Final Fantasy VII REBIRTH - Part 2

[Shareefruck]

Classic Mode is a silly and poorly implemented afterthought thrown in there to appease purists (who likely wouldn't be satisfied by it either). Don't bother.
--
Long extensive video, but Maximilian Dood just went full cult-leader on rationalizing the game's controversial creative decisions.

Spoiler

I think he's in denial about a lot of it personally, but there are a few things in there that could pay off in a way that could mildly justify/pay off some of the things I didn't like about the game (though not fully-- the execution would still bad and the up-its-own-*ss-ness would still undermine more worthwhile themes).

For example, if the purpose of Roche's extra-ness is to

Spoiler

make an example of him and eventually pay off the cellular deterioration angle of Soldier in a really contrastingly bleak fashion,

I think that could be effective.

Also, lot of cool easter eggs discussed that I didn't pick up on (and not the ones you hear about ad nauseum).

 

[S E P H]

I would not advise on that. The battle system is amazing, don't go back to classic unless you really want boring and easy fights. If you are having a bit of trouble with the regular mode, classic is a good way to slow things down a bit so you can get a hang of things.

If I change it just to test it out and decided to go back does that screw up any trophies?

 

[The Crypto Guy]

If I change it just to test it out and decided to go back does that screw up any trophies?

I don't believe so.

 

[Papa Francouz]

So I am playing the game on normal, but I am thinking of changing it to classic mode? Would you lot advise towards this or not?

Also I am half-way in Chapter 4 and Jessie is becoming one of my favourite characters in any video game I've played.

Keep playing on Normal. The battle system might take a little getting used to, but it’s very rewarding when you get the hang of it. It’s one of the strongest aspects of Remake, in my opinion, despite its annoying minor flaws.

 

[Shareefruck]

Honestly, even if Normal turns out to be too hard for you, I would suggest switching to Easy before switching to Classic. There's pretty much no reason/benefit to playing Classic.

 

[WeaponOfChoice]

The Final Fantasy games are all independent of each other and take place in different worlds. The only thing I've head about this one is that the ending makes more sense if you've played the original FFVII, and is confusing if you haven't. If the game looks like it appeals to you, dive in. I haven't played the original and I'm a few hours into this new one and there haven't been anything that I feel like I'm missing out yet.

Thank you.

I'm worried I'm just falling for a good commercial.

 

[S E P H]

The visual aspects, memorable characters, and storyline is an easy 10 out of 10 for me no questions asked. This might be the best looking game I've ever played; that one cutscene where Cloud is reminiscing with the milky way right above is going to be my new background if I can find it. E: Also can't forget about that parachute scene too!

The responding system after you die is a rubbish -10 out of 10 though. I don't mind challenging games, but having to face four waves of enemies, die on third one, and start the entire sequence over is pretty shitty.

 

[Nizdizzle]

Thank you.
I'm worried I'm just falling for a good commercial.

Definitely play the demo first to see if you enjoy the gameplay.

**One man's opinion incoming**

I think a lot of the value of this game is nostalgia, from what I've played so far its pretty good, but definitely not a must-buy (from someone who didn't play the original). I'm enjoying it so far, but have no trouble putting it down.

 

[Ryuji Yamazaki]

Definitely play the demo first to see if you enjoy the gameplay.

**One man's opinion incoming**

I think a lot of the value of this game is nostalgia, from what I've played so far its pretty good, but definitely not a must-buy (from someone who didn't play the original). I'm enjoying it so far, but have no trouble putting it down.

I think that has a lot to do with it. I’d probably give the game a 9/10 rating.
The graphics, sound, story, music, etc. are all incredible.

The materia system seems more shallow in this one. I guess since it’s only a piece of the entire game.

I don’t like that the game is so linear. I don’t remember the original being that way but maybe it’s because I haven’t played it in so long.

If the combat didn’t have so many flaws, it would be almost perfect.

 

[Khelandros]

I think that has a lot to do with it. I’d probably give the game a 9/10 rating.
The graphics, sound, story, music, etc. are all incredible.

The materia system seems more shallow in this one. I guess since it’s only a piece of the entire game.

I don’t like that the game is so linear. I don’t remember the original being that way but maybe it’s because I haven’t played it in so long.

If the combat didn’t have so many flaws, it would be almost perfect.

Disc 1, until you leave Midgar and get to Kalm, is straight up linear. There is only 1 path to follow. At least in the remake they added alot to the city to make it seem a little more open, like running from one sector to the other and having all the side paths. In the original it was a total straight shot.

 

[Emperoreddy]

A huge huge appeal is the nostalgia. You have YouTubers just bursting into tears when Aerith does something as simple as tilt her head.

It can become easy to overlook or not be that bothered by minor or medium level flaws when you get so immersed in the nostlagia and fan service.

