionk return, and these boards blew up in a negative way based on the advanced stats of Pionk with the Rangers. I think me and @Jet were the only 2 posters who talked about improvement in skating on the back end. Turns out the guy not only had good advanced stats the year after the trade but also was a key factor in Samberg's development, maybe even his signing.

And with that I guess it's been 11 years since the last meaningful Canada/U.S game at the pro level.

Should be a beauty.
 
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raideralex99 said:
Seriously I'm so sick of hearing about stats. I don't need stats to prove to me player A is better than player B ... my. eyes tell me. I can always tell which poster watched the game and who didn't just by their comments or if they are bias.
Here's a question if player A scores 30 goals but 25 of them are against bottom feeders and against good teams he disappears ... is that a good player or bad player?
Click to expand...
Good or bad, he's still the $6 million man.
 
raideralex99 said:
Seriously I'm so sick of hearing about stats. I don't need stats to prove to me player A is better than player B ... my. eyes tell me. I can always tell which poster watched the game and who didn't just by their comments or if they are bias.
Here's a question if player A scores 30 goals but 25 of them are against bottom feeders and against good teams he disappears ... is that a good player or bad player?
Click to expand...

"Seriously I'm so sick of hearing about [quantitative data]. I don't need [quantitative data] to prove to me player A is better than player B...my [own personal opinion] tells me."

This certainly explains a bit about where we are in the world today... :sarcasm:

As to your question...it's not very well defined (what's a bottom feeder? what's the expected/average ratio? what's a good or bad player?). I don't think it would really tell you anything valuable because goals are distributed pretty randomly and a single season of 30 goals is a tiny sample. Anything can happen in small samples...
 
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raideralex99 said:
I agree the NTC/NMC is BS but I thought the Rangers proved how to get around it. Trouba was told you either accept the trade or you go on waivers.
Click to expand...
This type of power move is not without risk. If the player calls your bluff, you either lose him for nothing on waivers or you lose most of his cap space which is now sunk in the minors.
 
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Hobble said:
If Trump attends the final game, I suggest we declare Binnington to be our Border Czar out of spite.
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Dammit, I was having a good day. You did not have to say the T word. Thanks a lot;)

PhilJets said:
HOLY SMOKE!!!

Am i so torn apart for this CANADA vs USA finals.

I want Helly to do so well here, but i want Canada to win also!

ARgggg!!!! :laugh:

if Helly losses and KC , will it demoralize them OR makes them more hungry to win the CUP.
Hopefully more hungry to win the cup this year...
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I'd like to see Helly let in 5. The fifth by Marchand in overtime in Boston.
 
surixon said:
Football tends to have various in season breaks for international play/champions league type stuff.

I don't really have much issue in some breaks to the season for this. But perhaps two week breaks is a bit much. Maybe have the world cup like Championsleague where you have 5 day off breaks and have a couple games resume the season and in another month another number of games. Have the final latest in the year.

As for the hockey, it's been really good and I've enjoyed it. Also the players have loved it unlike the Allstars game.
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Football is just way smarter though.

If you take the teams in the premier league for example they start their season in late august early September and play until May and they have 38 regular season games so one per week on average or kind of 4 to five times a month played mostly on the weekend. Then for the best teams they get to play champions league which they divide into the league phase, then the knock out phase. You play 8 league games then you move to the knockout phase where you might get another 9 games if you go to the final. This league plays from September to May as well and the games usually happen mid week. Then there is the league Cup that they use to call the FA Cup. That might give you another 5 to 8 matches.

Add everything up and on most seasons good teams might play 50-55 times.

The entire key about why they can juggle multiple competitions is they don’t whore themselves out to an 82 game regular season schedule like we do in Hockey.

Football is great because the Big clubs get a crack at winning three separate cups and they are all prestigious. Even the smaller clubs get to compete in for two cups.
 
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ps241 said:
Football is just way smarter though.

If you take the teams in the premier league for example they start their season in late august early September and play until May and they have 38 regular season games so one per week on average or kind of 4 to five times a month played mostly on the weekend. Then for the best teams they get to play champions league which they divide into the league phase, then the knock out phase. You play 8 league games then you move to the knockout phase where you might get another 9 games if you go to the final. This league plays from September to May as well and the games usually happen mid week. Then there is the league Cup that they use to call the FA Cup. That might give you another 5 to 8 matches.

Add everything up and on most seasons good teams might play 50-55 times.

The entire key about why they can juggle multiple competitions is they don’t whore themselves out to an 82 game regular season schedule like we do in Hockey.

Football is great because the Big clubs get a crack at winning three separate cups and they are all prestigious. Even the smaller clubs get to compete in for two cups.
Click to expand...
Interesting comment, just not sure it translates to the NA sports market.
 
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Well the main board thread has predictably turned into an American chest thumping cesspool.

These Americans. Do they realize how they sound? It makes sound petty and insecure.

Now I know why many of you avoid the main boards.
 
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