Confirmed with Link: Flames trade Pelletier + Kuzmenko + 2025 2nd, 2028 7th round picks to the Flyers for Frost + Farabee

[Zirakzigil]

Yeah, I wouldn't write anyone off until Xmas, even then is probably too soon... look how long it took Huberdeau to get his feet under him here and he had to change his game a lot to do it.

I keep banging this drum, but the amount of time it takes players to acclimate themselves to a new team is exactly why any deadline deal is a risk, and why so many deadline acquisitions feel underwhelming. You have to learn a new system, learn tendencies of new teammates, develop chemistry, and that doesn't even factor in off-ice distractions of moving to a new city, maybe even a new country.

This condensed schedule also does not help as there is little practice time to learn the new systems and practice with linemates.

Yep. Lack of practice time hurts a lot.

 

[Figgy44]

Farabee looks like a colossal disappointment. $5M? lol , looking like a low energy Walker Duehr so far

Looks like the pro scouting sucks again.

Nah, I think they saw the obvious too. But they also banked on whether they could figure him out, so they swapped him for Kuzmenko. Puckepedia is saying if he's bought out before 2026/2027 starts (at age 26), it's a 2/3 buyout plus the first two years (26/67 and 27/28) are immediate savings of $4 AAV with two years at 28/29 and 29/30 cap hits of $2 AAV. The risk is still tapered. Gamble on upside with outs like that, and the cost was a Kuzmenko swap... it makes sense, especially with the cap we're sitting on for the foreseeable future.

The risk is longer than Kuzmenko (don't forget the rumors of extending Kuzy), but it seems the cap hits concern is negligible if buyout. Like Huberdeau, I think the Flames give him a full off season and a full season to find his game. Worst case, they buy out the last season or swap to a team who would be happy for the way Farabee's buyout works vs some buyout proof contract they're sitting on.

The extra factor is that he's buddies with Frost and perhaps with new veteran leadership, he can just focus on re-finding his game. If anyone can help him through whether he's cooked or got more in the tank, Frost is that guy. I saw mentions of Neal in other threads, but he doesn't seem like he has an attitude (at least not an out of control one).

It's a calculated gamble. I understand it. I also understand the gamble might not work. But with how some of the trade environment has been lately, I understand why Connie decided to pull the trigger. We can take time evaluating Farabee a bit longer and even if Farabee project doesn't work out, having him around to try and get Frost acclimated faster/better (remember the paired development theory?) isn't a bad thing. Rumors I read were they were party buddies, liked in the room and their choice of "party" drug wasn't anything crazy. It's pretty boring stuff like beers and cannabis.

We still got a huge donation of hope from the Flyers in this trade (but I still miss Pelts). I'll always be gracious to Flyer fans for this deal vs laughing at the deal. We paid way below sticker price for the rumored value of the guys, but it's obvious we aren't running away with a bargain (hence why other teams were hesitant as well). But we will see if Farabee is a good buy and hold candidate, or if Philly got the best value out of a falling value asset. I personally am optimistic about Farabee. Frost already seems obvious he was always a great buy and hold candidate.

TBH, in asset terms, the same can be said about Farabee for Pelts and Kuzmenko about buy and hold vs falling asset. The only two that make sense in the traditional trading sense to most fans is Frost and the picks.

It's a funny trade that doesn't necessarily solve problems. It just reduces the potential severity of the type of problems both sides want to deal with, and I think both sides are happy with that. Sorta like an addition via subtraction, but not quite.

Still like the trade. I think both need a good 50 games with the Flames before you can judge them. Farabee has been snakebit. Doesnt help that Sharky has been poor since his injury either though. Zary has been pretty cautious since coming back too. Hopefully once Zary gets comfortable again that line takes off.

I understand what the others are saying. IMO 50 games is a ridiculous amount of games to acclimate for the typical team. HOWEVER, the Flames are in a situation where they can afford 50 GP+ for their evaluation and take that time to slowly try and let them find their game without excessive pressure. Kinda like the Lazar experiment, but not as expensive. Flyers want something new and swapped to assets with a typical 20-30 ish GP exit strategy. Worst case for both teams, the swap allows potential improvements to other roster players they have.

I get the criticisms. After a bit of time, it's not showing as an ideal trade with immediate dividends on both sides. However, I think both teams are in a situation where their problems are immediately lessened for the rest of the season. I think if the trade sucks, both teams aren't doing much worse in terms of problems than if they stuck with their guy. It's like swapping a stalled car project for a truck project. Vehicle still in the garage and not ready for the intentions of each acquiring party yet, but if it works out, the car/truck swap is better for both sides. Worse case, it's a negligible difference parting it out/salvage after the swap.

Both teams are happy.

Yeah, I wouldn't write anyone off until Xmas, even then is probably too soon... look how long it took Huberdeau to get his feet under him here and he had to change his game a lot to do it.

I keep banging this drum, but the amount of time it takes players to acclimate themselves to a new team is exactly why any deadline deal is a risk, and why so many deadline acquisitions feel underwhelming. You have to learn a new system, learn tendencies of new teammates, develop chemistry, and that doesn't even factor in off-ice distractions of moving to a new city, maybe even a new country.

This condensed schedule also does not help as there is little practice time to learn the new systems and practice with linemates.

Flyers wanted to pivot quickly, Flames didn't see any options on the market, so were OK taking on a project that needs time.

I also don't think it helps the two guys that the moment they arrived, we had an extended cold snap that flustered even the long term Calgarian. I was telling people I'd rather we had last year and a 1 week -40C week vs a 2+ week -25C+ week (mostly -30Cs). That type of weather is a hell of a shock.

I do trust our org has also set up a great system to help the guys acclimate (ie: Coronato driving them around in this crazy weather). If anyone can potentially find success in this type of scenario/project, it's the Flames. We're usually really good at this RFA stuff.

If the party stuff pops up. I think it's OK. Pretty sure these guys are chill. Just beers and cannabis after a long day sorta dudes. Nothing like Ruzicka type of concerns. Flames can afford to be patient with these guys. Flyers didn't want to. IMO it's good calculated gamble for both orgs and players too.

 

[DFF]

Yeah if you consider a high 2nd for Frost (Somewhat overpay) then it’s a 7th for Farabee

That’s about what he is worth based on what he is showing so far.

He needs to score 20 and be at least a solid 3rd liner to be worth that contract

 

[Flames Fanatic]

Farabee to me I'm reserving judgment until he's had a full offseason to rehab his injury/surgery. Some guys just don't bounce back fully during a mid season grind on those injuries.

5 million is going to be third liner money these days, and I'm reasonably confident he can get back to the 15 goal, 40 ish point territory he did for at least three years straight.