It is less linear then the original Midgar section of 7, but its still overall a linear experience compared to many other games in and outside the franchise

I cant give the story high marks. It was already behind the ball as this chunk of the story is weakest part of the original story. The most interesting stuff happens later, the things everyone remembers most about this game.

Then you have new additions that fall pretty flat, and some major changes towards the end that go straight into a Nomura theme park ride.

I think the only thing that is significantly changed, but actually works well is Wall Market.

 

[Shareefruck]

I feel pretty strongly that linearity should not remotely be a factor when it comes to determining whether or not something is good, IMO. Openness is just a flavor that may or may not be part of any given recipe. Its absence shouldn't be viewed as a fault (the same way that something completely trivial like "this game doesn't have a big plot twist/multiple endings!" shouldn't be viewed as a fault).

I agree that this part of the original is entirely linear and that its moments reach lower individual heights than things to come later on in the game (again, not because of its linearity), but I disagree that it's a relative weak point in the original story. I've always viewed it more as a pretty perfectly told, memorable/charming, and extremely traditional/classic and relatively "normal" feeling story arc that serves as a perfect setup/prologue used to launch into the more innovative and experimental part of the story (which I would argue is also less tight and economical/concise than the Midgar part-- they have very different strengths). As a framework, the Midgar part of the story still had the potential of being the skeleton of a flawless entry, IMO. But that really relied heavily on how effectively it transitions into setting up the main story, which the remake does an absolutely terrible job of (it's bar none the worst thing about it, in fact). Without that, it kind of just feels like generic "going on an adventure, encountering a rogue's gallery of allies and villains, overcoming them and learning a moral lesson" storytelling, which can be fun but is also pretty limited if that's the whole point of it.

The weakest part of the original story's narrative (I would probably even go as far as to say it's an outright flaw in an otherwise fantastic story) is the hunt for the Huge Materia, IMO. It's generally uninteresting filler material (outside of maybe the purpose of the rocket scene being necessary) whose only real function is to serve as a buffer between Cloud in Mideel and the payoff to that, which I think is the best part of the game. It involved tons of lame episodic mini-games/sequences (like the Submarine/Fort Condor battles, stopping the train with levers in Corel, and entering passcodes in the Rocket), and it didn't even totally make that much sense, because it felt like the protagonists were actively working against the only action that humanity could have taken towards saving the planet, out of this weird "It's not going to work anyways, so why bother trying" attitude. The weirdest moment in all of that was

Spoiler

taking the Huge Materia out of the rocket before the huge cut scene where everyone's hopes are crushed because it doesn't successfully destroy meteor, which, while that's a great scene, just leaves you going "Why the **** did we just do that in the first place and ruin any chance of it working? I don't give a crap about preserving Huge Materia for ourselves. We don't even get to use it for anything! (unless you jump through hoops to master everything)"

If they want to completely replace that entire subplot with something else, I'm all for it, personally. In fact, I hope they do, or just cut it out entirely. Hell, that could even be a decent place to slot in the optional side quests (like Wutai), which are much more interesting and essential.

 

[Warden of the North]

The Final Fantasy games are all independent of each other and take place in different worlds. The only thing I've head about this one is that the ending makes more sense if you've played the original FFVII, and is confusing if you haven't. If the game looks like it appeals to you, dive in. I haven't played the original and I'm a few hours into this new one and there haven't been anything that I feel like I'm missing out yet.

Most JRPG are confusing as hell

 

[Warden of the North]

A huge huge appeal is the nostalgia. You have YouTubers just bursting into tears when Aerith does something as simple as tilt her head.

It can become easy to overlook or not be that bothered by minor or medium level flaws when you get so immersed in the nostlagia and fan service.

It is less linear then the original Midgar section of 7, but its still overall a linear experience compared to many other games in and outside the franchise

I cant give the story high marks. It was already behind the ball as this chunk of the story is weakest part of the original story. The most interesting stuff happens later, the things everyone remembers most about this game.

Then you have new additions that fall pretty flat, and some major changes towards the end that go straight into a Nomura theme park ride.

I think the only thing that is significantly changed, but actually works well is Wall Market.

Not sure I really agree with that. Im literally replaying the original right now. It is extremely linear. The Midgar section took me 5 hours to complete, which is less then my memory had it at. I didnt find any more freedom in it then Remake provided.

 

[Shareefruck]

I think writing off the appeal as mostly nostalgia is inaccurate, because even people who have never played the game are having similar reactions to "even something as simple as Aerith tilting her head." I would attribute most of the massive mainstream appeal of this game to production values + uniformly attractive looking people with strong characterizations believably having cute interactions with each other (the clearest example of that being everything with Cloud and Aerith between the Church scene and the Corneo scene having a really strong sense of mood/chemistry-- I would argue that most people who LOVE the game do so on the strength of this section most of all). Similar appeal to romantic comedies or Waifu Animes in a way. If anything, the average Youtuber seems to skip straight past the strong themes/nostalgia/art direction and focus entirely on being amused by the characters and their thirstiness (and laughing at the more shockingly silly things).

Not sure I really agree with that. Im literally replaying the original right now. It is extremely linear. The Midgar section took me 5 hours to complete, which is less then my memory had it at. I didnt find any more freedom in it then Remake provided.

Might want to read that again. That's exactly what he said.

 

[Warden of the North]

I think writing off the appeal as mostly nostalgia is inaccurate, because even people who have never played the game are having similar reactions to "even something as simple as Aerith tilting her head." I would attribute most of the massive mainstream appeal of this game to production values + uniformly attractive looking people with strong characterizations believably having cute interactions with each other (the clearest example of that being everything with Cloud and Aerith between the Church scene and the Corneo scene having a really strong sense of mood/chemistry-- I would argue that most people who LOVE the game do so on the strength of this section most of all). Similar appeal to romantic comedies or Waifu Animes in a way. If anything, the average Youtuber seems to skip straight past the strong themes/nostalgia/art direction and focus entirely on being amused by the characters and their thirstiness (and laughing at the more shockingly silly things).

Might want to read that again. That's exactly what he said.

Youre right

My apologies @Emperoreddy

 

[Emperoreddy]

yeah that is true too. There is definitely just some general waifu appeal too on top of anime fun.

The characters are incredibly incredibly sweet. Even Barret is sweet in a bunch of scenes. The models absolutely give Advent Children a run for its money.

Tifa and Cloud are way more endearing here then in Advent Children (Cloud especially) and Aerith looks kind of dead eyed at the end of that movie where she has all her original spunk back in this game.

All the sugar hurts my teeth a bit though, but I am old and grumpy so what do I know.

 

[The Crypto Guy]

Just re-posting an old article, but the team was already working on the 2nd game back in Nov...

Final Fantasy VII Remake Part 2 ‘is already being worked on’ | VGC

 

[wingsnut19]

I've never played the original and I still think this is one of the best games I've played (I'm at chapter 14). It has its weaknesses, but every game does. So, I think this games merits go much further than just nostalgia.

 

[The Crypto Guy]

Middle of chapter 9...around 21 hours in. I don't want this to end..

 

[Shareefruck]

Here's a really long, knowledgable, non-reactionary and non-fanboy-gasming discussion of the game (really rare considering the honeymoon phase it's in) that I really appreciated, which perfectly expresses pretty much everything I despise about the remake (while still giving credit where it's due).

The point made in the timestamp in particular is the greatest, most important, and deal-breaking offense for me-- The remake is completely built around the absolute opposite thematic point of what the entire meaning of the original game was and betrays its premise, full-stop.

Spoiler

Above all else, the core spirit of the game should truly revolve around the notion of accepting fate and the fragile mortality of life, not defying it (the former is a mature, poignant, relatable and beautiful sentiment that everyone faces, whereas the latter is a completely moronic, childish, non-applicable, and nonsensical concept).

The game is probably very good as a standalone thing on the strength of everything leading up to the ending, but I think the ending is flaming hot garbage for this reason most of all.

 

[DJ Spinoza]

The original FF7 is on sale in the PSN store right now for 8 bucks, so I decided to pick it up and (eventually) play through it before I play the remake. One of my main hold ups is that I'm in a huge playthrough of Persona 5 Royal right now, so might want to give the turn base style a brief break, but I have a few other games I can get to first.

Might be a fun experiment to play the two games side by side.

 

[Commander Clueless]

With the complaints about the ending (no spoilers for me please), I'm just curious: Isn't this just part 1? Or did they scrap the episodic plan?

I figured there would be plenty more time for twists and turns once completed, but I haven't picked it up yet (only played the demo so far).

 

[DJ Spinoza]

Yeah, it's just part 1. I have no idea about spoilers, etc., so I have no clue how the ending of the Remake will impact the development of the rest of the episodes, but that's still the plan.

 

[Shareefruck]

With the complaints about the ending (no spoilers for me please), I'm just curious: Isn't this just part 1? Or did they scrap the episodic plan?

I figured there would be plenty more time for twists and turns once completed, but I haven't picked it up yet (only played the demo so far).

There will still be multiple games, yes. Any more of an answer to that specifically is probably a spoiler.

In general though, course-correcting an issue can be a tough ask, and even when it's done successfully, there's kind of no way around the fact that having to spend time dealing with the issue would still end up being an issue, and it still hurts the effectiveness of part 1 and creates mixed messaging either way.